1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Yet another HV thread (Gen 3 - Prolong, New Prius Batteries, new OEM?)

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by model464, Jul 18, 2020.

  1. model464

    model464 Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2020
    25
    19
    0
    Location:
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    2023 Prius Prime
    Model:
    SE
    Eager noob here! I recently bought "Orpheus," a 2010 with 160K miles. In the spirit of long-term investment, I bought him expecting to replace the HV battery at some point in exchange for keeping him 5-10 years. I'm lucky to live in range of Boulder Hybrids and discussed HV batteries with Paul while I had the car in for routine maintenance. According to him and Torque News, I'll get a P0A80 code if a cell block hits 30 milliohms of resistance or there's a voltage difference of 0.75V between blocks.

    I already suspected my battery wasn't long for this world; I'm getting rapid SOC fluctuations on the road (how rapid is bad?), and the ICE has started kicking on and idling even when stopped / driving slowly with several battery bars left. (The battery doesn't lose charge overnight, though.) Accordingly, I got an OBD scanner and the Dr. Prius app and found 5 cell blocks at 29 milliohms and a voltage difference of 0.36V (screenshot attached).

    After admittedly spotty research on PC and other places, I'm figuring these are my best options:

    1. New OEM battery from Toyota -

    1a. Installed by Boulder Hybrids. That's what Paul recommended, but he estimated $2800 for the battery and the job. That's a darn sight better than a dealer but I was hoping to do far better still.

    1b. Bought and installed by me, if I can find one for sale. How would I avoid the core charge? Does that mean I just purchase the individual cells?

    2. Use Hybrid Automotive's Prolong now for preventative rebalancing before the battery goes.

    2a. Boulder Hybrids has a professional Prolong kit, and they'll rebalance my battery with it for ~$450 to buy me a year or two.

    2b. I don't think that's worth it, as a home Prolong kit wouldn't run me much more than one professional rebalancing, and I could keep rebalancing my battery once or twice a year as I've seen people on PC doing. That might buy me more than two years, maybe?

    3. New Prius Batteries. I like the idea and most people on PC seem happy with it (and also seem to think it'd work with Prolong when the time comes). I can't find too many data points for long-term/heavy use, though.

    I'm not planning on buying a whole reconditioned battery - it's "just a band-aid" as people say and much more expensive than the Prolong band-aid.

    Sorry for the wall of details - if you made it through all of them, thanks!

    So, my questions:

    I. Is my battery on the way out, as I suspect?
    II. With the battery as far along as it is, how much good will Prolong do? Am I right that regular rebalancings (with a home kit) will do measurably more good than rebalancing once?
    III. Any advice/caveats on my "options" or better options I haven't considered?
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    11,696
    11,317
    0
    Location:
    Central Virginia
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    For #3 the first batteries sold by @2k1Toaster here are now out of warranty and he has had zero failures. Some of the experts here have tested his kit too.
     
    model464 likes this.
  3. AzusaPrius

    AzusaPrius Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2020
    1,666
    768
    0
    Location:
    California
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    IV
    Check out Green Bean Battery they can install it at your house for $1,650
    Lifetime warranty that is transferable if you decide to sell your car.

    Reinstallation is included if the battery ever fails.
     
    model464 likes this.
  4. model464

    model464 Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2020
    25
    19
    0
    Location:
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    2023 Prius Prime
    Model:
    SE
    Thanks! I'd thought pretty hard about Green Bean just because of that warranty. I don't like that it voids the warranty if I (or the shop, I presume) do anything to it myself, but I suppose the point of the warranty in the first place is that I don't need to.
     
    #4 model464, Jul 18, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2020
  5. AzusaPrius

    AzusaPrius Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2020
    1,666
    768
    0
    Location:
    California
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    IV
    As with any warranty, the customer should not tamper with the product.
     
  6. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    11,696
    11,317
    0
    Location:
    Central Virginia
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    You misstated again.

    According to experiences here, reinstallation is included WHEN the battery fails. You will have an unreliable vehicle, in most cases. @TMR-JWAP and others here have helped those who got tired of that and wanta reliable vehicle back. Follow the advice of your local Hybrid mechanic.
     
    royrose and Raytheeagle like this.
  7. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    11,696
    11,317
    0
    Location:
    Central Virginia
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    You are the type of person that @2k1Toaster developed his kit for. He is a rechargeable battery expert in his full time job. Contact him to check on availability though.

    By the way I am just a member here trying to learn and help like most people. I look forward to needing something like this someday for my 2017 so I have been following the threads and discussions here.

