Running E85

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by WE0H, Feb 24, 2012.

  1. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    All you need is something to reshape the injector pulse, if you want to run either E85 or E10. If you run E85 exclusively, then run bigger injectors.
     
  2. WE0H

    WE0H Senior Member

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    Exactly ;) The converter's I have, add a extra variable width pulse after the factory computer's pulse. Then the front O2 sensor will tell the computer to enrich or lean the mixture. The converters have a preset cold start time where they run the pulse wider for cold start enrichment. The pulse width is adjustable with presets to adjust from no added fuel to a lot of added fuel. I do notice running heavy blends of E85 that cold starts take a moment longer to pop off compared to straight gasoline as I don't have a converter on the Vue yet so the cold starts are a bit lean. You know what I mean ;) My Ion Redline is setup to run nearly straight E85 but I have never tried it. I opted to run the 42 pph injectors verses the 60 pph which would have allowed running straight E85. The 42's were quite a bit lower cost and I at the time was watching funds or I would have bought the 60's. Oh well :(

    Maybe some day someone will figure out what software will talk to the Prius computers and then who knows maybe the tuners will get interested in the car :p You likely have heard of HP Tuners. That software was the key to modifying the Eco-Tec 2 liter motors a few years ago. It started out scary trying this or that and evolved into finding out the motor could be tuned for some serious performance with out turning into a bunch of scrap parts shooting out the oil pan :eek: Those motors today can be tuned from ECO cruisers to balls to the walls go fast running straight E85.

    Mike
     
  3. stripedrex

    stripedrex Junior Member

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    I'm not sure im comfortable with just adding to the injector pulse. With that you'll still have trim tables need to adjust a lot, not sure how many cc the stock injectors push but id size it appropriately. Also opening up the intake and peoples reactions to it seems there some for growth. More air / higher octane ..... I feel there's room for growth =)

    E85 is also cheaper and lower emissions (creation process not withstanding which I believe can improve).

    Samsung Epic ?.
     
  4. WE0H

    WE0H Senior Member

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    Now running straight E85 in my Saturn Vue and getting 23-23.5 mpg on every tank :) I found a local station that sells it 55 cents cheaper than regular gas. Cold starts take a moment longer cranking but then all is fine.

    Mike
     
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  5. Andreas Schmidt

    Andreas Schmidt New Member

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  6. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    that's good stuff, how do we take advantage of it?
     
  7. WE0H

    WE0H Senior Member

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    Prius runs excellent on straight E85 with a converter. 40 something mpg's calculated averages are typical. Low 50's mpg happens with a bit of Prius driving style :) If the car is driven kinda hard, it gets upper 30's to low 40's mpg.

    The converter injector pulse width is adjustable to set the long term fuel trim as measured on the Scangauge.

    A person has to calculate mpg's running E85 verses gasoline to see if there are any cost advantage's of either fuel.
     
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  8. Andreas Schmidt

    Andreas Schmidt New Member

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    it's not just about the savings, it's also to get away from the oil cartel. the full movie is up for streaming on netflix. "PUMP the movie".
     
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  9. WE0H

    WE0H Senior Member

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    That is why my Prius and my Seadoo both run on E85 :)

    Mike
     
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  10. Easy Rider 2

    Easy Rider 2 Senior Member

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    I know that some people just LOVE to take chances and live "outside the box" but others reading this should realize that Toyota.....and every other car maker on the face of the earth......says to NOT do that in a car not designed for it.

    E85 will corrode many different things: hoses, gaskets and even some metals......IF the car was not designed for that.

    Mike might get along just fine doing this.......but he might not too. Only time will tell and there IS some risk involved.
    Unless of course your car is marked "Flex Fuel".
     
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  11. WE0H

    WE0H Senior Member

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    So far no leaks. My car is gonna get traded in in a year or 2 for a new vehicle. It has been running E85 since I was able to run out the first tank of gas. I just never told anyone as there are too many ethanol haters on this forum :(

    3 years of running it problem free ;)

    2 each their own thoughts n opinions :) It works in my vehicles, but it might not work in someone else's vehicle.

