I hate to do this, but...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ozyran @ Jun 2 2007, 09:01 PM) [snapback]454211[/snapback]</div>

Just a guess: Toyota's hybrid technology is so much better than Honda's that Honda has decided it can't compete in hybrids.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ozyran @ Jun 2 2007, 09:01 PM) [snapback]454211[/snapback]</div>

Freedom doesn't have to involve consumption. Capitalism does. Capitalism requires that people consume ever-greater quantities of stuff so there will be a market for goods, because without a market, production declines, and if production declines, jobs disappear and people slide into poverty or (in the extreme) starvation.

Population grows. In a capitalist society, that growing population can survive only if there is a growing number of jobs. But the owners of industry will not hire people unless there is a market for the goods that those workers would produce. industrialization and automation increase the quantity of goods that each worker produces, but that reduces the ratio of workers:goods, so that, for the economy to remain healthy, each of those workers must consume ever-greater quantities of stuff.

The alternative would be for each worker to work fewer hours, thus producing less, and consuming less, but having more free time. But in a capitalist society a very small class of investor/owners controls production and owns the profits, so rather than allowing the workers to enjoy the benefits of increased productivity, they keep it for themselves, amassing obscene fortunes, and forcing the workers to continue to work the same or longer hours. The resultant over-production, as explained above, requires ever-greater consumption, until the raw materials or energy run out, and the whole thing collapses like a house of cards.

 

Before I decided to buy a Prius, I looked at several vehicles, the Honda hybrids among them. The salesman even told me he didn't think the Accord hybrid would be long in this world - the car just didn't deliver high enough mpg in comparison to the regular Accord to justify the extra money. And let's face it - most people (at least, around here) buy hybrids for the gas savings; they are not all that concerned about the environment.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TonyPSchaefer @ Jun 3 2007, 07:19 AM) [snapback]454340[/snapback]</div>

In addition to the ignorant people, and the stupid people, there aree (and I suspect this is the great majority) people who just don't care.

They may be fatalists: "Whatever god, or fate, wants to happen, will happen, no matter what we do." This is similar to those who say, "When it's your time to die you'll die, and nothing you can do can make it happen sooner, or postpone it."

They may be pessimists: "Nothing I can do will change the world."

They may be cynics: "I just hope the crisis doesn't come in my lifetime."

Or they may be so angry at the world, or so depressed, that they'd like to see the onset of a cataclysm because they are willing to suffer if it means others would suffer also.

But one way or another, I suspect the majority just does not care.

There was a satirical song with the refrain: "I believe my savior is coming in all haste, and everything we haven't used will then have gone to waste." Some people probably figure a collapse is inevitable, and as long as everyone around them is wasting and consuming, they just want to get as much as they can, and enjoy it while they can. "Apres moi, le deluge." Not ignorant, not stupid, just don't give a rat's nice person what happens to the world, especially if it happens after they themselves are gone.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Jun 3 2007, 09:44 AM) [snapback]454333[/snapback]</div>

Daniels right,

Face it Honda had it made with the extremely small "insight", but their civic hybrid is STILL just a civic..
ie. No added room ect. un-like the roomy Prius.. Honda would have been smarter to build a diffent platform like toyota did with the prius. The accord got bad reviews from the start again I believe honda half *ssed it in the compact & mid-sized car in keeping with that small car look and feel market that they are known for ..

You just wait, when gas prices start climbing you'll start to see the trend of cheaper SUVs & or unbelievable deals like "Free Gas for a Year". I see it on the news now the larger vehicle drivers, not just SUV owners but anyone with a gas guzzler will start to look for alternatives as they are starting to feel the pain in thier wallets...

 

AMEN!!!!!!!!!!! Global Warming is to the people you described just a farce. Doesn't matter that every credible scientist has agreed that we are causing it or making it worse, there thats for the skeptics. If they dont look at it as a farce then that means they cant do the things they want to or as much and NO WAY to that. It is funny though the same people refusing to see the writing on the wall are complaining the loudest about its symptoms and its main culprit's price...

Not to politicize this but what we need is a great leader that is willing to tell the American people that they are going to have to get off their lazy asses and work together to fix this. The alternative is horrendous for our kids so why they wouldn't I cant understand except they listen to Rush and company, problem here. Frankly I have not seen that leader in any of the 18 or so Presidential candidates, except the ones with no chance of victory which might be the point...

