Prius Recall due to floor mats? 2 yrs ago Prius owners said there's more to it than that...

[steve44]

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2007/09/toyota_prius_mats.html

Two years ago the same recall happened. However prius owners said there's more to it than a floor mat getting in the way of the gas peddel. It's a cruise control issue it seems....read the article for more details.

Is this STILL happening with the 2010 models?

[windstrings]

Quite interesting!... I makes you wonder if the whole "real" issue is hush hush and when you take it in, they don't do some reflashing or other modification to fix the real problem.

Sorry, just my suspicious nature with anything to do in the business world.

This happening to people with no mats is quite scary.

So, when you bring your car in, does the dealer simply hand you some hooks and show you how to put them on if you don't have them and if you already have the hooks installed tell you all is well and send you on your way?

I called my dealer this morning and he wanted the vin numbers to see if my car fell into the recall list..... also interesting.. I didn't know there were any that "didn't" during the stated time frame of years.

[DeadPhish]

Sorry Consumer Affairs has no credibility whatsoever. It's a site run by a consortium of scum-sucking-litigation-experts looking for hints of class actionable situations. They do no testing and they have no expertise in any field whether autos, drugs, toys, consumer goods or anything else.

The site is there for anyone who has a gripe to complain. Consumer Affairs has nothing to do with Consumer Reports or any other group except a similar-sounding name.

[windstrings]

LOL!... Hey Deadphish... I like your "tell it like it is" attitude!

If we had more of that, instead of being so politically correct, there wouldn't be so much trash going on all around us!

[cpatch]

This isn't a Prius recall, it's a Toyota/Lexus recall that happens to include some Priuses (not Gen III's). This thread is in the wrong forum.

[nylion]

Originally Posted by steve44

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2007/09/toyota_prius_mats.html

Two years ago the same recall happened. However prius owners said there's more to it than a floor mat getting in the way of the gas peddel. It's a cruise control issue it seems....read the article for more details.

Is this STILL happening with the 2010 models?

According to the "Today Show" this morning, the recall was prompted by a fatal crash in California They didn't say which model car was involved. I had a 2006 Prius that had "unintended acceleration' problems (see my thread somewhere on here or My Prius Tried to Kill Me! Runaway Acceleration: Toyota’s Dirty Little Secret « Moving As Fast As I Can which is my description of the problem.

Toyota has consistently either denied the problem exists or blames it on floormats. In my case, floormats were ruled out, So, they claimed that since they couldn't reproduce the problem at the dealer, then they couldn't comment. I filed a NHTSA report and did some research. I found over 200 similar claims against 2004-2008 Prius (I ran out of energy and didn't do 2009).

I don't think it is credible to believe that bunched floor mats are at the bottom of these problems. I am disappointed that Toyota is takng such a "Detroit" attitude about this serious issue.

Note: The last incident I had with unintended acceleration was in May 2009. In July I took delvery of a 2010 Prius. I traded in the one that gave me the trouble.

[windstrings]

Originally Posted by cpatch

This isn't a Prius recall, it's a Toyota/Lexus recall that happens to include some Priuses (not Gen III's). This thread is in the wrong forum.

Thats the part that perplexes me?
If its only "some" prius, what makes the floor mats an issue on one vin number and not another?

My point is, it may have nothing to do with floor mats!

I know it just looks like I"m stirring up trouble to some folks, but mostly to those who are trying to cover something up!

I grow weary of having to read between the lines to know the truth because its so far buried.

Why are they blaming it on floor mats, because its a cheap easy fix to get the media to get the heat off?

Having a car stick at "full" throttle that won't rectify no matter what you do, then to magically fix itself upon reboot is more than floor mats.

[windstrings]

Originally Posted by nylion

According to the "Today Show" this morning, the recall was prompted by a fatal crash in California They didn't say which model car was involved.

Yes, it always takes a fatal crash to prompt an open response and even then its cover-up.