    Mike
     
    #131 WE0H, May 12, 2015
    Last edited: May 12, 2015
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  12. Jon Hagen

    Jon Hagen Active Member

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    Well, they showed the only hose in the entire fuel system that is constantly submerged in fuel both inside and out,( the pump to tank outlet hose) and it and the pump looked much better than the ones run in so called pure gas. Looks like you have a hard time accepting the truth. :)
     
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  13. Easy Rider 2

    Easy Rider 2 Senior Member

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    And it looks to me like YOU have a hard time ascertaining what constitutes good evidence.
    Simply looking at a part tells you NOTHING about it's health.......usually.
     
  14. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    I'll give the OP credit for one thing.....3 years w/o trouble speaks for itself.

    Would I buy his car used?
    Probably not - but then again I won't buy any used car SPECIFICALLY because there are too many chemical and physics 'hobbyists' out there who take shortcuts.

    I'm not one of these anti-ethanol activists.
    The way I see it is that since most corn is used for fattening cows, fattening kids, fattening pets, or in the adult beverage industry then putting it into a Prius is probably one of the better uses for the stuff.
    I'm just not sold on E85 working in cars for 10 years, and that's how long I need a Prius to last.

    Toyota is THE buzz-kill car company.
    That's why they're trying to revamp their stodgy image by making cars look like they were designed by stoner college droupouts, BUT there is a reason that all of the big car companies differentiate flex-fuel cars from non-flex-fuel cars, and it isn't just the yellow gas cap!


    ............something to think about when you're on the used car lot looking at a 2012 Prius with "a clean CARFAX history." ;)
     
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  15. Jon Hagen

    Jon Hagen Active Member

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    The hose had the appearance and softness of a new hose as the tec said, while the Pump run on E85 had less than half the wear of one run the same mileage on so called pure gas. What better proof could their be ?
     
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  16. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    1. Manufacturers recommendation.....or....
    2. Hundreds of 300,000 mile Priuses that always used E85......or......
    3. Something a little more quantifiable than "less than half the wear" or "has the appearance." The OP represents ONE data point.....kinda like how climate debaters are always pointing to ONE hurricane as proof of climate change or ONE cold Winter as proof to the contrary.

    I respect that OP's willingness to put his car through the test.....but I'm not inclined to do it myself.......yet.

    All of this isn't new.....
     
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  17. WE0H

    WE0H Senior Member

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    There was a fellow named Brad who ran his 2010 with a converter until he sold the car and bought a Volt. I don't know his username on this forum anymore :(

    Mike
     
  18. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    FWIW I think that the world is moving towards E85 capable vehicles. Most OEMs use plastic and alloys where they didn't do so before...I just need assurances for some fairly important pieces/parts like valves and injectors.
    There's a biiiiiiig difference between E85 and E10, but it's doable....as we see in places like Brazil where they often as not use E100.
    I remember some biker telling me that using E10 was going to destroy my Harley's gas tank.
    I reached down and thunked my V-Rod's PLASTIC fuel tank and said....
    "I don't think so....." :)

    I need a 300,000 mile capable car.
    That's normal use times 10-15 years.
    If the OEM says DO NOT USE E85, then I'm inclined to think that there is a reason that they do not want me to do so on a vehicle that THEY have to cover for 100,000 worth of power train failures. Lesser coverages if you drive a car with a lesser warranty
    Call me nieve, but....
    I'm thinking that if the OEMs could put yellow gas caps and FLEX-FUEL badges on their cars and provide this additional capability for less than $5 worth of additional hardware then they would do so.

    I'm just not buying the George Noory conspiracy theories on this one.

    YMMV!
     
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  19. WE0H

    WE0H Senior Member

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    I think I paid ~$45 for my converter. I have a few converters. The one on my Prius came with the Toyota injector connecter's so I didn't have to change them. It took some testing with my Scangauge to get the long term fuel trim right so the factory ECU wasn't trying to richen or lean the mixture more than it does running gasoline. The injectors in the Prius are the same ones in the Corolla of the same years so there is plenty of flow capability even running E50 blends with no converter.

    Mike :)
     
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  20. Old Smokey

    Old Smokey Junior Member

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    thanks for telling how long you used e85,will e85 clean the carb body .intake manifold and egr valve from accumulated carbon,if so i will start using e85 as a preventive measure being as i am no longer afraid to use e85
     
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