TSB on Excessive Oil Consumption for 2ZR-FXE Engine

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by priusplus_fr, Aug 16, 2018.

  1. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    Mine started consuming ~220k and got really bad at 250. Went down after seafoam piston soak but it is still a quart per 3200mi in long distance, will probably be half in local short trip cycle.
     
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  2. johnHRP

    johnHRP Junior Member

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    If you do 5000 miles /6 months oil change interval, you less likely has any oil consumption issue. But you consume 2x more oil than the normal schedule.
    Lets calculate how much in 200k miles, typical Prius owner keep their car for.
    In 10 years/200k miles, we add about 20 gallons more oil or about $500 more, but you safe the catalytic converter and the engine from burning 1 quart per 1000 miles. Let say, after 100k miles, others have 1 quart per 1000 miles burning oil issue. It is about 100 quarts or 25 gallons=$625 in the next 100k miles in 5 years, they burn more money than you do by changing the oil every 5k miles.
     
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  3. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    It isn't as simple as you describe; burning oil causes carbon deposits, catalytic converter blockage, misfire and excessive engine wear (bores, bearings, etc).. not counting that it is bad for environment.

    There's a class action lawsuit against Toyota going on, FYI
    Toyota Oil Consumption Defect Lawsuit - Car Attorney

    BTW the replacement oil rings are taller, 2mm vs 1.5, FYI
     
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  4. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Sand Pounder

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    Also more outward springiness (aka tension), I’d speculate.
     
  5. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    Hard to tell from internet description.. maybe someone who held them in hand jives in? I doubt there's much difference as they are designed for thinner 0W20 oil, stronger ring will leave no oil film behind.

    I hope they've gone back to 3 piece oil ring design vs 1-piece.. additional flex helped to break apart carbon deposits.
     
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  6. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    That law suit does not include the Prius....


     
    #26 ASRDogman, Jul 19, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2021
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  7. Grit

    Grit Senior Member

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    bam! Just like the white paint peeling, prius are also sol’d.
     
  8. Rebound

    Rebound Senior Member

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    I don’t understand these lawsuits.
    Cars come with warranties. Everybody knows that cars come with warranties. Everybody knows that means, if it breaks outside the warranty period, it’s your problem. You can only go on manufacturer reputation at that point.

    If your engine throws a rod outside of warranty, boo hoo, shut up and go fix it. I don’t understand why people can sue for the obvious: The car doesn’t have to keep working after warranty.
     
  9. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    I just said the lawsuit doesn't include the Prius!!!


     
  10. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    Let me explain if you're slow and don't understand :

    Car has mfg/design defect which Toyota had recognized and even issued TSB. This is an equivalent of you knowingly selling a defective product, which is causing harm (to environment). This is no different to recalls issued due to defective catalytic converters, ECU programming or defective emission system; has nothing to do with warranty.

    For everyone else: TSB expired 3 years ago and Toyota HQ refuses to own the issue, they've basically told to go ef yourself. I would still recommend to call and log complain with NHTSA and Toyota.

    Personally I doubt I will ever buy another Toyota; not because they made a mistake but because they refuse to own it.

    EDIT:

    NHTSA # (877)923-4454
    Toyota # (800)331-4331
     
    #30 cyclopathic, Jul 21, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2021
  11. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    So how long should a manufacturer "own" up to something?
    1 year? 2? 5? 10? 20???
    Even with a house you only get 1 year.

    If you're not happy with Toyota, you could buy a yugo, or ford, or chrysler, or any other brand.
    NO one is forcing you to buy a Toyota.
     
  12. Grit

    Grit Senior Member

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    forever!!!
     
  13. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Sand Pounder

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    There's the rub: complacency and dodging issues is the norm, with every one of 'em...

     
  14. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    Ask Volkswagen. IIRC they went ~15 years back.

    All I know oil consumption on 2ZR-FE/FXE and 2AZ-xxx is due to narrow single piece low tension oil ring design, previous engines with wider 3-piece rings didn't have this problem and when they did it was much easier to get them unstuck. Of cause location of PCV valve didn't help either, it causes small oil consumption which promotes stuck rings, and when that happens they're stuck for good.

    And 2ZR is absolute bear to work on; you need to pull engine out to get access to pistons. Toyota estimates 21-22hr/$2600 in labor just for that.

    And don't get me started on blown head gaskets so common on 2ZR-FXE. If you curious google "Prius head gasket".
     
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  15. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    While this is certainly true Toyota had much more at stake to loose, their reputation.

    The problem is widespread GM, Hyundai, VW have this problem (thanks to rising mpg standards and switch to 0W20 oil), but at least VW had replaced rings without class action lawsuits. Toyota did recall Camry and Corolla, and only because there were more of them sold and more people joined on lawsuit.


    EDIT: it used to be "Toyota: we build boring but very reliable cars" now it is "we build sh!ty and boring cars"; case closed.
     
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  16. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Sand Pounder

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    T-SB-0169-16 (Attached) says 16.6 hours, but yeah, who knows: it’s a big job.
     

    Attached Files:

  17. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

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    There's a YouTube video of guys doing Gen3 engine swap in 57min in a parking lot; beats me how Toyota gets it done in 16hr.

    Problem is that even if you get a low mile JDM engine it's most likely gonna have the same pistons/rings.
     
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  18. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    Well my 1978 Corolla frame bent when I get hit by an idiot driver!
    It's Toyota's fault for building such a weak frame! I want my money back!!!!
     
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