Hybrid SUVs are actually a bad thing.

Well, I'm gonna have to slightly disagree there...I think that for the number of people who would consider hybrid cars but then buy the SUV hybrid instead, there would be at least 3-5 people who would buy the hybrid SUV but would have never previously considered a hybrid. At this stage of hybrid development, the number one goal should be creating broader appeal and a wider base of products.

There is also the fact that emissions are far far reduced...but for those that simply wish to curb oil usage, that's not very relevant.

 

Having to deal with medical HMO's every day, it has occured to me that there could be a "prior authorization" requirement before one would be allowed to buy an SUV.... But then again, no chance for that after all this is America.

 

They could ban SUVs like they did marijuana and machine guns in the 30s...create a tax that upon paying, gets you a stamp that you must show to posess the guns or marijuana. Don't actually make the stamp. Job done. :mrgreen:

 

educated consumers should know that a hybrid SUV could never get the same mpg as a hybrid small economy car like Prius, Civic. If a full size SUV or truck can get 20-30 mpg thats already a huge improvement for now IMO. Like other said, Hybrid SUV helps to increase the size of the market for hybrid technique.

 

I tend to side with Evan on this, but for my own personal requirements I'll never own an SUV - I can live without the extra cargo capacity, and won't have children to ever worry about, so for me personally, it would be wasteful ever to own one, unless of course it was necessitated by a new business (highly unlikely).

That being said, I think the key goal for hybrids shouldn't be fuel consumption - granted, that is a definate benefit where technology needs to be pushed - however I'd much rather see the push towards better emissions for all, especially SUVs, Semi trucks, and diesels.

I know Ford has "co-opted" the technology in their Escape with Toyota, but I'm greatly worried about their product succeeding. This could really be a big make-or-break for hybrids in the general public in the US. And Ford, with their less than reliable record comparitavely speaking, unveiling what is basically a first generation hybrid (with a 7 or 8 year old powertrain design which is sturdy) - I'm afraid that if this SUV fails to meet the needs in general, sure Toyota and others will continue to produce what they see fit, but I think it could possibly be a sign that the American auto manufacturers would avoid the technology at all costs then.

On the other hand, Ford should be proud, and I really hope the Escape is the biggest success they ever have - it would certainly help quell many of the pointless arguments against hybrids and could really push them into mainstream society in the US.

-m.

 

One of the benefits of the hybrid system is that it can make a smaller ICE feel like a larger one in terms of performance. If hybrid SUV sales can reduce the number of v8's on the road than that's a good thing.

The Prius and Civic hybrids make great little commuter cars and function nicely as light duty family cars but even with the generous cargo space you have to be careful hauling stuff due to the weight restrictions -- for the Prius it's 800 lbs total for people and cargo. Four healthy people in the car uses about 3/4 of the capacity and that's not allowing for the obesity of the average American. Plus there's the peace of mind of having 4WD or AWD and towing capacity.

I would drive an SUV as a primary car but I'm seriously considering a hybrid Highlander for a weekend/second vehicle. I also like the idea of being able to help out in the occasional snow emergency by offering rides to doctors and nurses to and from the local hospital.

 

Think about it this way: what if all cars and trucks were hybrids? I expect that most readers here would agree that that would be a good thing. So with that in mind I would say that a hybrid SUV is a step in the right direction.

I believe that when the price of gas gets high enough then most consumers will pay serious attention to MPG and many will decide to drive smaller, more fuel efficient, cars.

 

Another benefit I see of Hybrid SUVs is the 'education' possibilities for the drivers.

The likely buyer was already in the market for an SUV. Few people are going to say "Oh Cool, now I don't have to buy that Camry, I can get a bigger vehicle".

Until now, SUV drivers have accepted that they are going to get crappy mileage. Thus, they really don't drive efficiently, because they EXPECT their mileage to suck.

When they get in a Hybrid, the little moving bars showing the effects of their driving habits will have the same Pavlovian Effect on them that they do on many Prius drivers

They will try to increase mileage, and in learning the secrets of "Easy Does It", they will experience the same calming 'Prizak' effect that many of us have found.

The end result is that they will be more relaxed and considerate drivers.

Then, once they have the bug, maybe they'll go for a Prius next, for the full strength does of 'Prizak'

 

The Prius that I have on order is, in a sense, a compromise for me. I want an everyday vehicle that gets better mileage than the 21 MPG I get out of my minivan. And the environmentalist in me wants to reduce emissions as much as reasonably possible. BUT we still travel as a family and quite frankly the Prius isn't going to cut it for that. For that matter neither will the Ford Escape, since we would be able to fit everything in it either.

But since the ol' minivan ain't going to last forever, I'm getting a Prius for everyday use and will keep the minivan running as long as I can. (I shooting for a 1/4 million miles.)

What I was REALLY hoping would appear was a hybrid minivan. Hopefully someone will come out with one of those before mine dies of old age.

