John McCain: "The United States is a Christian nation"

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by IsrAmeriPrius, Sep 30, 2007.

  1. IsrAmeriPrius

    IsrAmeriPrius Progressive Member

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    Just how far will he go to pander to the Christian conservatives?
     
  2. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(IsrAmeriPrius @ Sep 30 2007, 03:17 PM) [snapback]519576[/snapback]</div>
    I find it rather sickening. I don't want any religious values ruling my country. I'd rather vote for a Ficus....
     
  3. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

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    yikes. i hope people in other countries don't think we all feel this way.
     
  4. Godiva

    Godiva AmeriKan Citizen

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    Gee, John. As far as I know, there are no Muslims running for the office of the President. They're all Christians, except perhaps for the one Mormon. Some religions consider Mormons heretics and not true Christians.

    Then there's Giuliani. Anyone know what he is? I mean....what he actually practices?

    At any rate......strike John McCain off your list of wannabees.
     
  5. skruse

    skruse Senior Member

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    Thomas Jefferson, our third President and a writer of the Constitution is very clear that the USA is NOT a christian, muslim, jewish, buddist or anything country regarding religion. John McCain needs to spend an evening with Clay Jenkinson (aka Thomas Jefferson, NPR) and get his head on straight.

    http://www.jeffersonhour.org/
     
  6. fshagan

    fshagan Senior Member

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    This surprises me; McCain has never been a friend of the religious right. Now it will only seem like he's desperate and pandering (as opposed to just pandering!)
     
  7. pyccku

    pyccku Happy Prius Driver

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    We used to like McCain. He was our senator and we really respected him for having been a POW. It made us sick to see the tactics used by Rove against him.

    But when all of a sudden he came out for Bush in 2004, it made us wonder - WHAT did Bush promise him? Or, what dirt did Bush have on him? To turn around and support a guy who had treated you in such an underhanded, dishonorable way in the previous election - there had to be something going on behind the scenes.

    The more he talks, the less we like him. Neither of us would vote for him now. Of course he's entitled to his own opinion about who he thinks should be in the White House. But it sounds like maybe he needs to spend a little time reading the Constitution again.

    Christians can be great. But there are a lot of judgemental, self-righteous people out there who have no problem being a back-stabbing @sshole all week, then can go to church on Sunday and have their slate wiped clean - so they can start from scratch on Monday morning. Being a Christian doesn't make one great presidential material; being a good person with a sense of diplomacy and some sort of intelligence makes one presidential material.
     
  8. burritos

    burritos Senior Member

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    Aren't mormons kind of like christians? Just a different prophet right?
     
  9. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Sep 30 2007, 10:01 PM) [snapback]519709[/snapback]</div>
    Correct. Here is a video that proves it! I believe it with all my heart. :)
     
  10. Tchou

    Tchou Member

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    I don't want to flame or anything, I'm just curious about these :

    Why the "in god we trust" then ?
    and Also why the president must swear on the bible ?
    Doesn't it needs some changes ?
    If people elect a jew or muslim person or buddhist, or someone without religion, what is the process then ?
     
  11. justlurkin

    justlurkin Señor Member

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    Many of the 13 Colonies' settlers came to America in order to escape religious persecution (Calvinists who settled in New England, Quakers in Pennsylvania, etc.). That is one of the reasons why the framers of the Constitution were careful to ensure the United States government did not support any single religious denomination.

    The coins might say "In God We Trust" and George Washington set the precedent by swearing into office by adding "So help me God" to the Oath of Office, but at least those are generic. (i.e. as opposed to having coins that specifically say "In Jesus Christ we Trust" or "In Yahweh we Trust" or "In Allah we Trust." or "In Buddha we Trust.").

    I have seen swearing-ins here in NYC (such as for witnesses before court testimonies). A Muslim person can swear in using a Koran, atheists swear in "on my personal honor" without a Bible or some such religious instruments, for instance. There is definitely religious tolerance here in the big cities (makes sense, since NYC is the most ethnically-diverse city in the USA). McCain definitely won't be winning any votes here in New York with such religiously-exclusive talk.
     
  12. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tchou @ Oct 1 2007, 12:42 AM) [snapback]519734[/snapback]</div>
    Although there were appeals to add the religious sentiments to coins as far back as the mid 1800s the words "In God We Trust" did not become out national motto until 1956.
     
  13. scargi01

    scargi01 Active Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JustLurkin @ Oct 1 2007, 02:59 AM) [snapback]519735[/snapback]</div>
    Don't think it matters much what he says, New York is already decided.
     
  14. geologyrox

    geologyrox New Member

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    McCain symbolizes a lot for me. I wasn't old enough to vote in the 2000 elections, but I was old enough to watch the Republican party go from silly to scary to worse - and watched McCain turn out to be willing to support much of what I had counted on him to condemn. Before I registered to vote, I might have well ended up a Republican supporting McCain. But he Republicans have gone in directions that I am absolutely opposed to, and McCain ended up following in lock-step.

    Real conservatives out to pay attention - I'm not the only one the party lost.
     
  15. hycamguy07

    hycamguy07 New Member

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    Ahh I see I will be voting for the lesser of the evils again, this election..
     
  16. burritos

    burritos Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(F8L @ Oct 1 2007, 12:11 AM) [snapback]519711[/snapback]</div>
    Sheesh, is that in any way shape or form accurate?
     
  17. JSH

    JSH Senior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tchou @ Oct 1 2007, 02:42 AM) [snapback]519734[/snapback]</div>
    As others have said, "In God we trust" was added to the first US coin in 1864's just after the American Civil War as a way try to bring the country together. This motto slowly added to more coins and in the first paper bill in 1957. It wasn't until 1956 that "In God We Trust" became our official national motto. This was also when "Under God" was added to our pledge of allegence.

    The President does not have to swear on the Bible. This last year there was a bit of controversy because a Muslim was elected to the US Congress and took his oath of office on the Koren. Some people thought that he should use the bible instead, though I don't know why they would want him to swear on a book he doesn't recognize as holy to a god he doesn't worship.

    Yes, this needs to change, "In God We Trust" should be removed from all currency, be dropped as our national motto, and "under God" should be removed from the pledge of allegence. To me these religious references are an illegal endorcment of the Christian religions in violation of the Constitustion of the United States. However I doubt this will happen because per the latest polls about 90% of Americans support keeping "In God We Trust" as the national motto.
     
  18. galaxee

    galaxee mostly benevolent

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    i fail to see where use of the word "God" specifies christianity...
     
  19. Ichabod

    Ichabod Artist In Residence

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Oct 1 2007, 01:17 PM) [snapback]519861[/snapback]</div>
    It's about 99% accurate. Take it from one who was raised Mormon. And that whole story may just be one of the least silly stories you're expected to believe as a Mormon.
     
  20. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Sep 30 2007, 10:01 PM) [snapback]519709[/snapback]</div>
    Mormons believe in Jesus. That makes them as much Christians as any other self-styled Christians. I'd say there aren't more than ten real Christians in the country, because a real Christian would have to be a pacifist living in voluntary poverty. However, if a Christian is a person who claims to believe in Jesus, then Mormons qualify. Of course, they are certifiably bonkers, with all that silliness about Jesus coming to America and setting up a nation for which there are zero archaeological remains. But just because they are bonkers, does not disqualify them from being Christians. In fact, it's probably a prerequisite.
     
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