I am not innocent but I try my best and point it out to everybody that there are no dissenting credible scientists. But the answers I get lead me to believe that people have become so selfish that they dont care and / or cant allow themselves to believe it because of the consequences. I hope the next President is a Believer and if not well we are in a world of hurt...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Jun 3 2007, 07:51 PM) [snapback]454740[/snapback]</div>

 

This is a perfectly valid post, I feel, and I'm not surprised to see it on a forum dedicated to the Prius.

When I first seriously started looking into alternative fuels and began researching the topic, I had great hope that I'd find dedicated and driven companies that were spearheading technological advancement toward alternate, clean, and renewable forms of energy. Sadly however, it did not take long for me to realize there were very few. I also found that some smaller companies that were dedicated to the good cause, mysteriously ceased to exist. The truth is that many of the large organizations and companies that would have the power to make a large impact on the type of energy our cars require (companies like Toyota and Honda), and the politicians who have the power to make major legislative changes to our country's laws have been and continue to be influenced by other factors that prevent this from happening at any understandably urgent pace.

There are people and corporations (there is an Oil Industry) that stand to lose a lot of money should the world become less dependent on this type of nonrenewable energy. Unfortunately for everyone, this fossil fuel is being burned in ways that are destroying our planet and doing so at higher and higher rates, as more and more cars are on the road every day. These massive organizations that have so much at stake (whose pocketbooks we can never seem to fully satisfy) also have a lot of power and do not always support changes that would benefit the world as a whole if it means they must take a pay cut. Much of this is consistent with what everyone else has said regarding capitalism and how this form of capitalism just doesn't work any more.

As I learned more and more about this, naturally I wanted to change it all overnight and heal the world as quickly as possible. I decided I would write a letter. When I thought about what I would put in the letter, I considered my credibility as the writer and realized “I drive a turbo charged Subaru WRX that gets 20 mpg on premium gas, and I am demanding change in the world?†I stopped writing the letter.

Instead, I began the process that only lasted two weeks of trying to sell my car, which eventually ended in me trading the Subaru in for a Prius. You see, I know I am not alone when I say that the Prius has changed the way I look at energy consumption, or that owning the car itself is the result of such observation. Threads like this, and others, confirm that there are others out there who desperately want our planet to be a better place – a place our children, and their children, can enjoy just as we have.

I understand your distress (ozyran and others), when you see that Honda is pulling a hybrid from its production line, and that the best Scion can manage to do to “improve†it’s car is change the grill. Just as when GM recalled all of its electric cars and we haven’t seen them since, we can only wager educated guesses as to why cars and technology (that we know is out there) that can drastically improve our quality of life and longevity of this earth’s atmosphere, mysteriously fall off the mainstream radar.

This also begs the question, how have we been so easily convinced that hydrogen is unfeasible? They say our economy is too ingrained and dependent in oil; there are too many gas stations, and replacing them with hydrogen stations would be too much. How is it that we have the technology to send people into outer space, and we can construct thousands and thousands of Subway restaurants each year, but we cannot solidify the technology for a mainstream hydrogen car?

In addition to the Hope that is growing and spreading every day, I have found the following article useful in helping me deal with my frustrations. It is written from the perspective of a humanities teacher, and it is undeniably useful as far as giving some tangible courses of action that you and I can follow to help facilitate the change we wish to see.

"Be the Change You Wish to See in the World"

For students raised on the "apple pie" version of American history, it can sometimes be a demoralizing process to learn about many of our nation's flaws and mistakes, some of which are structurally embedded into our nation's institutions and processes and some of which were and are purposefully pursued by various people for ethically questionable reasons. Yet teaching and learning should never be a demoralizing process that leads students to apathetic resignation. My goal is to engage students in critical thinking processes about American history and culture. Armed with a sophisticated and complex understanding of our national heritage, it is my hope that they will become citizens who engage thoughtfully with others and with our national institutions and processes, instead of citizens who engage in knee-jerk reactions to political and cultural propaganda. I believe that this critical thinking process plays a major role in remedying, over time, many of the flaws and mistakes of our nation's past. Impatient for such change, however, many students want to know what other kinds of activities might accelerate this process. One such avenue must be the path of creative and innovative approaches to social and political dilemmas. Like previous generations of Americans, current generations of Americans must participate in the spirit of ingenuity that has contributed to many of our society's greatest assets. At the same time, there are seven relatively simple and everyday kinds of activities that can accelerate this process as well.

