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Hydrogen Cars are here

Discussion in 'Other Cars' started by FL_Prius_Driver, Sep 27, 2007.

  1. FL_Prius_Driver

    FL_Prius_Driver Senior Member

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    The following site has a hydrogen car competition:

    http://www.iyfcc.com/

    I saw one team's effort and there is still hope for the US of A. (Not in production hydrogen vehicles, but in youth with some more brains than GM/Ford/Chysler leadership.)
     
  2. kingofgix

    kingofgix New Member

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    Thats nice and all, but I think hydrogen cars are a total distraction and solve nothing.
    Where does the H come from? Answer: right now, from natural gas.
    How much energy does it take to power a car using H? Answer: more than a car not using H.
    Whats the advantage. Answer: abolutely none.
    Why use H? Answer. Well, it might move air pollution from the city to the country, but other than that....
     
  3. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    There are 5 fuel cell Focuses in my area for the past 2 years.
     
  4. darelldd

    darelldd Prius is our Gas Guzzler

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FL_Prius_Driver @ Sep 27 2007, 05:21 PM) [snapback]518758[/snapback]</div>
    Yeah, I've got to agree with King here. I see H2 cars every day around here. I live about six miles from the CA Fuel Cell Partnership. We probably have the biggest percentage of H2 cars in the country right at my back door. But this sure doesn't spell hope for the US of A. H2 is in fact destroying some of our more promising technologies with all of its hype and oil industry supporters.
     
  5. Devil's Advocate

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    H2 may not be aas efficeint as other sources of fuel, but, if produced from renewable green sources (wind, solar, wave) it will be 100% eco-friendly. Except maybe for the acres of wind farms, wave farms and solar cells. But no CO2.

    So I don't by the efficiency complaint to H2, plus that only works with todays tech, I don't think H2 production will be so in-efficient in the near future.

    THe biggest thing is that H2 is the ONLY substance abundant enough to power the human races future needs. Barring a DRASTIC improvement in solar and batteries.
     
  6. FL_Prius_Driver

    FL_Prius_Driver Senior Member

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    Just to clarify a couple of points. A hydrogen car the size of a basketball is not a bad thing for engineering lessons, but full size Hydrogen Cars are a total waste of resources. (Hence the misleading title in the post to elicit a laugh upon seeing the size of the H-Car.) The other point was that the students working on these projects have the smarts to eventually realize the first point.....and some automakers do not.
     
  7. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Devil's Advocate @ Sep 27 2007, 07:10 PM) [snapback]518796[/snapback]</div>
    H2 is not only not abundant, but it does not exist in a natural state. H2 only exists when it is manufactured at a very large cost in energy. This energy will come from fossil fuels or from electricity produced by fossil fuels or solar or wind. And if it is produced from electricity, we might as well use that electricity directly.

    As for the limited capacity of batteries, H2 tanks are similarly limited.

    H2 is a boondoggle, invented for the sole purpose of distracting attention from electricity as a way of powering cars.

    And to demonstrate my point: I am driving an electric car today. How long before you can afford to drive an H2 car?
     
  8. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FL_Prius_Driver @ Sep 27 2007, 08:21 PM) [snapback]518758[/snapback]</div>
    Yea, and I saw the space shuttle several times. Doesn't mean I or anyone else can afford one. Come back & talk me into one when they get 'em under a half mil. Maybe another 10 years (which is what they promised 10 years ago, too)
     
  9. JackDodge

    JackDodge Gold Member

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    The positive outlook to hydrogen is that it stems from the cornucopian camp in the energy debate. That is, the hope that something will be developed to replace oil before it gets so expensive that it ruins the world as we know it. The cynical outlook is that they're stringing us along with a hope that fools the majority of people because it sounds plausible and 'well, they say that it'll be on dealer lots in a couple of years'. For whatever reason behind the Quixotic rhetoric, it's kind of like listening to someone reading a fairy tale to a four-year-old. That is, 'isn't that cute?'
     
  10. FL_Prius_Driver

    FL_Prius_Driver Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hill @ Oct 5 2007, 10:32 AM) [snapback]521715[/snapback]</div>
    I'm back to talk to you now since your requirements are met. I am absolutely sure you could buy any car, if not all the cars, in the competition for a half mil. (Methinks you need to read the post and actually go to the site. Hehe.)
     
  11. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JackDodge @ Oct 5 2007, 01:12 PM) [snapback]521906[/snapback]</div>
    I got into an argument with a person some time ago, in which I tried to explain that H2 is a carrier of energy, and not a source, as it must be produced, at an energy cost. This person simply pooh-poohed me, saying in a demeaning tone of voice: "Well, you can believe whatever you like." The person was quite convinced that H2 was a free, abundant source of energy, and once the cars were developed and marketed the fuel for them would be as cheap as the cost of delivery, with zero pollution.

    Never underestimate the gullibility or the stupidity of the American public.
     
  12. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(richbaker @ Oct 23 2007, 12:08 AM) [snapback]529185[/snapback]</div>
    eh? You're thinking FCX.. which is only available for lease and not to the general public.
     
  13. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FL_Prius_Driver @ Oct 5 2007, 05:19 PM) [snapback]521939[/snapback]</div>
    Actually, the manufacturers (which try to down play 'problems') tell the public they cost a million, as built, and the web site doesn't contradict that.