Shooting on Virginia Tech campus

At least 29 killed.

 

As of about 10:30am my sister's boyfriend was locked in a basement in one of the engineering buildings. They were told not to use their phones to keep the networks open for the EMS and police.

UPDATE: They let him out of the basement. He's headed back home to his apartment. My sister sounds a little calmer now.

 

They're currently saying "at least 21 killed" and 17-20 wounded, and that it's the deadliest school shooting in history - worse than Columbine in 99 and Texas in 66.

There seems to have been multiple attacks - one at 7:15 in a dorm which only killed one person, then another one two hours later in a building on campus. Seems that it was the same person who performed both shootings.

My only question is why they didn't completely lock down the entire campus after the first shooting until the gunman was found? Why not lock the doors to the buildings so no one can get in?

 

Is this thread going to turn into a redux of the assualt weapons ban discussion with Desynch after this horrible shooting?
Man, I hope not. Legislation doesn't cure mental illness. And this shooter certainly must have been mentally ill.

 

how horrible

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Apr 16 2007, 01:22 PM) [snapback]424100[/snapback]</div>

The sad thing is, thats not even a complete list. There are a bunch of items on the list about one person being shot in a parking lot or whatever, but they left off the May 9, 2003 shooting at Case Western in Cleveland (one student killed, one professor injured, and 100 people held hostage for 6 hours). Only reason i know about it is because i was in the building printing something just an hour or two before the attack...

It's things like this that really make you wonder what we're doing wrong as a society.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Apr 16 2007, 02:47 PM) [snapback]424127[/snapback]</div>

Nice. One could assume some of the unfortunate victims of the horrible slaughter have mothers and fathers who have not even been notified yet... and you put in a troll already...??????

Rick
#4 2006

 

in a tragedy like this, what really can be said?? my heart and thoughts go out to the families of all involved

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(eagle33199 @ Apr 16 2007, 02:14 PM) [snapback]424090[/snapback]</div>

That is mind-boggling and inexcusable. Where were the police in those two hours?

Was this terrorism or mental illness?

Harry

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Apr 16 2007, 01:47 PM) [snapback]424127[/snapback]</div>

I hope thats not what people took from what i said, as it's not at all what i intended.

My intention was to wonder what we might be doing wrong as a society that leads so many people towards violence. Some people say it's the movies, or video games that does it, but i honestly don't think thats it. When i was in school, i knew a ton of people that played violent games 3-7 hours a day (in my book, thats a ton, considering the work load we had at school). For the most part, they were also some of the most nonviolent people i knew - they never got into a fight, or even raised their voice to anyone.

Anyways, i digress. If asked what i thought was wrong with our society that leads to cases like this, i would have to say it's the role models. For some, these role models are parents who are alcoholics, abusive, or just ignorant of their children. They either try to control their children too strictly, leading to open rebellion, or they ignore them completely, giving no direction at all. For others, the roll models are public figures, like rappers, who get themselves into trouble. I don't hear much about it anymore, but back when i was young there was all sorts of news about rappers getting into gun battles, etc. And finally, there are the "other" role models that kids pick up on - the bully two grades ahead of them, or the drug dealer on the corner, or the head of the local gang.

As a society, we need to do a better job giving our children better role models. There are many organizations out there dedicated to this task (the first one that pops into my head is Big Brothers/Big Sisters of America), and they are all in desperate need of more volunteers. More and more people, i think, are realizing that this is no longer "someone else's problem". You can't just say to your kids "stay away from him" because his parents aren't doing a good job. Back "in the day" you could, because kids wouldn't bring guns to school - all you would have to avoid were their fists. As people realize this, more and more people are getting involved in mentoring organizations, and I think it is really making a difference... I just wonder how many more people will be killed before it makes a big enough difference.

 

Ironic that this should come out just a little over a week ago and the Columbine HS tragedy anniversary is just 4 days away, April 20.

http://pewresearch.org/pubs/443/the-nras-i...n-control-slips


Sigh . . . Does anyone really believe that more laws will stop this sort of heartbreaking tragedy?

Wildkow



<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Earthling @ Apr 16 2007, 12:28 PM) [snapback]424157[/snapback]</div>

Yes.

 

I never understood why when someone takes their life why they feel the need to take others with them!!! Humans are a strange bred of animal.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(eagle33199 @ Apr 16 2007, 03:28 PM) [snapback]424158[/snapback]</div>

There's a lot of truth in what you wrote here. I volunteer at our teen center in town, and most of the kids that act out violently or don't think the rules apply to them invariably seem to be coming from homes where something is missing; guidance, attention, respect, etc.. This is obviously arm-chair psychology by me, I certainly don't have any degrees in this and my only practical experience are with the children I've been close enough to witness these effects.

I feel for the families of the kids who have been killed in this insanity.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Earthling @ Apr 16 2007, 12:28 PM) [snapback]424157[/snapback]</div>

I would imagine the police were investigating the initial homicide. Expecting them to assume that a murderer is going to go on a killing spree is unfair. Unfortunately there are murders every day in this country. The police can't assume every killer is going to go kill more people and then lock down buildings and neighborhoods until they find someone.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Wildkow @ Apr 16 2007, 02:35 PM) [snapback]424161[/snapback]</div>

Was this an act of terror?

Does our "war on terror" include focusing on non arab(I'm presuming) terrorists such as this?

If so, how are we focusing on these types of terrorists?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Apr 16 2007, 03:00 PM) [snapback]424184[/snapback]</div>

In the true sense of the word, yes, this was an act of terror - it, and all other school shootings created an atmosphere of fear and terror that had people immobilized and helpless.

However, this is not the government's definition of terror. As far as we know (and i don't expect this to change) there was no organization backing this individual. He wasn't an operative for a terror cell - he was one lone person who wanted to kill a bunch of other people.

As for how are we focusing on people like this... it's rather difficult. You can't have operatives infiltrate the "organization". You probably can't gain anything from signal intercepts and (illegal) wiretaps. The only tools available to prevent these sorts of tragedies are already in place - the teachers and professors at our schools. While it does differ by area and district, many of them go through a class or two on psychological training in order to identify problem children in an attempt to intercept them before they bring a gun to school.

As i said elsewhere, the true way to combat the individual terrorist without a network supporting him is to treat the root cause - whatever it is in society that is creating all of these disturbed individuals. This can't be tacked on to any individual case (as was pointed out), but there are commonalities that i'm sure could be found across many cases that we, as a society (and not as a government) could address.