Im concerned about dealers selling cars without letting waiting list customers know

Any car that is cancelled is up for grabs to anyone on the waiting list AND to anyone that may be visiting the dealership. That's how it was explained to me by one of the salesman at the local dealership. As I see it, the sooner YOUR salesman finds out, the sooner YOU find out.

So, don't feel bad.

 

I was told that everyone on the list was contacted and did not like the color or options (full package). Since I needed two now we took them. All the others wanted packages 1-4 not 6 and were willing to wait. Although that was a year ago. Now I never see a Prius on the lot anymore and tons more on the road. I see at least 1-2 everyday.

 

It varies by dealer around here. The local dealership I bought from was fairly straightforward about the whole process: You're placed on a list, and owners are contacted in the order in which they are listed. They will make sure it's the package you want, but can't guarantee the exterior/interior colors. If you pass on a particular car they receive, they move on to the next person on the list, and contact you again when they receive their next delivery.

On the other hand, I contacted a dealer in a nearby city who had a long wait list, but they just happened to have an order cancellation that day, and would deliver the car that same day if I were willing to pay $3,000 over MSRP. So instead of offering the car to the next person on the list, they were willing to sell the car right out from under that person and make a hefty profit.

My advice - don't deal with the unfair dealerships. If they're willing to screw over their other customers, they're willing to screw you over, too.

 

Of the three dealerships I checked out, all of them said they honored the waitlist and all of them did in fact not honor it strictly. It seems standard practice that if they can sell for more than MSRP to someone who doesn't want to wait, they will do so. Of course they won't tell people on the waitlist that. If they told someone on the waitlist that their car was about to arrive, then that person would learn that it was "damaged in transit".

I was lucky enough to get a dealer who allowed me to write something like the following in my purchase contract: "Dealer will not sell a car with these options and color to anyone who was not on the waitlist before me, unless I decline to purchase or 2 days elapse since I was notified". If you want to be even more assertive you could try and get liquidated damages written into the contract, like they owe you $2000 for every vehicle they sell around you.

I am pretty sure that they did in fact sell my car to someone else, but they got around to me in pretty good time probably because they knew I had legal ammunition if they put me off too long.

The important thing to realize is that "honor the waitlist" is legally a very nebulous term, and even the legalese in most waitlist paperwork will give them enough wiggle room that they can say they are "honoring the waitlist" and still sell around it. And they can and will ignore any legal contracts.

I don't think there is much you can do to avoid having them sell around you, except to overpay. Hearing anecdotes from people whose dealer "honored the waitlist" just means the dealer was successful at hiding their misdeeds.

 

Sure, dealerships can also lie (gasp!). You just have to keep an eye on them. As a sort of checksum, I made sure to ask multiple people various questions about delivery times, allocation, etc. If the statements didn't add up, I would know someone wasn't being honest. For example, I'd ask one salesperson what their monthly Prius allocation was, and then wander across the show floor and ask another salesperson (or a manager) what the wait time would be. Then I'd ask another salesperson how many people were on the waiting list. Unless they cover the answers to those questions in their staff meetings, they'll most likely give you an honest answer.

I don't believe the dealer I bought from pulled any punches. I was #8 on the waiting list, they got one Prius a month (smaller dealership), and it took 6 months. You can always say you're shopping around at other dealerships, too. They'll be less likely to do abuse your trust if they're aware they could lose a sale to a competitor. Just remember that ultimately you, the consumer, hold all the cards.

One other suggestion - bug the heck out of the salesperson. By that I mean you should continually follow up with them during your wait and let them know you want to play an active role in the waitlist process. Give 'em a call every so often and ask where you stand on the wait list and if their allocation has improved. This tells the salesperson that you are a serious customer and he/she might do well to make sure you're satisfied, because you're more likely than others to refer a friend or to go out of your way to describe your experience with the dealership to others. Sales people use psychology all the time to influence their customers; there's no reason customers can't use psychology to influence their sales people!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(brandon @ Jun 19 2006, 10:47 PM) [snapback]273883[/snapback]</div>

Just curious, Brandon, what city that was? Not Wichita, I hope?