 

I never thought I would drive an SUV, but that was before I owned a house. We've had hatchbacks before, and there is no comparison to the amount of stuff that fits in my Infiniti FX35 that will not fit in my partner's Mazda3 5-door. Now that I've made the switch from 2 seater convertibles to an SUV, there's no going back. I am seriously considering the Toyota Highlander Hybrid when it comes out. I am also going to look at the Escape as soon as it arrives at my dealer.

 

I can't believe that no one has challenged this first statement yet. From everything I've read, the hybrid SUVs (at least the small ones like the Highlander) should get closer to 30 (EPA numbers). Even with real world driving, I still expect in the mid to high 20s. Granted, I'm relying on Toyota press, but with their sensitivity to public reaction to inflated claims, I tend to think that their numbers are in the right ballpark. According to Toyota's press, "...[the Highlander's] EPA estimated fuel economy ratings will be better than the 27.6 mpg average for compact sedans." How much better, they don't say, but one can guess it will be in the 30 +/- 2 ballpark. Given that real world driving for hybrids seems to run about 15% under EPA numbers (most people get in the mid-40s for the Prius), that still puts real world mileage closer to 25.

If you have a source for your 20 mpg number, I'd like to hear it. Keep in mind that it's also not just about the mileage, it's also about emissions. The Highlander will be one of the first SUVs to meet SULEV standards. That's a VERY GOOD THING in my book.

While I don't intend to get one, I understand that some people's needs might require one, and it's better than the alternative vehicles of this size. I agree that people who buy them just to commute back and forth to work are not acting responsibly, but if they truly NEED a larger vehicle (my sister-in-law has five kids), then I would support their purchase of a Highlander.

Like another poster suggested, they need to come out with a hybrid minivan to better meet some of these needs. A Toyota Sienna with HSD would be sweet!

 

I am also going to add my two cense. I want to see hybrids of all types. There are parts of this country where owing a pick up or a SUV is really a necessity. Look at Montana where my son lives now. Lots of dirt roads many inadequately graded, occasional small streams to ford. Ice and snow in the winter and people there work and hall stuff in their cars, and pull trailers. There are lots of places a compact can not go and things it can not do well. There hybrid SUVs and Pickups would be a good. Even places like Helena Montana are getting smog during inversions. What the use is the Big Sky when you can't see it.
Having said that many if not most people get a SUV for the wrong reason. It gives them a sense of power, because of the size. You see that in their aggressive "I'm bigger than you" driving style. They also have a very false sense of safety. More often than not this cars are being bought for psychological and emotional reasons.

 

hybrids

In general, I agree with Evan.

A true active hybid system in a car, suv, pickup truck, heck anything, is a real world improvement. The new Ford Escape has a combined average MPG of about 32; thats a huge improvement from 20 or roughly 60%. Just think if ALL vehicles sold tomorrow had an improved MPG of 60%.

Most people dont need suvs, pickups or even all those mini-vans, but if we're going to have them, let them be hybrids. And yes, if I lived in MT, I'd buy a Tundra Hybrid, no question about it. Having lived in MN there is no way I would go back without 4 wheel drive; hybrid ofcourse.

Hybrids for everybody!

 

Large Buick station wagons that seated 8, got lousy mileage and polluted a lot more than a Prius .

Can't disagree but the infrastructure isn't there in most places and would be horrendously expensive to retrofit. Look how long it is taking and how much it is costing to do the Big Dig in Boston. And that is just to shove the road underground. The problem is the public transportation needs to be there, and convenient for a majority of the population. Until it is, no one wants to fund it or suffer the years of construction. Chicken and egg. I, for instance, don't use the bus to get to work. I can drive it in 15 min AM and 20 PM, it would take close to an hour on the bus because of the route. And the bus service is limited. I get to work at 6 AM so I can leave at 2 and take my daughter to skating, ballet, whatever. The bus would not get me to work until 7 and NEVER get me to the school and back out to our destination (in fact doesn't even go near one of them) on time.

Back to the topic. I agree with your concern that those SUV drivers who now maybe feel a pang of guilt for driving mostly with only the driver will feel better about replacing their SUV with another that is hybrid. But if they have the energy consumption screen and learn to get the most out of it mpg wise, at least there will be a lot less pollution and a fair amount less oil used. I can replace my Odyssey with a Prius only because I am NOT in Evan's position any more. I no longer have to drag the portable crib and stroller everywhere. It is still a compromise and you can bet if they made a brand new '95 Odyssey with HSD that got 45 mpg avg, I'd jump right on it instead of a Prius.

 

I believe if you recheck that, you'll see that those are all figures for the gasoline engine Escape models.

The Hybrid is supposed to get 35-37 city, no highway figure released yet.

Another reason for the SUVs, or more to the point, 4WD: they're better for extensive winter mountain driving. I go skiing and snowshoeing a lot, and sure enjoyed having a 4WD to get up into Yosemite and other places that otherwise require chains.

I'd love to see a hybrid 4WD, whether it's an SUV or not.