The throttle is pretty close to the throttle on a steering wheel/foot pedal setup you would hook to your computer and play with your kids... its software driven. I"m assuming driven with an

actuator

Actuator

.

From the article in the above post.

Toyota denied there was a problem with the hybrid and intiated a recall of the floor mats, alledging the problem was a front floor mat that slipped and covered the gas pedal. When I called my local dealer, the service manager expressed concern and admitted that this was the first case reported to his dealership. Some of the accounts on the web say the problem is due to a defective cruise control. How can this happen to any car?
The Prius is the first car that has true drive-by-wire; the gas pedal is not mechanically connected to any part of the car. It is just a potenteometer, like the volume control on a radio. A computer reads the pressure on the pedal and then tells the electric motor, gas engine, or both to move the car. If there is a problem, the computer can accelerate the car without the gas pedal being depressed. In the past, other cars (remember the Audi?) have had runaway acceleration. These problems were mostly due to mechanical linkages being stuck which resulted in the unwanted acceleration. In a Prius, the human driver doesn’t have to participate at all. The onboard computer, like HAL in 2001, can take over on its own.
Does this mean that cars that are computer-controlled are inherently dangerous? Absolutely not. Every commercial airliner is fly-by-wire. Computers, not muscle operates the controls that fly the plane. The Prius is a joy to drive.

Update (May 4, 2009)
I took the car to the dealer. It was unable to find any problem. This is the same as other people’s experiences with this issue. Now I have to decide what to do next. Probably I will continue to drive the car and hope for the best.
Update (May 22, 2009)
I called the Toyota Experience line. This is the corporate customer service number. I told them about my problem. They told me that unless the dealer can reproduce it, there is nothing they could do. I asked if they had similar reports from others. The rep acknowledged he had, but said that Toyota determined it was “driver error.”
I also contacted the state attorney general’s office. It fowarded the complaint to the “auto dealer” complaint office. Clearly they don’t understand the issue.

I respect Toyota's reputation, but I don't respect trying to maintain it by hiding from the media "as cruel as they can be" or the truth.

Sadly, I see Toyota's dilemma in this screwed up world of cut throat and blood thirsty dog eat dog lawsuits.

If you plead "Not guilty", they do their best to mark a notch and hang you with due process, if you plead "guilty" they hang you higher and faster!

What happened to mercy and realizing that people and companies aren't perfect and everybody just needs to be honest and give each other a break?

I guess those days are long gone.

[mindmachine]

Originally Posted by windstrings

Yes, it always takes a fatal crash to prompt an open response and even then its cover-up.



I respect Toyota's reputation, but I don't respect trying to maintain it by hiding from the media "as cruel as they can be" or the truth.

Sadly, I see Toyota's dilemma in this screwed up world of cut throat and blood thirsty dog eat dog lawsuits.

If you plead "Not guilty", they do their best to mark a notch and hang you with due process, if you plead "guilty" they hang you higher and faster!

What happened to mercy and realizing that people and companies aren't perfect and everybody just needs to be honest and give each other a break?

I guess those days are long gone.

Problem is lawyers out to get a big settlement, usually a class action suit even and guess who really comes out on top. The masses who own the device get $50 and the lawyers get millions.

Many car companies have had unintended acceleration issues and reporducing the problem is usually elusive.

What does happen though is the consume/car owner now suffers a big drop in trade in-book value on their car. Usually a few thousand dollars even and like I said the settlement is like $50-$100 while the lawyers get rich.

[DianneWhitmire]

Toyota Consumer Advisory

Quality Compliance /TMS Toyota Customer ServiceTo: All Toyota Dealers
From: Toyota Customer Services

Toyota Consumer Safety Advisory

Potential Floor Mat Interference with Accelerator Pedal

******URGENT******

Toyota Motor Sales, USA, Inc. takes public safety very seriously. It believes its vehicles to be among the safest on the road today.

