sanctimonious: Feigning piety or righteousness:

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by Tweev, Jul 17, 2008.

  1. Tweev

    Tweev New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2008
    121
    7
    0
    Location:
    San Diego
    Well detailed post. I learned a lot too. I agree that some of the terminology I used may have been a little too 'vivid'. I found it interesting some of the reactions though. I was really surprised how offended people were about the 'no having kids' thing. Looks like some are even offended by suggesting that they not eat meat. Interesting stuff.

    I learned a lot as well; thanks. Good to have these debates!
     
  2. Rae Vynn

    Rae Vynn Artist In Residence

    Joined:
    May 21, 2007
    6,038
    707
    0
    Location:
    Tumwater, WA USA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    I think I've slipped from my pedestal. I'm out-classed...
    I have to drive 260 miles a week for work, and my house is twice as big... oh, and DH and I have 6 kids between us (all grown up). :sorry:
     
  3. ranchogirl

    ranchogirl New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    235
    0
    0
    Location:
    Southern California
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    So why are you here? It's my understanding this is a forum for Prius enthusiasts?
     
  4. kazots

    kazots LifesaBeach

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2008
    262
    0
    0
    Location:
    CALIFORNIA
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    So you didn't buy a Prius when it was $1000.00 below INVOICE... BIG MISTAKE!
    Not being the right time was your reason not the rest of your story. Oh well, we all have our reasons for buying a Prius. It was the right time for us. It could have been we liked the car, color, gas savings, the moon was out, and whatever. We aren't all alike.
     
  5. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2006
    19,011
    4,067
    50
    Location:
    Grass Valley, CA.
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    It's simply an adaptation that developed over a number of generations. Design had nothing to do with it. It could easily reverse the adaptation if the right environmental pressures favored men/women without "canines". :)
     
  6. A Prime Factor

    A Prime Factor Formerly "I want my PHEV"

    Joined:
    May 23, 2007
    340
    171
    8
    Location:
    Madison, WI
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Advanced
    I bought a Prius because I liked all those storage compartments.
     
  7. Fibb222

    Fibb222 New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2006
    1,499
    98
    0
    Location:
    Canada
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    It's not necessary to never eat meat, cutting down helps a lot too. I occasionally get a little meat, and when I do I really appreciate how tasty it is. But I don't really miss it in between times. If I ate it everyday, I'd feel like I was abusing my body and it's an idea that doesn't appeal to me. This is something I've grown into over time. It wasn't always this way.
     
  8. Tweev

    Tweev New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2008
    121
    7
    0
    Location:
    San Diego
    In hind site you're right. You could also say that anyone who didn't sell everything they own and buy all oil and gas stock a year ago made a BIG MISTAKE as well. Should have listened to the peak oil enthusiast.....

    I think we can all agree that buying a Prius for 2000 - $3000 over invoice to save money on gas is likely mistake and a good example of knee jerk reactions of people who don't do that math prior to buying stuff. I think that it's probably better to suck it up for a year until Prius supplies re-adjust to demand and prices come down. That's what I think at least - not sure if you guys agree with that or not.
     
  9. donee

    donee New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2005
    2,956
    194
    0
    Location:
    Chicagoland
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    Hi Tweev,

    I did donate money to R+D on better cars. I BOUGHT A PRIUS. I cannot see the logic in funding status-quo car manufacturing and donating to organisations that unless their graduates go to Toyota or Honda (unlikely) will produce cars that are the same status quo. Clinton, Gore and that guy fro the EPA tried to get these Big 3 accountants heads out of the Windsor Locks sand (PNGV), but hell, they all "knew" better. Even if these graduates go to Toyota and Honda, if people do not buy improved FE performance vehicles, they wont have the funds to do anything. So, Yes, by all means fund better car R+D - BUY A PRIUS or HCH II !

    And I will do it again, if something better comes along (FWD/3WD Aptera?).

    My commute is 23 miles, and public transportation to go to the same point is 55 miles. Chicagoland has no circumfrential commuting, only radial.
     
  10. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2008
    5,330
    3,389
    1
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Vehicle:
    Other Electric Vehicle
    Model:
    N/A
    Poor assumption;)
    I would disagree with that UNLESS you added 'before you needed to buy a new car'
    If someone is going to buy a new car anyway, I would say buying a Prius is still a good deal. If they don't need a new car, then I would agree with your statement.
    In my case, one of the deciding factors was the push button start. Only other car at the time that had that I looked at was a Lexus IS. The Prius not only get's me double the gas mileage, it saved me about 10k:) But of course that was before the huge push in popularity.
     
  11. mcsenerd

    mcsenerd New Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2008
    37
    0
    0
    Location:
    Galveston, TX
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    You could do the same thing with a touch or any (insert WM6 or better device here) and use the savings to plant trees/buy carbon credits/some-world-saving-endeavor.

    Financially...for most Americans, I will concur that at current demand and pricing levels...the Prius is not a financial "win" for an of them. For me...in sort of the same way that renewable energy tax credits/rebates/incentives make solar and other options viable for Cali folks...the only reason a Prius was viable was thanks to the rebate offered by my wife's employer, BOA (3K rebate plus other incentives). Those monies in combination with getting a Prius at MSRP and combined with the fact that we drive a minimum of 85-100 miles each work day make the Prius a no-brainer for us over the Honda Element EX we were commuting in. I don't imagine my family is alone in being in this situation where combining high mileage with incentives makes the Prius a good deal.

    The Fit and Yaris are not comparable to the Prius...in any other way than that they are all self-powered automobiles with 4 wheels and they are not trucks. Saying they are directly comparable is like saying that a Hipster is a direct competitor to the iPhone...just not true.