1. Speak Your Mind. It is no coincidence that the first protected freedom in the Bill of Rights is freedom of speech. Free and unregulated speech is an essential ingredient in a liberated society. It is the basis by which we can debate our national processes and values and generate ideas for improvement. One way for individuals to strengthen our national society is to engage in this process. Speak openly and unabashedly about issues that matter to you, engage in debate with others with whom you agree and disagree, and be open to new ideas and perspectives. You will often discover that people are more open to your ideas when you are also open to theirs. Finally, while many people look to the government and policy to create change, often it is equally, if not more effective, to create a change in people's attitudes, thereby influencing people to change their behaviors voluntarily, rather than through force of law.

2. Nourish your Mind. It has become a sad fact of American life that a majority of our nation's citizens nourish their minds in the same ways that they nourish their bodies—with junk. Most Americans feed their minds exclusively with the junk of television, a one-way, authoritarian medium that tends to ply our minds with 1) sensationalized content with almost no social or cultural value; 2) overly simplistic stories more fit for pre-teens than adults; 3) advertising that plays off of and generates self-doubt and low self-esteem as a way to sell products; 4) hyperbolic and factually inaccurate news journalism that generates hostility, fear, and distrust towards fellow American citizens and foreigners alike. This is not to say that all television programs are junk or that television does not have its values. However, for free speech to have any value, American citizens must diversify the way we nourish our minds. Seek out multiple and diverse sources of entertainment and information and engage with those sources in a critical and thoughtful way. Some suggestions: internet, documentary movies, books, political magazines, higher education journals, experienced or respected individuals who may have deeper insight into certain issues, and foreign movies and news sources (sometimes outsiders can see more clearly into the issues than we can ourselves). Engaging in this critical thinking process will help ensure that we keep our minds healthy and active and that we do not become mindless drones to an authoritative informational system that limits what information we receive and tells us how to think.

3. Think Global, Act Local. It may be a cliché, but there is a fundamental wisdom in a local approach to global problems. If outright revolution were the only way to achieve change, then societies would engage in very little change at all, because so few of us have the time or resources to participate in, much less formulate, large scale social movements. Instead, think about the issues that are important to you and seek out ways to impact those issues within your immediate community. Contact your local representatives, write letters to the editor, participate in community volunteer work, form community organizations. Think about your own strengths—what can you do within your particular field to generate positive change?

4. Exercise your Power as a Consumer. Because America is a capitalist society, Americans can generate change simply through their purchasing power as consumers. Spend your money conscientiously by supporting businesses and products that engage in business practices with which you agree and by snubbing businesses and products that engage in business practices with which you disagree. Encourage others to do the same. Reconsider your role as a consumer. Do you buy products on reflex and discover that you really didn't want them or that you throw them out within a short time? Think about what you buy and why you buy it (you may find that watching less television reduces your "desire" to shop or your "need" for certain products). Once you learn how to be a more conscientious consumer, you become empowered in at least two important ways: 1) you limit your tendency to sink into debt, which creates stress and anxiety; 2) you limit your need for money, which allows you more flexibility in choosing your career—in other words, you may be able to choose a job based on what you like to do without as much concern about your income, or you may be able to reduce your hours, freeing up time for other things that may be important to you (recreation, family, travel, etc.). Now, some will argue that spending is important for the economy—it generates jobs, etc. This is certainly true. However, if you are "stingier" and "smarter" with your spending power, you force the economy to react by creating better products and services, which is good not only for our nation, but for mankind.

