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Musk vs Media Matters

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by bwilson4web, Nov 24, 2023.

  1. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Never forget that Internet news may be inaccurate. Short of reading actual court filings and transcripts, everything else (including this post) should be treated with caution.

    Source: Musk files lawsuit claiming Media Matters manipulated X by scrolling down | Ars Technica

    According to Musk's complaint, Media Matters allegedly "manipulated data" by evading X's content filters for new users and "using an account that had been in existence for more than 30 days" to conduct its research. With this account, Media Matters allegedly followed only 30 users that "were either already known for posting controversial content or were accounts for X’s advertisers."

    "This functioned as an attempt to flood the Media Matters account with content only from national brands and fringe figures, tricking the algorithm into thinking Media Matters wanted to view both hateful content and content from large advertisers," X Corp.'s complaint said.

    Next, Media Matters allegedly began scrolling and refreshing this curated feed, generating "between 13 and 15 times more advertisements per hour than would be seen by a typical user, essentially seeking to force a situation in which a brand ad post appeared adjacent to fringe content."

    What X described as Media Matters' manipulations, though, arguably is how the platform would function if a user was going to follow only white nationalist accounts and their favorite brands, . . .

    In 1993, NBC was sued because of a report about exploding GMC pickups. GMC had relocated gasoline fuel tanks on the side, like semi-trailer cabs. The NBC team thought to show an accident that spilled the gasoline and created a fireball. But they enhanced the vehicle with an ignition source to ensure the video showed the fireball. NBC was sued and settled because it was a staged accident reported as news.

    IMHO, the NBC report highlighted a poor GMC engineering decision that moved a fuel tank from inside the body to an exposed, side. But it is harder to gather timely accident data showing the problem. Had NBC shown the pool of gasoline after the staged test with spilled gas on the pavement, perfect. They could have then shown the effect of igniting the spilled fuel as a separate part of the report. It was concealing the igniter in the report that made it a staged event.

    It is common for those who dislike another organization to focus on the income sources of that organization. A boycott is an effective tool. But has Media Matters created a synthetic or staged report to attack Twitter/X advertisers? Have others attacking Twitter/X done similar acts?

    This is an issue for the court(s) to decide where evidence is presented, argued, evaluated, and judgement passed. But I am also reminded that some States have passed laws restricting criticism of products like meat or vegetables.

    Bob Wilson

    ps. I have a Twitter account that was used 2-3 times per year in the vain hope there was some value. When Musk reformed Twitter/X, I even paid $8/mo for three months only to find there was no value in Twitter/X for my interests. Twitter/X could disappear tomorrow and it would have no effect on my life.
     
    #1 bwilson4web, Nov 24, 2023
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2023
  2. John321

    John321 Senior Member

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    You are expressing very common concerns that many have with our cancel culture adherents.

    An unbalanced view focused only on a particular aspect of a person or company is this groups calling card.

    This is a much different society now than the one we grew up in.

    I am not a fan of the individual you are speaking about - but a balanced view would not only include his missteps but the good things he has done- help expand technology, job creation to allow individuals to earn a decent living, contribute desired products to society, advance space exploration make positive contributions to renewable energy, help impact climate change etc.

    Twitter was a tool of choice to use in advancing cancel culture - now that he has taken that over they have a special axe to grind with him - don't expect this to end any time soon!
     
  3. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Had heard very little about the group Media Matters, but this evoked curiosity to read up on this guy Brock who founded the group. From the wiki - he's been quite the Hatchet zealot for both political extremist's sides during his life - as well as members of his personal life. Yikes
    .
     
  4. John321

    John321 Senior Member

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    duplicate
     
    #3 John321, Nov 24, 2023
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2023
  5. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Twitter told advertisers their ads would not appear next to 'troubling' content.

    Twitter admitted in the filing Media Matters did not falsify the screen shots, nor did they accuse them anything along the lines of hacking into servers or source code to get such ad placement. Media Matters used a method to speed up refreshing the feed, but the ad placement happened because of Twitter's algorithms. Which wouldn't happen in their assurance to advertisers.

    Advertisers leave Twitter. What wasn't mention here is that this is not the sole reason for them leaving. Musk had given a positive reply to an antisemitic post within the previous week. Being his account, that meant a majority of users, ones who otherwise would not an seen the original post now saw it.

    Twitter is in California, and Media Matters is in DC, to suite was filed in Texas. Venue shopping isn't outlawed, but with Twitter that Media Matters base claim, troubling content appearing with ads that shouldn't happen, wasn't a lie, this is looking like a SLAPP https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategic_lawsuit_against_public_participation. Also, Musk's usual lawyers weren't the ones to file this, but maybe they were all on vacation.
     
  6. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i'll wait for the outcome of the trial, not that i care. musk is a space cadet, bbut other than social media, it's all irrelevant.
    we all do what we do, but not all of us are in the spotlight 24/7. he makes his own bed, and seems to enjoy it.
     
  7. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Even Henry Ford somewhat repented of his zeal against the jews. That said - his complaints that he had against jews reminds one of the notion (old adage paraphrased) that those characteristics which bug us in others - is what we ourselves ought to own up to.
    An idea as old as time. Jesus said it in his own special way, (paraphrased) you hypocrite, before you help someone get the splinter out of their eye .... work on removing the plank from your own eye.
    (Matthew 7:3-5)
    .
     
  8. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    start by removing your plank from X :p
     
  10. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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    Is there a link to the actual post Musk agreed with?
     