 

I showed up at my local dealership 2 Saturday's ago, ready to order my new Prius and put $500 down on the order. They just "happened" to have a silver package #4 that "everyone declined". I paid MRSP, no more, no less. There is no doubt in my mind that they decided that it would be easier to sell the car to me than start making phone calls and then wait to see who shows up. I know it took it from someone who was waiting for it. My dealer told me in a prior discussion that the avg. wait time has been about 3 months.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(janetjanetbobanet @ Jun 20 2006, 04:54 AM) [snapback]273991[/snapback]</div>

No. It was our "friends" at the Toyota dealer in Topeka.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Alphawolf @ Jun 20 2006, 05:39 AM) [snapback]274015[/snapback]</div>

I really doubt that this is the reason that you were able to buy the car. Every salesperson would like to get a commission which means they want their customer to come in and buy it. You were there at the right time, and the salesperson that was tending to you took advantage of that. I am sure that the other salespeople wish that you had not shown up when you did.

 

That's just the thing... If you are working with a particular salesman, he really wants your sale. The dealership doesn't care, as they could sell the car within hours to someone else, but the salesman himself will lose the sale. So... that makes them a little more motivated to work for you specifically. I wasn't troubled that my salesman wanted me there RIGHT AWAY to put a deposit, but they were also adamant that once the VIN came in (and the car came next day or so), that I needed to come sign papers right away as well - it seemed that the only guaranteed sale was a SOLD car there, probably dealership policy. They were straightforward in the Internet deparment, but in the main showroom, man - vultures.

Also remember that people do put their names on multiple wait lists etc., so it's not surprising that if the car comes sooner/later than expected that someone might not be ready at that point. When I put my deposit down, they had the same car coming the next day, and they actually called that customer to make sure they still wanted it so they could sell it to me if not.

Strange biz this.

 

From my experience with two dealers in my area, I don't even believe that they have a consolidated waiting list. In my most recent experience, I was on the 'list' for 6 months. The salesperson called me up to tell me my car was finally in. To make a long story short, he 'accidentally' had the wrong package and color. As he tried to 'fix' the problem, he started going through his waiting list. It was basically just his own personal big pile of client folders with their Prius package and color preferences. It did not appear to be in any particular order and it definitely was not a consolidated dealer waiting list. I ended up walking out and called a rural dealer (2 hours out of town) and got my pkg and color in 3 weeks.

 

The best system I've seen so far is at the dealer where we got one of our two Prii. They have a whiteboard right in the lobby of the dealership with these columns: customer name, VIN, colors, package/options, cost, and status. The status is either "G" (on the lot), "F" (in transit to arrive soon), "A" (being assembled) -- if I remember the salesman's explanation correctly -- and the others should be self-explanatory. Today I was there to have a couple accessories installed and checked it out. It seemed to correlate exactly to what was there -- two #7's in stock now without a buyer, and those cars were on the lot. A few more on the ground but with a buyer, corresponding to the sold stickers.

Now, if they were to put this on the internet, probably replacing the customer name with "sold" or "available" for privacy purposes, that would be ideal, especially for anyone who is too far away to drive in and see the whiteboard.

 

Despite all the horror stories, I like to think that there is a fairly large proportion of car salesmen who ARE honest. That said, it has to be difficult to work on straight commission like these folks do. I don't think anyone outside of any particular dealership can possibly know the inner workings--how they handle things like waitlists, particularly with a phenomenon like the Prius. If the dealership doesn't have a consolidated list, I have to figure that the sales people are gonna look out for their own bottom line. YOU/I/WE should just take the cards as they are dealt to us, and the sales people have to be the ones to deal with each other, and, as a result, with their customers. I would imagine that if I had been on a waiting list, I probably would have driven the sales person nuts by calling every day or so to see what was going on, and if I had then lucked into an "unclaimed" car, well, lucky me. I mean, today, I just checked the new inventory on hand listed on my dealer's site--they show FIFTEEN Prii. I have looked other days and there have been none. These guys get A LOT of cars. I mean, I don't know how "real time" these listings are, but I have seen some very positive comments about the dealer (Freeman Toyota in Santa Rosa, CA), so I don't believe there is a massive bait and switch going on,or anything else shady.

Bottom line? It is good to be honest, but don't sweat the small stuff. If YOU don't take the car today because you are worried that the next guys on the list should get first crack--well, chances are just as good that it'll end up going to someone else NOT on the list who happens to call and talk to the right person at the right moment. Think of it as CARma...

 

I was a walk-in that took my car home the same day. I was told the people who had my car on hold had lost their loan that Friday and this was 11a on Monday morning with cash and a great credit rating. I don't know if they called waiting list people but I was not about to question Lady Luck!