    Realize new users here sometimes give misguided advice. Green Bean even posted here for a while until @2k1Toaster gave his warranty claim percentage and people asked Green Bean to do the same.
     
    #7 Prodigyplace, Jul 19, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2020
    MAH, model464 and Raytheeagle like this.
  8. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2018
    5,893
    3,161
    0
    Location:
    Florida
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    #2 would be the least expensive, and good chance of reviving the battery pack.
    And running it through the routine once or twice a year could buy you many years of useful service.
    And when it finally fails, you've been saving for new cells. :)
    And if you keep the Prolong harness hooked up, every year or 2 you can run the routine and keep
    the new cells in top condition and give them a much longer life.

    The BEST option is to buy NEW cells and replace them yourself. Which will give you 5 or more years
    of service. Then it's done and you can just drive the car.
     
    model464, mjoo and Grit like this.
  9. Mavi

    Mavi Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2015
    484
    283
    0
    Location:
    San Diego,ca
    Vehicle:
    2020 Prius Prime
    Model:
    XLE
    I went with 3 and couldn't be happier. I tried the manufacturing route and it lasted me approx 6 months.. it's just a giant waste of your time and money. If you value your time buy the 1.6k kit, and some may even install it locally for much much cheaper than you expect. Ask around.
     
  10. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2018
    5,893
    3,161
    0
    Location:
    Florida
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Which batteries did you buy?

     
  11. royrose

    royrose Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2009
    1,389
    948
    4
    Location:
    Foot of Pikes Peak
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    Limited
    I'm not sure what you mean by avoid the core charge? You get that back when you return your old core.

    @2k1Toaster of newpriusbatteries is in Colorado. He is just a few miles from my home. I like the idea of buying local. I plan to buy from him when/if the time comes.

    I'm curious. Did you do the Dr. Prius battery health and life expectancy tests? If so, what were your results?
     
    #11 royrose, Jul 19, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2020
    model464 likes this.
  12. model464

    model464 Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2020
    25
    19
    0
    Location:
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    2023 Prius Prime
    Model:
    SE
    Shows how much I actually know about this. Thanks.

    I hadn't before you replied, but I decided it was worth the money. Ran both full battery and life expectancy tests twice because I wasn't sure what I was doing the first time. Results attached. Not sure what to make of the inconsistent full-battery results, but I suppose the life-expectancy results speak for themselves.
     

    Attached Files:

  13. royrose

    royrose Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2009
    1,389
    948
    4
    Location:
    Foot of Pikes Peak
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    Limited
    I would say you are definitely on the brink if not over it. My 2010 (at 99,000 miles) is around 65%. Both tests can vary from test to test, I would trust the one that shows the problem blocks.

    So, I don't think reconditioning would buy you enough time to be worth it. I'd go with one of the choices of battery replacement.
     
  14. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    11,696
    11,317
    0
    Location:
    Central Virginia
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    newpriusbatteries.com
     
    ASRDogman likes this.
  15. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    11,696
    11,317
    0
    Location:
    Central Virginia
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    #3 is the only way to do that withouit a new pack (#1)

    #3 is less expensive, especially if you are able to sell some of your old modules.
     
    ASRDogman likes this.
  16. The Critic

    The Critic Resident Critic

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    3,193
    2,319
    0
    Location:
    CA
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Three
    I would go the @2k1Toaster route if you need a battery immediately. Toyota increased the price of the replacement batteries on 7/1 and the ones for the Gen3 are now stickering for $4k.
     
    model464 likes this.
  17. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2009
    5,597
    3,771
    0
    Location:
    So. Texas
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Last I "heard" here, he said he had a several month long order backlog.
     
  18. The Critic

    The Critic Resident Critic

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    3,193
    2,319
    0
    Location:
    CA
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Three
    Yikes. Sounds like the only option is to either junk the car or DIY with a single module replacement until he has more inventory available.
     
  19. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2009
    5,597
    3,771
    0
    Location:
    So. Texas
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    model464 and Prodigyplace like this.
  20. model464

    model464 Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2020
    25
    19
    0
    Location:
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    2023 Prius Prime
    Model:
    SE
    Several months or $4K? Big yikes.

    Thanks @fotomoto and @The Critic for the warnings. I guess it can't hurt to DM Toaster, see if anything hasn't miraculously changed in a month, and grab the first pack I can find before things get worse (with my battery and the world)?

    Big, fat yikes. What a time to live in.