  11. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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  12. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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    Interesting.
    While looking for the post Musk responded to, I found this analysis of the lawsuit by David Freiheit. From what I could see, MM will probably be starting a GoFundMe soon.

     
  13. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    After 1:17, the video ran over my bullish*t tolerance limit.

    Bob Wilson
     
  14. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    After 1:17, the video hit my bullish*t tolerance limit.

    Bob Wilson
     
  15. mikefocke

    mikefocke Prius v Three 2012, Avalon 2011

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    Interesting parallel:

    Henry Ford was one of the chief spreaders of pro-Nazi ideas prior to WWII.

    Funny how a person so respected and admired for his automotive manufacturing and development prowess and with so much money is filling a similar anti-Semite role now.
     
  16. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    This is bizarre:

    “Jewish communities have been pushing the exact kind of dialectical hatred against whites that they claim to want people to stop using against them,”

    The only Jews I've known have been white. So doing the substitution for "Jewish":

    Whitish communities have been pushing the exact kind of dialectical hatred against whites that they claim to want people to stop using against them,”

    Substituting "Whitish" for "Jewish" reminds me of:
    upload_2023-11-24_19-18-42.png
    Well that certainly applies to the MAGA right-wingers who want to kill Americans. What did Trump call his enemies, "Vermin."

    I would not have said it was true unless we discussing Malcom Nance's book. The right-wing killers want to kill brown and black people but also whites who oppose their criminally murderous goals.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #15 bwilson4web, Nov 24, 2023
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2023
  17. Mr.Vanvandenburg

    Mr.Vanvandenburg Senior Member

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    The guy running for office who is not President and his dedicated group have a calling card with an unbalanced view of a particular aspect of a person or company? Right on to that big time, in fact it’s their whole billboard and mode of operation. I never really understood the term cancel culture so well as now. Since the guy talking every day is doing it, all the time, apparently that’s called cancelling, what he does. It’s a weird use of the word cancel.

    As for Musk and other company owners, it is the customers who create the jobs. No customers, no Paypal, no Tesla, no anything. Bump up the middle class, more become customers and companies need more workers due to customer demand. Fewer customers have money, layoffs ensue. Bump up the company owners, their bank accounts get bumped up. Maybe they create more bankers because they in turn have become customers.
     
    John321 and Trollbait like this.
  18. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Well said!

    As for suing ‘Media Matters’, I don’t have a dog in that fight. Calling Musk antisemitic, easy to call, hard to prove. Far as I’m concerned, Twitter/X is his hobby and fun.

    When Twitter/X seriously replaces YouTube, I’ll look again. So far, no value to me.

    Bob Wilson
     
  19. John321

    John321 Senior Member

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    It is interesting to hear others views.

    Henry Ford didn't create Ford? Interesting idea but maybe not ground in truth.

    Customers can determine how successful a company is but usually an individual or group of individuals will create an enterprise that eventually grows into a company that helps sustain society with its products and job creation.

    As an example there is a great need in our society for common sense, cooperation and balanced viewpoints - why aren't customers creating that?

    Read this article for an example of one man with a vision who created what is now a worldwide organization creating millions of jobs world wide and supplying products society needs and demands

    The Story of Sakichi Toyoda | Toyota Industries Corporation (toyota-industries.com)

    Great way to increase your earning potential = Additional education, additional training, hard work, good work ethic, showing up for work each day on time, taking on additional task, improving your value to the company, being trustworthy etc...

    Not so great ways = sense of entitlement, throwing tantrums and demanding things, laziness, poor work ethic, not showing up on time, lying, stealing, adding no value to your company etc..

    It's each individuals choice on what type of employee they are - this is a buyers' market where there are not enough employees for the jobs available, a wonderful opportunity for a motivated individual.
     
    #18 John321, Nov 25, 2023
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2023
  20. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I read the +600 page, Elon Musk biography by Walter Isaacson and there was nothing to suggest antisemitism.

    Bob Wilson
     
  21. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I read the +600 page, Elon Musk biography by Walter Isaacson and there was nothing to suggest antisemitism.

    Source: Transcript: Walter Isaacson, Author, “Elon Musk” - The Washington Post

    MR. IGNATIUS: Do you think there's any merit in the questions about anti-Semitism, for example?

    MR. ISAACSON: Well, Jonathan Greenblatt, who runs the ADL, says he doesn't think Musk is anti-Semitic, but I do think that by allowing people who say anti-Semitic things on the platform and allowing them to be amplified, that has the same effect, and of course, I don't like that. I'm worried about it. I'm worried about it. I think it's bad.

    I think that there's a whole conspiracy, as you put it, a mindset, and a lot of my book is sometimes what Maye Musk, his mother, said, which is the danger of Elon is he becomes his father. His father lives in South Africa. He's a very--he thinks the election was stolen from Biden. He thinks if you get vaccinated, you're going to die right away or something.

    So if you talk to Musk, you say, well, a lot of those conspiracy theories, whether it's--I don't know--lab leak or whatever--turned out to have some merit to them. So there are times when he gets into this--what you might call fringe or conspiratorial mindset.

    But one thing I have to emphasize in this light--the book is a narrative--is that there are times he's not that way. He snaps out of it, where he's very rational, where he's trying very hard to make it an environment in which hate speech is not amplified. So you have a mercurial, complicated person which is, in my mind, if you're going to ask a question, probably not the best use of his time to be running what used to be called Twitter.

    I bolded the section that talks about Elon's father.

    Bob Wilson