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Toyota technology competition

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by GAGendel, Jun 13, 2005.

  1. GAGendel

    GAGendel Junior Member

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    Here's a look at some things to come:

    I just got my June 6th edition of design news magazine. They had an article by Raser Technologies( http://www.rasertech.com/ ) where they put their electric motor in a Formula Race car to demonstrate it's capabilities. It's enough hype to drool over.

    The big claim is that they don't loose efficiency like standard induction motors when they're operated beyond their torque range. Only 3-4% drop in efficiency at 4x their torque range as opposed to ~60% drop normally. It's also significantly cheaper to build one of these than the permanent magnet engines ( like Toyota uses ).

    They aren't letting much out of the bag because their waiting for their 20+ patents applications to come through.

    BTW, This is the engine that the US Army is putting into their next generation Hummer.

    Here is the comparison with the Prius engine:

    Prius (Toyota)
    -----------------------------------
    Motor type: Permanent Magnet
    Torque: 400 Nm ( 295 ft-lbs )
    Dimensions: 205 x 320 ( est. )
    Volume: 16.5 L ( est. )
    Torque Density: 24.3 Nm/L
    Weight: ( not published )
    Cooling: Liquid

    Symetron P2 (Raser Tech)
    -----------------------------------
    Motor type: AC Induction
    Torque: 570 Nm ( 420 ft-lbs )
    Dimensions: 205 x 320
    Volume: 16.5 L
    Torque Density: 35 Nm/L
    Weight: 67 kg
    Cooling: Air
    Power:
    179 kW (240 HP) @3000 rpm
    373 kW (500 HP) @6250 rpm
     
    #1 GAGendel, Jun 13, 2005
  2. DanMan32

    DanMan32 Senior Member

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    But can it be a generator? That is a major requirement for both MG1 and MG2.
    Also, can it operate within specs for more than the tested 60 seconds and still remain air cooled? The prius will use its motors constantly.
     
    #2 DanMan32, Jun 14, 2005
  3. oly_57mpg

    oly_57mpg New Member

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    I bet that the current Prius electric motor _could_ run air cooled for a few seconds, then it would need cooling to prevent the stators from burning up.

    Most, or all, electric motors can be used as generators. It just requires the right circuitry where the coils connect...

    As my graduating project from college, I created a vertical linear motor, a MagLev elevator. I used old HD 'voice' coils (the component used to move the head across the platters of a HD). If I left the coils on for more than a few seconds, they would get _REALLY_ hot. Of course I was also pushing 4 amps through them...
    I had to use high RPM and velocity fans to cool them. I estimated that if I had liquid cooled them with oil or something, I could run them longer.
    Same idea behind the Symetron P2 motor.

    What I don’t understand is why there couldn’t be a HUB motor in every wheel and the gas motor would just run at a set RPM for maximum efficiency and create electric energy. Very similar to the way cruise ships and ferry boats function.
     
    #3 oly_57mpg, Jun 14, 2005
  4. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(oly_57mpg\";p=\"98377)</div>
    This is the route that Peugeot and Mitsubishi (to name a couple) are already taking. With Rasertech power density you should be able to easily manage 100bhp per wheel. Imagine that, 400bhp all-wheel-drive!

    Couple that with what the electric racers have to say about electric power....

    "as a the general rule of thumb, to equate race potential between electric and petrol engines on tight to medium racetracks, multiply the horsepower rating by three. That is, if you have a 10kw electric motor, you’ll need a 30kw petrol motor to stay with it.†(see here).

    :eek:
     
    #4 Anonymous, Jun 15, 2005
  5. DanMan32

    DanMan32 Senior Member

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    #5 DanMan32, Jun 16, 2005
  6. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

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    Wow, didn't know Toyota sold a series hybrid already!

    Shame it's only a bus... :|
     
    #6 Anonymous, Jun 17, 2005
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