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When should you Avoid going to the Dealer??

Discussion in 'Generation 1 Prius Discussion' started by SteveWlf, Dec 19, 2012.

  1. SteveWlf

    SteveWlf Old-on-Hold

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2012
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    Location:
    Montesano, WA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Thought I had a sure-thing when I insisted that my dealer replace the "flaky" ESP rack assembly. (I already told this story in another thread) and actually bragged about getting it all done under warranty enhancement program. Well all that did turn out just fine, or at least drove about 100 miles.
    Then the Red Triangle, PS and Check Engine lit up as I backed out of a parking space. After a couple restart attempts, it would drive up to street and highways speed but the warning lits never went off. Got home and read the OBD and intially I got no codes except P0420 (something to do with catilyzer, etc..)
    Did a little checking and found the accessory battery ground was loose. Also go to thinking about the dealer visit. When I went to pick it up they had it running and told me that they had run the accessory battery down while programing the new ESP computer. Hmmm! I retighted the ground connection, but before I did, I totally disconnected it to see if any of the codes that my obdll reader wouldn't read, might be be cleared. I also did a load test on the battery and it read low but indicated it only needed to be charge. Once connected I still got the P0420 code once I started the engine, but the other warning lights were still on. I called the dealer and as them to read all the code since I only have a (Prius aware, works on classic but not CAN buss) hand held reader. After sitting in the waiting room for 2 hours, they came back with a print-out of the P0420, P3101 and P3191. Plus a battery charger Diagnostic stating I should replace the accesory battery (~$380). They wanted me to beleive that the Codes were caused by the accessory battery. I already know that P3101 and P3191 were ICE malfunctions. They said the battery was too low to start the engine. Hmmm! It had been starting the ICE for that last dozen times. I pointed out that the ICE is started by the HV battery, through MG1 and only indirectly effects the starting.
    Since I wasn't going to buy a new battery and wasn't about to let the "Dealer Monkeys" work on anything else, got them to release the car to me and drove it home and put in a spare Prius II battery I had. Plugged in the hand held OBD reader and ereased the codes. Everything seems to be ok now.
    I have rechecked the original battery and it still seems fine but don't want to take a chance right now.

    In conclusion, I have been thinking, This dealer is a small town dealer and in two seperate facilities, the have the francises at one; Ford line, Chrysler/Jeep, excellent service. the second, has Chevy/Buick etc, Toyota line, including Pruis and some others and expanding. Busy and professional but I have to wonder if they aren't stretching their Expertise over too many makes and models. Still they are the only dealer within 40 miles for the Toyota line. From what I understand, they absorbed all these franchises during the current 'economic down turn' alone with the best mechanics (again, so I'm told).

    Well I will let you all know how this sorts out.

    Steve
     
    #1 SteveWlf, Dec 19, 2012
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
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    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    it's hit or miss with most dealers, especially with new/different tech.
     
    #2 bisco, Dec 19, 2012
  3. SteveWlf

    SteveWlf Old-on-Hold

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2012
    262
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    Location:
    Montesano, WA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    II
    I'm old and a newbie to the Prius, but have learned a few things (here and in the Prius manuals) and am pretty sure there is no starter on my engine! Now, should I point this out to a dealer tech or the service manager when they begin questioning if that might be my problem?? Or was I wrong the other day when I told them that replacing the pinion nut on my OEM power steering wasn't going to solve the steering Jitters (documented in the early 2001s, 2002s and 2003s). Might possibly be because they get 16 hours to do a Pinion Nut tear down job and only 2.5 to replace the whole assemble.

    Call me Cynical,
    or Call me:

    Steve
     
    #3 SteveWlf, Dec 19, 2012
  4. 3prongpaul

    3prongpaul Hybrid Shop Owner, worked on 100's of Prius's

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2010
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    Location:
    Boulder Hybids, Boulder, CO
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    I was looking at the service history of a customer car...they had P3191 and P3101 "engine won't start" errors and the dealer they went to determined the fuel pump was bad and since the fuel pump is inside the gas tank they must replace the entire gas tank assembly.

    The car most likely just needed a throttle body/intake manifold cleanout, but how is the customer to know that? (unless they Google PriusChat while in the waiting room).

    There is more Prius expertise in this forum than any single dealer.

    USE PRIUSCHAT to keep the dealer honest. Don't assume the dealer knows what they are doing...especially in an area where Hybrids are not that prevalent.
     
    #4 3prongpaul, Dec 20, 2012
    slimfrancis likes this.
  5. usnavystgc

    usnavystgc Die Hard DIYer and Ebike enthusiast.

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2011
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    Location:
    Tucson, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    Model:
    Four
    My opinion is you should avoid going to the dealer except for warranty/recall (ie, its free). Even then, don't let them touch anything else. Although I have had very good experiences w/ our local dealer (Gary Force Toyota), I have seen too many horror stories from others.

    One other reason I would go to the dealer would be for AC service on a Gen II or above (due to the ND 11 compressor oil reqmts). Most independent shops would put regular oil in the AC system and ruin the entire thing.
     
    #5 usnavystgc, Dec 20, 2012
    slimfrancis likes this.
  6. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    #6 bwilson4web, Dec 20, 2012
  7. jfeifarek

    jfeifarek Junior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2005
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    Location:
    Denver, Colorado
    I agree with usnavystgc you should avoid going to the dealer except for warranty/recall .
    I have one of those dealer horror stories - this year, I spent a grand at the dealer for the 100K mi service on my 2004 Prius, which didn't even include changing the oil. A month later, I had to have the car towed to a different dealer when I got the Red Triangle, and was told it would cost $2000 to replace the computer and "charge the battery" to find the real problem, which could likely cost $6000 more (for new transaxle). Instead, I had it towed to a small independent shop specializing in hybrids (Mile Hybrid in Denver CO) who found and fixed the problems for $140 : the transaxle had a loose connector which was apparently removed but not re-installed correctly by the first dealer! The shop snapped the connector in place and everything worked fine again.
    Prior to this good news, this independent shop presented me with a large list of options such as reconditioned parts or OEM parts at fraction of the dealer costs which made repair a lot more appealing. At one point before leaving the dealer, I considered buying a new car and asked myself if I wanted another hybrid if it would cost more to repair than its blue book value. Now that I have a cheaper alternative, I plan on keeping this car for a long time. I'm lucky to live in an area with multiple options - I hope that you can find someone affordable that you can trust with your Prius code mystery. It may be worth travelling some distance. My car was towed over 40 miles before it ended up in the right place.
    Jay
     
    #7 jfeifarek, Jan 2, 2013
    LBurks and usnavystgc like this.
  8. slimfrancis

    slimfrancis Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2011
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    Location:
    New Haven, CT
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    I
    i would avoid the dealers AT ALL COSTS. they are CROOKS. paul is right; there is more expertise and honesty in this forum than you will find from and toyota dealer. plus you will learn a lot more about your car on here which is invaluable.
     
    #8 slimfrancis, Feb 16, 2013
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