Hybrids are done. Nobody cares anymore

couple this with indicators this summer is going to suck for gas prices.... already up about 60 cents since around xmas...

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(naterprius @ Apr 13 2006, 11:23 AM) [snapback]239146[/snapback]</div>

the Prius is really the only hybrid living up to sales expectations and it's sales are usually beyond expectations. I am not familiar with any other hybrids doing well in the marketplace. The big test will be the Camry hybrid, if it doesn't do well Ghosn could be right.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mystery Squid @ Apr 13 2006, 11:26 AM) [snapback]239147[/snapback]</div>

I knew I should have bought more exxon/mobil stock. Are they including ky jelly with every fillup this summer?

 

I'll just throw this into the discussion.

http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/04/hybrid_sales_in.html

As you have probably noticed, Nate, gas prices are surging here in CO. regular is now $2.70/gal. We're not even half way through april yet.

Here's another fun one.

http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/04/iea_raises_oil_.html

 

The problem with Hybrids is excluding the Prius and Insight, the cost/benefit story is not very good. Take it from me most car buyers are very cost conscious and are not going to spring for a fuel saving premium without dramatic, tangible results. I think if the hybrid tech was a 25-40% mpg improvement for 90% of the drivers at say $1000-$1500, all vehicles would be hybrids within two years.

 

I think the statement that it is too early too fully back the technology is complete hogwash. Price drops and progress on hybrid technology if they weren't built. What's holding hybrids back is FUD in the press, and ironically overhyping. We need to fully develop this technology NOW so that we can have it earlier and have better tools to combat accelerated climate change.

By that I mean the media overhyped hybrid technology - led people to believe that these were perpetual motion machines - and then when expectations did not meet their overblown reality the opposite occurs. Check out the latest articles on the 2009 Prius... they are really hyping the fuel economy figures.

But even if Camry hybrid sales don't meet expectations, we still have the MY 2009 Prius, and apparently Honda has plans to introduce a Fit hybrid purchasable for much cheaper than the hybrid systems in the Accord or Civic.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(malorn @ Apr 13 2006, 12:34 PM) [snapback]239153[/snapback]</div>

is this evidence you've gathered from your massive profits on the escalade? those people spring for a size premium with dramatic long term cost increase as a result...

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(galaxee @ Apr 13 2006, 11:40 AM) [snapback]239157[/snapback]</div>

the first consideration of escalade buyers is not fuel efficiency or cost. the same could be said of lexus buyers or mercedes buyers. To the vast majority of all vehicle purchasers cost over time is the number one factor in their decision. People will NOT pay an extra $3-4000 for a hybrid system which will improve their mpg by 5-15%.

 

Except that the difference is bigger than 5-15%.

 

I agree with Nate, though I'd add that the media trash is probably also due to a lot of stuff planted by GM. Yes, corporations (like government) plant news stories.

To malorn's comments I'd reply that the only reason other hybrids are not living up to sales expectations, is that they are just so way inferior to the Prius. If a rowboat costs 10% less than a schooner, most folks will buy the schooner. If there had been no Prius, I'd have bought an HCH. But between the two, there was no comparison.

However, a good used car will give you cheaper transportation per mile, and that will slow the adoption of any new car. Hybrid is coming. Sooner or later all cars will be hybrid, unless battery technology advances enough to give an EV acceptable range.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TonyPSchaefer @ Apr 13 2006, 11:49 AM) [snapback]239163[/snapback]</div>

People have many different tastes and priorities. If I was to buy a vehicle solely to save money on gas I would buy the Prius or the insight. I do not know of any other highbrids where the extra cost of the hybrid will be made up by savings in fuel consumption. The people buying suburbans, tahoes, expeditions, and sequioas have a need or want for space or size adn that need/want trumps the need for high mpg.

 

There's also a component of timing of money spent... In essence, you spend x thousand/s more for a hybrid, that money is gone in one shot, disappears, BUT every time you go to the pump, it's like repeated, re-inforced, instant gratification, every time.

 

Now how about the Accord hybrid which wasn't DESIGNED to for just saving money, but for getting the best performance in its line while saving a bit of cash at the pump... but not for replacing the cost of the performance-minded hybrid?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mirza @ Apr 13 2006, 11:53 AM) [snapback]239168[/snapback]</div>

Other than the prius and insight, the fact is that most drivers see a negligible mpg boost with a hybrid system. Even some Prius owners have been very dissatisfied with their mpg(the result of bad driving). The Highlander hybrid, Lexus hybrid, and the accord hybrids have all had less than glowing reviews(mpg).

 

Must be another slow day in the Chevy store.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 13 2006, 11:53 AM) [snapback]239169[/snapback]</div>

Daniel you are right on the money. If your main motivation is to increase mpg adn/or make an environmental statement why would you buy anything other than a Prius or insight. If you are in the market for an SUV and are looking a the Toyota Highlander mpg is probably pretty far down the list of motivators, especially when the real world mpg improvement is not likely to be very much with a hybrid. So the SUV customer decides to go with the traditional powerplant because the cost/benefit story is not very strong.

 

Care to respond to how hybrids other than the Prius/Insight are designed for performance as well? Here's a hint - those hybrids are also the top performing models of their respective lineups.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(malorn @ Apr 13 2006, 01:00 PM) [snapback]239178[/snapback]</div>

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(naterprius @ Apr 13 2006, 12:00 PM) [snapback]239179[/snapback]</div>

Nate I agree many Prius buyers could buy anything they want, they are interested in the mpg story and or the environmental story of the Prius. Most of the Prius owners I know fall into the same category as you, they are making a statement and/or trying to make a difference.

I know that many folks would never own an escalade and that is fine too.

My point is with the masses of car buyers. They have differing needs and wants and most of them will not spend an additional $3000-4000 on a hybrid system to improve their mileage 5-15%(excluding the Prius and the Insight). I think that fact is revealed in the dissappointing hybrid sales figures(excl Prius)