Types of Gas You Use

Re: Gas Brands

Well, here in Canada I run Mohawk Ethanol Plus 90. That's to avoid the MMT the Canadian gov appears to allow in all Canadian unleaded gas. Look in your manual and MMT is mentioned: avoid at all costs.

Duh - how do I do that when the "official" government stance is that it's wonderful stuff?

Otherwise, I would think all gasolines sold in the United States must meet minimum federal requirements for detergency and whatnot. Whenever I drive in the United States I shop by price.

Use common sense eg avoid gas stations that do very low volume to minimize your chance of getting stale or dirty fuel.

There is no need for higher octane unless you live at higher altitude. When I used to live in SLC, my 1990 4Runner needed 90 or 91 to avoid pinging on I-80 near Parley's Summit. The standard 85/86 octane didn't cut it.

 

That is the downside of NAFTA. The government can't ban MMT even if they want to.

California had the same problem when they tried to ban MTBE.

I'm concerned about MMT as well. Not so much for my catalytic converter and O2 sensor, but because it's poison. I've been trying to keep tabs on which companies use it for a few years now. Here is Chevron/Texaco's statement from Jan 2002:

"...At this time, Chevron Canada Limited does use the additive MMT as a blending component in the Supreme gasoline grades (AKI 92 & 94).  We do not presently use MMT in our Regular (AKI 87) or Plus (AKI 89) grade in Canada.

We did not use any MMT in Canada between 1995 & 1998 pending the outcome of the Canadian Federal Government's attempts to ban its use. In 1998 the Canadian Federal Government approved the continued use of MMT in gasolines sold in Canada (based on available scientific evidence).  Chevron Canada Limited began blending with MMT as stated above. Although Auto manufacturers have stated their concerns very emphatically about the possible harmful effects of using MMT, there is no statistical evidence to support their claims... (blah blah blah)

At this time, Chevron does not add nor do we plan in the future to add MMT to our gasoline in the United States.  Most other majors do not use it either.  It is a antiknock compound that contains manganese and raises the antiknock quality of gasoline.  It is in use in Canada..."
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The Sierra Club of Canada issued this statement:

Press Release
Sierra Club of Canada
December 16th 2004

MMT On Its Way Out in Canada

(Ottawa) The controversial fuel additive, MMT, may finally be disappearing from Canadian gas. A recent survey by Sierra Club of Canada revealed that virtually every major refiner of gasoline in Canada has started phasing out MMT, a manganese based replacement for lead. Like lead, manganese is neuro-toxic. MMT is also a threat to air quality due to its propensity to gum up catalytic converters in automobiles. MMT results in more air pollution. Its health and environmental threats led the Government to ban it in the late 1990s. However, various trade challenges, including Chapter 11 of NAFTA, resulted in the repeal of the legislation. Nevertheless, pressure from the car makers, environmentalists and health protection groups has not disappeared.

According to the Sierra Club of Canada, so far Shell Canada, Irving, Imperial, PetroCanada, Suncor, and Ultramar have stopped using MMT. Only Co-Op and Husky are still adding the controversial neuro-toxic anti-knock agent to gas.
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Since Husky is Mohawk, this brings the claim that Mohawk gas has no MMT added into question, but I too seem to remember that Mohawk actually stated publicly that they would offer MMT-free gas. Plus, I always take what the Sierra Club says with a grain of salt.

 

There was a thread on this before but it got lost with the restart.

You might consider looking at toptiergas.com

 

Re: Gas Brands

Only the Mohawk or Husky gasoline that is Ethanol blended will not have MMT. Their non-blended gasolines still have MMT from what I've been able to determine.

I would hope the Liberal gov finally responds to public pressure and bans MMT. Or maybe Ethyl Corp can no longer afford huge contributions to the Liberal Party Of Canada?

Ethyl Corp claimed to the public their MMT was quite safe. Of course, Ethyl Corp also claimed leaded gasoline was quite safe too.

 

"Ethyl Corp claimed to the public their MMT was quite safe." :roll: 'ahh, c'mon baby... you can't get pregnant the first time', 'dentist: this won't hurt a bit', 'I never had sexual relations with that intern', 'weapons of mass destruction'

Yeah, no kidding. I'm sure you know about the government ban, then lawsuit/nafta challenge, then almost $20 million settlement, etc. One thing you may not know (I didn't until today) is that the auto industry is actively lobbying the government and the oil companies to remove MMT from Canadian gasoline. Too many emissions equipment related warrantee issues. One of the few times that 'big auto' is our friend.

 

Re: Gas Brands

The issue of gasoline quality is nothing new:

http://www.cbc.ca/story/news/national/1998...MMT980720a.html

Let's not forget sulphur in gasoline either:

http://www.cbc.ca/consumers/market/files/c...rgas/index.html

I find it ironic that Ethyl Corp apparently is not allowed to use MMT in the United States but through coercion managed to peddle that crap in Canada. I suppose it's one way to get rid of Manganese.