Recent events have prompted Toyota to take a closer look at the potential for an accelerator pedal to get stuck in the full open position due to an unsecured or incompatible driver's floor mat. A stuck open accelerator pedal may result in very high vehicle speeds and make it difficult to stop the vehicle, which could cause a crash, serious injury or death.

Toyota considers this a critical matter and will soon launch a safety campaign on specific Toyota and Lexus vehicles. Throughout the process of developing the details of the action plan, it will advise the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA).

Today, we are releasing the attached Toyota Consumer Safety Advisory to our customers. Until Toyota develops a campaign remedy, we are asking owners of specific Toyota and Lexus models to take out any removable drivers floor mat and NOT replace it with any other floor mat. The following models are affected:

2007 2010 Camry
2005 2010 Avalon
2004 2009 Prius
2005 2010 Tacoma
2007 2010 Tundra
2007 2010 ES350
2006 2010 IS250 and IS350

In the event owners choose not to remove their floor mat, Toyota strongly recommends that they ensure that the correct floor mat is being used, that it is properly installed and secured, that it is not flipped over with bottom-side up, and that one floor mat is not stacked over another. Information on proper floor mat installation can be found on http://www.toyota.com and http://www.lexus.com.

If a customer requires your dealerships assistance, please assist them by utilizing the attached instructions and application chart.

Please direct all customer inquiries to the Toyota Customer Experience Center at 1-800-331-4331 or Lexus Customer Experience Center at 1-800-255-3987.

Toyota/Lexus Consumer Safety Advisory Q&AQ1: Is this Toyota/Lexus Consumer Safety Advisory a recall?
A1: This is a Consumer Safety Advisory based on the potential for an accelerator pedal to get stuck in the full open position due to an unsecured or incompatible driver's floor mat on certain Toyota and Lexus vehicles.

Q2: Why did Toyota issue the Consumer Safety Advisory?
A2: Recent events have prompted Toyota to take a closer look at the potential for an accelerator pedal to get stuck in the full open position due to an unsecured or incompatible driver's floor mat. A stuck open accelerator pedal may result in very high vehicle speeds and make it difficult to stop the vehicle which could cause a crash, serious injury or death.

Q3: Was there a specific incident related to the Consumer Advisory?
A3: On August 28th, 2009, California Highway Patrol Officer Mark Saylor and three members of his family tragically lost their lives on a highway near San Diego, California, while driving a 2009 ES350 loaned to them by a local Lexus dealer.

Preliminary information from law enforcement investigators indicates that the ES350 involved in the crash contained a drivers all-weather floor mat from a different model Lexus. If incompatible drivers floor mats are installed in any vehicle, or if the floor mat is not properly secured by the retaining hooks, this could cause it to interfere with the accelerator pedal.

Q3a: Electronic systems, such as drive by wire, have been suggested as a possible culprit in the persistence of sudden unintended acceleration incidents. Is this part of the investigation of the San Diego accident.
A3a: All aspects of the vehicle are being studied, but preliminary indications are that an all weather floor mat not designed for the ES350 was installed at the time of the Saylor crash. We have seen no evidence that electronic engine control systems were the cause.

Q4: Which models and model years are impacted?
A4: Toyota
2007 2010 Camry
2005 2010 Avalon
2004 2009 Prius
2005 2010 Tacoma
2007 2010 Tundra

Lexus
2007 2010 ES350
2006 2010 IS250 and IS350

Q4a: How many vehicles are involved?
A4a: We are currently determining the number of vehicles.


Q5: Is Toyota planning another recall for the all-weather floors mats or other components as a result of this Consumer Advisory?
A5: Toyota considers this a critical matter and will soon launch a safety campaign on specific Toyota and Lexus vehicles. Throughout the process of developing the details of the action plan, it will advise the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA).

Until we develop a campaign remedy, we recommend that owners remove any driver-side floor mat from the specific models identified and NOT replace it with any other floor mat.