 

Rufaro, I don't know anything about your region, but in my area, the inventory data on the website shows all Prius arrivals, regardless of whether there is a hold on them. If you take a look at most of the larger dealers in my area, their website inventory will show lots of Prius in stock ... but these are not actualy available since they are allocated to the 'waiting list'. For example, Maplewood Toyota www.maplewoodtoyota.com currently has 9 Prius available on their website. These are not actually available .. their waitlist is one of the longest in the Twin Cities right now. As for the idea of constantly calling and monitoring your place on the list ... that's great if you have the time to do that. I travel and work a lot of hours, so I'd rather not deal with that day in and day out. Instead, I decided to devote one hour on a Saturday to call a dozen rural dealers. I ended up with a Prius in 3 weeks from Lyon's Toyota in Mason City, IA (2 hours away). I liked the dealer so much that I'll probably make the trip again for my next car purchase!

These dealers have more than a decent profit margin built in when they sell at MSRP, if they honestly care about good customer service, the least they could do is make the list transparent and keep their clients informed with either some phone calls or with a whiteboard type approach that Taco Mel mentioned.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(brandon @ Jun 20 2006, 08:44 AM) [snapback]274041[/snapback]</div>

I had a pretty decent experience in Wichita (Eddys Toyota) and got the car in two months. I kept in touch with the two salesmen I was working with by email and they seemed fine with looking things up for me whenever I asked, so I had a ballpark idea of when my Prius would be here. I made sure I gave them a good rating, too, when I got the survey stuff.

 

I stopped in at one dealership and showed enough interest they got my name and phone number.

At the other dealership, I put down my $500 and began a 5 month wait.

Early in the process, both dealerships were calling me with available Prius's. After 3 or 4 calls from each, they realized I was going to hold out for a minimum of a 2006 car and a 1/1/06 or later delivery. They stopped calling.

So, it depends. Should the dealer keep calling me just because I'm in line and on the list? I guess not.. If my response was... No, can't take that car today, but I'm sure glad you called me about it. If you get another one, please let me know... Then, I think the dealer should at least make an attempt to call.

I'd be outraged if I had a blue #5 on order... it was supposed to be in last month, but now they are saying next month. I'm in the dealer looking for answers and overhear another salesman 10 feet away telling a customer that they got in a blue #5 that was unexpected, and sold it to another guy.

My best bet... is that most dealerships don't have systems to track all this stuff... or the systems they have are just not that robust to keep this from happening. Also, most customers buying cars are not on some waiting list and having this problem. There are a limited number of special orders a year for most dealers... it just happens that pretty much all Prius's are 'ordered'. Most people are walking on to dealerships and picking a car from the lot. Most salesmen are selling cars from the lot. I think this 'ordered' and tracking orders stuff is a hassle to the sales team, much less keeping straight amongst them who gets the next Prius that is unexpectedly available.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daronspicher @ Jun 21 2006, 12:13 PM) [snapback]274719[/snapback]</div>

Yes, I completely agree. However, the fact that they are getting MSRP on these orders should be considered valid compensation for the hassle. This is a relatively small piece of the overall dealer's business, but I think its a decent indicator of how they operate from a customer service perspective and an ethical perspective. If they tell me I'm on the dealer's 'waiting list' and take my $500, I expect them to have a fair and organized system to manage the process.

 

My purchase was different than most experienecs I have read because I was not on a waiting list and worked with a dealer to bring in a package that was not being allocated to the local sales region (at that time PNW region was not allocating 2005 package 5s as part of normal stock). This was in December of 04. I found a rural dealer which had no wait list and units on the lot. I indicated that I did not want the lot units, wrong packages and colors and that I specifically wanted an 05 pacakge 5 in silver. The dealer went to work from that point. Apparently he made some calls to the region sales management and was able to trade off a unit in their allocation and got mine allocated to my selling dealer before it even hit port. I suppose I was lucky, but I also shopped around and found a dealer that wanted to work with me.

I paid MSRP with no extra dealer fees and they gave me a killer deal on an extended.

I can't stress this strongly enough: Don't commit anything to the first, second or even third dealer you work with. Find a dealer that seems to play it straight and get them to do exactly what you want. You may have to find a rural dealer. You may have to go out of your way or a longer distance to get the car you want in a timely manner, but it is always worth it. Always check out rural dealers. You might be surprised.