What would happen to Prius with dead battery pack?

no battery pack, no go.

it's hybrid synergydrive- it needs both.

 

If the battery deteriorates slowly, you will run the ICE more and mpg will suffer. However, a dead HV battery disables the car. The planetary drive needs motor/gen action to work, and a dead HV battery would probably prevent this.

 

This is an advantage the 2006 Honda Civic Hybrid has over the Prius. The Hybrid Civic can rely on it's ICE without electrical motor assistance.

 

While the Honda Hybrids technically can operate without their battery pack, if you consider the Civic's 0-60 time WITH it's electric assist is already 2 seconds more than Prius, without it the car would perform horribly. Maybe just useful enough to drivve to a service station with your hazard lights on.

The Accord hybrid has a powerful v-6 engine so likely it would perform acceptably even without it's electric assist.

 

I wouldn't call that an advantage. Anyone who owns a hybrid knows that the battery is an integral part of the vehicle in all aspects, or else it isn't a hybrid. The logic of being able to drive a hybrid without a battery makes as much sense as driving a conventional vehicle without a functioning transmission. A vehicle stuck in 2nd gear isn't very good for much; a hybrid without a battery isn't a hybrid and isn't much of a vehicle either.

What hasn’t been pointed out is that Toyota’s battery management system protects the battery and works to prevent memory effect, which is the biggest danger to battery life. Very sophisticated sensing technologies work to prevent memory effect and to eliminate it if a memory situation starts to occur. So far, any battery issues that have occurred on Prius have been on 1st gen vehicles and on top of that there is no documented situation where an owner was fully on the hook for a battery related issue.

The tuning of the Honda engine for hybrid use doesn't lend itself well to sans-battery operation. In addition, without a functioning battery it is carrying around a lot of dead weight, in the form of a flywheel with an electric motor grafted to it and a battery pack that is not providing any contribution in this scenario.

So, following with my example of transmission failure. How much is it to go through and fix a dead transmission on an otherwise good vehicle? $1500-2000 in many instances (a lot less expensive than purchasing a new car). Estimated cost to replace a battery should it ever happen, and that is unlikely, $1500-2000. However, I cannot stress enough that the likelihood of this happening is beyond slim. You are more likely to spend money to fix an auto trans than you are to spend money replacing a battery in a Prius.

So, the Honda's advantage of operating without a battery is a pretty lame excuse to support an unimpressive hybrid platform.

 

"So what do you think would be the worst MPG before the battery pack becomes completely unusable?"

No one knows, because so far no one has worn out a battery! This despite several cases of 200K miles.

 

I don't think you can get an accurate answer to that question. Considering that the ECUs are continually evaluating battery condition and are making adjustents to it on the fly, without you knowing what it is doing behind the scenes, there is no real MPG issue, so much as there is an issue of the battery either working properly or not working at all.

If the HV battery were to fail or provide insufficient electrical power beyond a point which is acceptible by the onboard control systems, the vehicle would probably just shut down and provide a number of error lights indicating that professional diagnosis is in order.

 

as both the HCH and the Prius require the HV battery to start the ICE a failed battery in either will prevent the ICE from starting. Dealer time.

 

Six miles per tank... approximately the same mileage as a finely-tuned Hummer.

 

The civic has a regular starter and full size 12V battery in addition to its hybrid compnents. It doesn't require the HV battery for starting, neither does the Accord.

 

I seriously doubt a Honda can work witout a battery. Say the battery open circuited.
You would have a condition similar to towying a Prius without the ignition turned on.
No place for the spinning generator to send the power.

If the car allowed this it would do major further damage.

Now if it shorted instead, then you'd just approach Hummer mpg trying to charge a battery that won't take a charge.

Either way the car is not usable.

 

from a Car and Driver site
"The Civic Hybrid also has an "idle-stop" feature that temporarily turns off the engine to save fuel and minimize emissions when the vehicle comes to a stop. A green auto-stop light on the instrument display flashes to notify the driver when the idle-stop feature is activated. As soon as the driver releases the brake pedal, the IMA becomes a starter motor to start the engine smoothly, quietly and immediately. "

 

That's the normal operation of the vehicle (IMA). The 12V starter isn't generally used. If the HV battery isn't providing enough charge, the idle stop doesn't engage.

Remember, Honda's system allows the HV battery to drain much lower than Toyota's HSD does.

 

So if the battery is dead, how is the IMA going to restart the engine in "idle-stop" mode?

I guess the only way to do so is by the "regular starter"? I don't want to know how long that starter is going to last if you have to restart the car on every stop... :lol:

 

Despite all the '06 Civic flaws, there are many '06 Civic owners getting 50+ MPG during winter and driving aggressively. Check out the Hybrid Civic forums on greenhybrid.com. Honda has really improved their '06 model.... its tuned for highway miles. That is unless the owners arent telling the truth.

 

So as soon as you release the break the ICE starts ? that's a little weird what if you're just advancing a little at a light ?

 

I didn't realize this MISCONCEPTION still existed...

A failure on the electrical side renders the Honda system unusable... but not right away, hence this misconception.

Their 12-volt auxiliary battery is charged through the hybrid system. Without a proper feed (like that caused by a battery-pack failure) would drain that auxiliary rather quickly. The hybrid would simply shut off after awhile and not be able to start back up without a jump.

So theoretically, you could continue to push it after discovering a dead battery-pack situation. But the risk simply isn't worth it. With a system noticeably slower than Toyota's in the first place, not having the electric motor available would make it even slower. Honda warns against the strain that would subject the engine to.

And of course, this is where I point out the fact that "full" hybrid systems don't always require the battery-pack to power the thrust motor. That "not using it" should help to keep the lifespan long. The fact that the "assist" type can only be supplied with electricity for the thrust motor via the battery-pack is a shortcoming that should not be overlooked... especially that Honda now offers the ability to drive a little bit using electricity alone, working the battery-pack more than before.

 

The HCH is a totally different system than the Prius, the electric motor is much smaller and is not designed to operate on its own except under very specific circumstances which does not include moving the vehicle from a stop. The system is a series system vs. a parallel system used in the Pruis. Also the Pruis electric motor is rated at 67hp vs. the HCH's 20hp. Honda has came a long way in improving their hybrid but it is a different system it is still IMA (Integrated Motor assist).