Q5a: Why didn't the previous all-weather floor mat recall alleviate this problem?
A5a: The previous floor mat recall was aimed at replacing accessory all weather floor mats with a newly designed one as well as advising users not to place all weather mats on top of any other floor mats. Despite this effort, unsecured or incompatible driver's floor mats can present a hazard and Toyota is exploring remedies that can further reduce the likelihood of an crash that could result from misinstallation.

Q6: What should customers do?
A6: Toyota is committed to finding the right solution for this condition. Until the campaign remedy is developed and customers receive notice from Toyota, we request that customers take out any removable drivers floor mat and NOT replace it with any other floor mat.

Q6a: What if a customer chooses not to remove their floor mat?
A6a: In the event a customer chooses not to remove their floor mat, Toyota strongly recommends that they ensure that the correct floor mat is being used, that it is properly installed and secured, that it is not flipped over with bottom-side up, and that one floor mat is not stacked over another. Information on proper floor mat installation can be found on Toyota Cars, Trucks, SUVs & Accessories and Lexus: New Luxury Cars and SUVs from Lexus USA.

Q6b: What if a customer requires assistance in checking the floor mat?
A6b: If a customer chooses not to remove their floor mat and requires assistance, they may check with any local Lexus or Toyota dealership's Parts or Service Department to verify the application. Dealers will re-install only those floor mats designed specifically for that model and model year.

Q6c: What if a customer needs retaining hooks (clips)?
A6c: Replacement retaining hooks (clips) for Lexus and Toyota carpeted and all-weather floor mats are available at any Lexus or Toyota dealership. Please check with the dealer for details.

Q7: What if a floor mat is an aftermarket rubberized floor mat?
A7: Driver's floor mat interference is possible in any make or model vehicle with any combination of floor mats. Therefore, consumers need to make sure the floor mats are compatible for their model and model year. Also, they need to be sure they are properly secured using the appropriate retention device (clips). Drivers floor mats should never be stacked. Consumers should never place any floor mat aftermarket or not -- on top of another drivers floor mat. Mats should also not be flipped over with the bottom-side up.

Q8: What if a driver experiences accelerator pedal interference. What should they do?
A8: Should the vehicle continue to accelerate rapidly after releasing the accelerator pedal, this could be an indication of floor mat interference. If this occurs, Toyota recommends the driver take the following actions:

First, if it is possible and safe to do so, pull-back the floor mat and dislodge it from the accelerator pedal; then pull over and stop the vehicle.

If the floor mat cannot be dislodged, then firmly and steadily step on the brake pedal with both feet. Do not pump the brake pedal repeatedly as this will increase the effort required to slow the vehicle. If you are still unable to stop the vehicle, then do the following:

Shift the transmission gear selector to the Neutral (N) position and use the brakes to make a controlled stop at the side of the road and turn off the engine.

If unable to put the vehicle in Neutral, turn the engine OFF. This will not cause loss of steering or braking control, but the power assist to these systems will be lost.

-If the vehicle is equipped with an Engine Start/Stop button, firmly and steadily push the button for at least three seconds to turn off the engine. Do NOT tap the Engine Start/Stop button.

-If the vehicle is equipped with a conventional key-ignition, turn the ignition key to the ACC position to turn off the engine. Do NOT remove the key from the ignition as this will lock the steering wheel.

Q8a: Why does the Engine Start/Stop button require 3 seconds to shut off?
A8a: This is to prevent accidentally shutting off the engine in case the button is bumped or mistaken for another control. The resulting loss of engine power could cause a loss of the power assist to the brakes and steering, and possiblyan unsafe situation.

Q9: What if an owner has additional questions or concerns?
Owners with questions or concerns, are asked to please contact the Toyota Customer Experience Center (1 800 331-4331) or Lexus Customer Assistance Center (1 800 255-3987), or consult the information posted at http://www.toyota.com and http://www.lexus.com.