    No kids = enviro-hero? How 'bout No kids=Unpatriotic traitor. I don't actually agree with that statement...but I think that both of them are somewhere in the neighborhood of equally valid. For every one less progeny that you or someone else puts out...it is easily replaced by the increased birthrate in other areas of the world which will eventually also surpass your "chosen" society in terms of economic/military/social impact in due time. I'm 100% behind those who choose to obstain from producing children in this world by choice...it's the best of darwinism without the premature death or bloodshed.
     
  12. A Prime Factor

    A Prime Factor Formerly "I want my PHEV"

    Joined:
    May 23, 2007
    340
    171
    8
    Location:
    Madison, WI
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Advanced
    And this surprises you? No wonder people have labelled you as naive.

    I'm not a vegetarian, but I often get mistaken for one. Every time I opt for a meatless meal, I'm asked about it. If only it were not seen as an either/or choice between lots of meat all the time and no meat at all ever, then I think people would have an easier time eating less meat.

    I agree with the person who said people would give up their SUV before they would give up their cheeseburgers.
     
  13. Tweev

    Tweev New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2008
    121
    7
    0
    Location:
    San Diego
    I like that. Brings to mind the old British saying (WW2?). "Women, just lie back and think of England".

    I think people have a "biological right" to replace themselves ie 2 kids per couple. I also believe that global over population either is, or eventually will be an issue (it has to be) so tax penalties should be put in to discourage people from having more than two kids. Or maybe come up with a "child offset" program - I'm kidding.
     
  14. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2006
    19,011
    4,067
    50
    Location:
    Grass Valley, CA.
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    I'm not sure this argument is valid. There are many other considerations to take into account when trying to model the future of a society. Out of control populations in poor countries almost never grow to become the dominant society due to the negative effects of such a population on it's infrastructure and government (interestingly China and/or India could change this but they are definately not new societies nor is their possible succession due to population alone). On the flip side, negative growth is obviously detrimental to a society's long term prosperity. Thankfully the more developed a nation is the lower it's total growth rate (excluding immigation/emmigation), that is the trend anyway. Where is the happy medium?
     
  15. Wildkow

    Wildkow New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2006
    5,270
    37
    36
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius


    Piffle I've never done any of that crap. :glare:

    Wildkow
     
  16. lenjack

    lenjack Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2006
    804
    114
    0
    Location:
    Pennsylvania USA
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    We are not all victims of price gouging. I bought my '07 in 12/06 for $850 below msrp. I get 48 in the winter, and 51 in the summer.
     
  17. Alphawolf

    Alphawolf Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2006
    84
    36
    0
    Location:
    Northern Utah
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    The economics of my Prius are pretty hard to argue...

    Without even reading most of the previous postings yet, I'll explain why my Prius made total sense to me...
    I paid 23K for my '06. I got the $3150 tax credit. Net cost then was $19,850.
    There was no other car out there that I could drive 18K miles a year in that gets this kind of mileage AND sleep in comfortably with my wife on road trips to Yellowstone and etc.
    When you figure the gas I have saved over something else we could have slept in , the math is obvious. There are many cars that can get mileage in the mid to high 30's and even into the 40's, but just try sleeping in one of them! So, figure in the gas savings over something else that gets 25mpg, figure in motel rooms and figure in this insanely high resale value of the Prius, and the numbers are really hard to argue with.
    If you were to go out and by a new one now though, without the tax credit, I believe you would have a harder time justifying it.
     
  18. Rae Vynn

    Rae Vynn Artist In Residence

    Joined:
    May 21, 2007
    6,038
    707
    0
    Location:
    Tumwater, WA USA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    I've regained my pedestal
    [​IMG]

    {The man behind me is Hyo Silver, btw}
     
  19. miscrms

    miscrms Plug Envious Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2007
    2,076
    520
    5
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    I would mostly agree. People that are running out and paying thousands over invoice on a car they didn't really need just to save gas money are probably not very good at math. I think there are cases though, where the depreciation of large gas guzzling vehicles is being so accelerated that waiting 6 months could easily cost you thousands of dollars. Tough call in that case. If you're buying one to reduce oil consumption, CO2 emissions, smog emissions etc rather than gas prices, I guess it comes down to the individual to decide what those benefits are worth to them. Hopefully when the '09s start rolling in come August supply will be able to keep up with demand and we can get somewhat back to normal.

    I've mentioned it before, but I personally think we all owe a lot to the early adopters. They took a big risk when the technology and battery life was unproven, they waited for months and they often paid a hefty premium all at a time when gas prices made it very hard to justify such a purchase. If there had not been a steady stream of folks willing to put their money where there mouth was, would we even have the option of buying a Prius today? I think even more than providing R&D dollars, our purchases can be a means of voting for what we believe in. If something is popular and vaguely profitable, you'll soon see more products like it. If no ones buying, it will quietly disappear.

    Rob
     
  20. Tweev

    Tweev New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2008
    121
    7
    0
    Location:
    San Diego
    I must admit, this thread has swayed me back to the 'maybe a Prius' side. I'm still surprised by turning vegan is only 50% more effective than a Prius. I really thought it would be much more. Odd how there are such slanted extrapolations on both sides. To answer some one's question before as to why I put a Prius in the same class as a Yaris or Fit is that to me, that's the choices I was considering. I wanted something small and good on gas. The Prius, Fit and Yaris all kind of fall into that. Maybe that's not a fair comparison in hindsite but I don't think comparing a Prius with a fully loaded Camry is either. Anyway to each his own.

    It's funny how I've never seem anyone really complain about the graphics. Am I the only person who doesn't like the display? The whole arrow thing pointing to the engine or battery is neat for about five minutes, then it's just a distraction or kind of annoying. Any one else find this? I've never driven any other hybrid but the photos of the hondas look a bit more simple and effective - never sat in one though so it's kind of hard to tell.