 

why do you think we get 36,000Km warranty on the O2 sensors in Canada and California get's 115,000 mile warranty on them. Stupid Feds should have told them to go .... themselves. Poison us with your crap and then sue us. Were just dumb when it comes to that crap. Part of the reason I use Chevron at this time in the lower mainland they don't use any manganese in thier gas. At least that's what the sign on the pump says. I got really good mileage from this last tank which by a stroke of bad luck I had to use Esso, so I'm starting to rethink using only Chevron. The cheepie stations almost all use ethanol and I find my mileage drops when I use them.

 

"why do you think we get 36,000Km warranty on the O2 sensors in Canada and California get's 115,000 mile warranty on them"

I didn't know that... now I'm really starting to get POed!

That's why I go to Chevron too - no MMT in the Reg and Plus grades.

"Stupid Feds should have told them to go .... themselves."

No kidding. It would have been nice if the stupid feds had bothered to even read nafta before voting it into law! John Crosbie, (at the time the Minister of International Trade) who sponsored the free trade agreement and nafta before Parliament, admitted he hadn't even read it. F'n idiot. OK, I'm going to calm down now.

"The issue of gasoline quality is nothing new"
Yeah, I am familiar. It's just nice to see the auto industry actually be on the right side of an issue for a change.

 

what ever you do, don't get me on a rant about this sort of garbage. I'm probably old enough to get worked up to the point where I'd have a stroke!

 

actually I do believe it was the CDN auto manufactrues association that pushed for the ban on MMT origionally. Then the Feds got clobbered by the Capter 11 NAFTA regs. They have been against MMT since 1974, the first year of CatConVerters in Canada.

 

also you know about the lead in Greek rasins, the Feds backed down on an import ban because Greek gov threatened a trade boycot so our dumb Bast...s backed down and it wasn't just a little over the limit on lead it was if memory serves me like thousands of times over the limit. You have to realize they are there to protect the citizens of Canada. ya right.

 

That's pretty scary about the lead in raisins considering that whenever I see someone eating raisins, it's usually a little kid.

 

Market Place did a feature on it about 2 years ago. Yup kid's n' rasins go together.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Frank Hudon\";p=\"70031)</div>

Frank:

I'm right behind you. Matter of fact, I feel an odd tingling sensation in my left arm right now ...

The European automobile trade organization ACEA recently finished the WWFC (World Wide Fuel Charter) to, among other things, harmonize motor oils *and* gasolines to provide maximum life for engine sensors and post-treatments like catalytic converters.

I wonder if Paul Martin will follow WWFC or if he'll make money off shipping Manganese to Canada?

http://www.canadafreepress.com/2005/cover030505.htm

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(exces6\";p=\"69686)</div>

My topic thread was called "The gas you put in your car..." From that tread there was a discussion of what people used and why. I can't recall all of it...but you might consider renaming this thread so you can get more comprehensive answers.

 

Since I had a part in derailing this thread, I'll help get it back on track.

My opinion is that there is little difference between the major brands of gasoline. It is an extremely competitive business, and as such the products and prices tend to be very similar. The majors even sell gas to each other. Now if you go to 'Joe's Gas' or 'Super Extra Cheap Gas Mart', the gas you get could be from any refiner and theoretically could be of a lower quality (but I generally doubt it). Keep in mind that it is a highly regulated industry.

Due to local/international regulations, auto gasoline varies more between places than between brands - especially when it comes to blending and additives.

As for the Prius, I believe the manual says 87 octane - anything higher is a waste of money. Some claim that higher octane fuel may increase mpg, but that's wrong. The chemistry just doesn't support it.

Stay away from gas containing MMT (Methylcyclopentadienyl Manganese Tricarbonyl)
It's bad for your body, it's bad for the environment, it's bad for your catalytic converter and O2 sensor, and it fouls your plugs. Luckily for most of you, it's only in about 5% of the gas sold in the US.

A few words about "oxygenated" gas. It contains either an ether (such as MTBE - Methyl Tertiary Butyl Ether) or ethanol (alcohol). The ethanol is by far better for the environment (i.e. you), but on a molecular level contains slightly less energy so theoretically your mpg could suffer. From the feedback on this forum and the Yahoo Group however, Prius owners who use 10% ethanol gas have not found a negative impact on their mileage. Plus it has been claimed that MTBE is carcinogenic.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(wilco\";p=\"70530)</div>

Oh I agree 100% on that.

Too bad MMT is found in virtually 100% of Canadian gasoline.

 

and I took a 12% mileage hit by using E10 from Washington State last summer.