5. Engage in the Political Process. While it may be tempting to view politics as hopelessly corrupt and to assume that individual citizens have no influence on the process, this pessimistic view is historically false. There are hundreds of historical examples where ordinary individuals or groups of individuals have influenced the course of American society in sometimes very radical ways. It may be true that some Americans may have more influence in the political process than others and that some politicians may be more beholden to special interests than to their demographic constituencies. However, Americans only strengthen these anti-democratic tendencies when they refuse to participate in the political process. The majority of our politicians are businessmen (and lawyers); this background is what enabled them to generate enough finances to become elected in the first place. So, while these figures may know how to generate profit, they could always use advice from the public relating to other issues about which they may know very little—such as education, the environment, scientific advancements, poverty, national security, and foreign policy/ diplomacy, among other areas. While most politicians may be unethically beholden to various special interest groups, many of them also deeply believe in leaving an important legacy to future generations of Americans. Locate those politicians (nation-wide) that care about the issues that you care about and propose your ideas (they are so used to complaints from citizens that contain no suggestions for improvement that they are more likely to listen to someone who offers proactive solutions). Likewise, a smart policy initiative in any field never hurts a politician's chance for re-election. Thus, you should also contact the representatives who work for you (local and state) and propose your ideas as well. If you do not hear back from your representatives in any substantive way (do not accept standardized form letters or e-mails), contact them a few more times, even schedule a face-to-face meeting (they have local offices). You may be surprised at the results. Finally, many Americans forget that they themselves can run for office. There are hundreds of positions from the local to national level where you can begin to get involved directly in the political process. If this idea interests you, talk to everyone you know about your ambitions. They will offer important suggestions and contacts to get you started. There are hundreds of books with suggestions and important legal information as well.

6. Personalize Foreign Policy. Given our nation's current and historical involvement in troubled foreign conflicts, many students wonder how they can impact our nation's foreign policy. At a basic level, the previous five suggestions are relevant. Gather your information about foreign policy from diverse sources beyond television so that you are armed with accurate information. Successful solutions to problems require that we approach them armed with accurate information. More importantly, morality and national security demand that we think and speak more critically about the costs and potential dangers of war. Speak out about your views and debate them with others to reformulate your position. Implement your ideas at a local level: write letters to the editor or to your representatives; boycott or protest businesses that exercise undue influence on our foreign policy; set up "town meetings" in your public library to debate the issues with others in your community and formulate possible strategies of action; print up and pass out flyers in high-traffic areas; engage in demonstrations… the possibilities, in other words, are limited only by your imagination. For those with the time and dedication, there are additional ways to influence foreign policy. There are a variety of majors that can be focused towards foreign policy—journalism, health care, education, and political science. Students can then seek employment in think tanks, international agencies, and government programs. Petition educational institutions to develop a diplomacy program, where students can learn how to impact foreign relations through more peaceful forms of negotiation and compromise.

7. Be the Change You Wish to See. There are certain broad principles that would go far to reduce human conflicts and that you can internalize as a way to embody the changes you wish to see in the world. 1) The path to change begins with self-respect. Only when we can learn to accept and appreciate our own individual strengths and weaknesses can we begin to accept, appreciate, and fruitfully engage with the strengths and weaknesses of others. 2) From the vantage of mutual self-respect, you can then begin to learn the value of compromise. You must be able to stand up and fight for those things that you want or need, but you must also learn to respect the wants and needs of others and locate a point of negotiation where at least some of the desires of both groups can be met. Failure to generate compromise between individuals or groups of people usually leads to feelings of hostility that will almost always erupt into conflict at some later date. 3) One key tool in facilitating compromise is the value of common ground. Try to locate points of agreement or shared values between disparate viewpoints; in doing so, a viable solution often materializes quite clearly. 4) When trying to influence the attitudes or behaviors of others, appeal to their best rather than their worst instincts. Rather than criticize or demoralize those with whom you disagree or engaging in punitive kinds of actions (i.e. violence or force) to generate change, think of ways in which you might influence people to change their thoughts or actions voluntarily by appealing to their high-minded values or their own self-interests. 5) Learn to tolerate diversity as an asset rather than a detriment to our society. Many Americans valorize liberty in principle, but resist liberty in practice. While individual liberty must have its limits in order for society to operate in a peaceful way, we should respect the rights of others to live and speak as they choose. Forcing others to behave or think a certain way has been the source of many wars in human history. Thus, while we all have the right to disagree with others, we should not try to legislate the thoughts or behaviors of citizens as long as those thoughts and behaviors do not harm others in any significant way. Consider this principle in terms of enlightened self-interest: by respecting the liberty of others, we preserve it for ourselves. Internalizing some or all of these philosophies in your own life may have a sort of contagious effect that encourages others to do the same, thereby implanting these principles in our society as "common sense" and in turn fundamentally influencing, hopefully for the better, our nation's future course of actions.