Zap Xebra

daniel · 04-12-2007, 11:32 AM

On Tuesday I flew down to Grants Pass, Oregon, where I visited Sean and Tiffany at Grants Pass EV (www.gpev.us) to test-drive the Xebra. (Which I learned is pronounced zebra, not eggzebra.) I drove several different configurations of both the sedan and the pickup. Following are my impressions. This is all subjective:

The car is not especially easy to drive. Steering is hard. You have to really stomp on the brakes and you can lock them up, which would be very dangerous on ice. The fit and finish will tell you right off the bat that it's not a Toyota. However, having said that, it's a fun little car to drive, and it never uses gas. Imagine being in EV mode all the time!

The sedans were unsettling to drive at first, but as I spent several hours throughout the afternoon driving different configurations, I got more used to them. The one with larger tires was harder to steer (Sean said that was due to the larger tire area on the ground). There was a small but noticeable difference in power between the 72 v and 84 v versions. None of them accelerated away from a stop as quickly as the Prius does, but all of them accelerated as quickly as the average car driver, so that the Xebra will not be seen as holding up traffic. We took several of the vehicles up a steep hill, and while they slowed down considerably, they all made it up the hill. I think the 72 v PK slowed to about 20 mph, and the 84 v stayed a bit over 20 mph. On the very steepest of hills, you will slow down the traffic, but it looks as though the "hill climber" version (the one with the more powerful controller and 84 v) will still make it up the hill okay.

The 2006 model pickup (PK) has a narrow cab, so that the door crowds your leg. The 2007 pickup seems to have a wider cab, as there is enough room for your leg. (The very first 2007 Xebra PKs arrived the day before I was there, so I may have been the second person, after Sean, to drive one.) The 2006 pickup drives much more nicely than the sedans. Steering and braking both feel nicer and smoother, and the pickups seem to accelerate faster than the sedans, though nobody seems to know why, as they are about the same weight. It might be an illusion, but the sense is strong of peppier power and nicer handling. However, the 2007 PK handles much like the sedans. The pedals on the PK are very awkward, so much so that it is difficult to operate the brake pedal with the right foot. That, and the fact that I have no need for a pickup, are why I ended up prefering the sedan.

The seats in the PK are very comfortable. The seats in the sedan are not.

The turn signal stalks are touchy. Sometimes they don't want to engage, and on some (but not all) of the vehicles, they do not automatically turn off after the turn, so you have to disengage them manually. And the turn indicator lights on the dashboard are difficult to see. This is an example of the Chinese quality, and it generally describes the vehicle.

Instead of a shifter, there is a rotary switch on the dashboard with three positions: F, N, R. To back up you turn the switch to R and press a red button, then step on the accelerator. On level ground, at a stop, you can remove your feet from the pedals and the car does not move. I.e., it does not creep as the Prius does. There is no regenerative breaking (a disappointment in an EV!) and taking your foot off the accelerator does not apply any braking other than the normal friction of the car.

Visibility is good, though the front post on the driver's side in the sedan is very wide, and blocks the view somewhat. On the plus side, Sean says that this makes the whole cabin stronger.

The car would be disappointing to drive if you were expecting a normal car. But considering the dearth of choices available today, if you want an EV and you can live with the speed and range limitations, this in my opinion is an acceptable car. I ordered the sedan, and Sean thinks he can have it ready for me in about a month. I ordered the biggest, most powerful batteries Sean has available, in the 84 V version, with the more powerful controller, plus the air ride suspension and more comfortable seats.

Tracy pointed out to me that my points of comparison, my Prius, and before that my Honda, are really an unfair comparison. Probably if I'd been driving an older car, the Xebra would have felt better. So keep in mind when reading this, that I am fussy and I want the best. I am used to the best. And this car was made in China.

On the other hand, Darell points out that there is no reason for an EV to be less than stellar in every respect. The EV-1 was an excellent car, and EVs today could be just as good and go a lot farther.

I take a middle ground: I won't hide the Xebra's faults, because if you're going to try one you should know beforehand that it has its weak points, but on the other hand, this is a tiny, start-up company, trying to do what the big auto makers won't, and if we want to drive an electric car NOW and help boost the fledgling industry, we can't expect Toyota quality from a company like Zap. (Though I expect very high quality of the Tesla when it finally goes into production.)

darelldd · 04-12-2007, 11:39 AM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 12 2007, 07:32 AM) [snapback]422018[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

On the other hand, Darell points out that there is no reason for an EV to be less than stellar in every respect. The EV-1 was an excellent car, and EVs today could be just as good and go a lot farther.

I take a middle ground: I won't hide the Xebra's faults, because if you're going to try one you should know beforehand that it has its weak points, but on the other hand, this is a tiny, start-up company, trying to do what the big auto makers won't, and if we want to drive an electric car NOW and help boost the fledgling industry, we can't expect Toyota quality from a company like Zap. (Though I expect very high quality of the Tesla when it finally goes into production.)
[/b]

Great, realistic report, Daniel. As I like to say - the Xebra is what it is. The fact that it exists and can be purchased is obviosly a HUGE plus here! Really, my only reservation with these comes down to the idea that the general driving population sees cars like this as all that EVs could hope to be.

I found them to be surprisingly stable for a three-wheeled vehicle. You certainly CAN tell that there's only one wheel up there at times though!

DaveinOlyWA · 04-12-2007, 12:08 PM

thanks for the candid report. would you mind posting or PM'ing me details on cost, range, options, etc you got? or maybe better, wait until you have some real world driving time in.

i live in the middle of town, but next to the bay so also in the steepest part of town (i live on the side of hill facing bay from the west) so an EV with a range of 20 miles would suit me fine for more than 50% of my current driving needs including my work commute.

daniel · 04-12-2007, 12:49 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(DaveinOlyWA @ Apr 12 2007, 09:08 AM) [snapback]422035[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

thanks for the candid report. would you mind posting or PM'ing me details on cost, range, options, etc you got? or maybe better, wait until you have some real world driving time in.

i live in the middle of town, but next to the bay so also in the steepest part of town (i live on the side of hill facing bay from the west) so an EV with a range of 20 miles would suit me fine for more than 50% of my current driving needs including my work commute.
[/b]

Real-life experience will have to wait. With luck I'll get the car in a month or so. But the other questions I can answer:

I got the biggest batteries Sean offers, for added range, the extra battery, for 84 v., which adds power and range, and the bigger controller, for added acceleration and hill-climbing ability.

I also got the air-ride suspension and upgraded seats and LED lighting, none of which would actually be necessary. I expect the price will be around $17K, but I don't know for sure yet, because they didn't have a definite price on the seat upgrade or the detailing.

For hills you'd want the extra battery for 84 v and the bigger controller, but I suppose you would not need the big batteries. I'll be able to tell you more about hill-climbing ability once I have mine. If you don't mind going 15 or 20 mph up the hills, you should be okay. Also, going down the hills you'll be working the brakes hard. There's no re-gen braking, and there's no power assist on the braking. Your braking leg will get a workout.

For speed, I don't think I got any of them quite up to 40 mph on level ground, but I got pretty close. I have no way of knowing the range, but Sean claims about 40 miles. He also points out that with an EV you get a significant difference in range depending on how you drive. And I assume that, in the absense of any re-gen, having a lot of stops will reduce the range, compared to a route where you don't have to stop as much.

tracysbeans · 04-16-2007, 05:58 PM

Yeah!! Daniel is going to getting into the world of electric driving!

At least you can get a start with the Xebra and go from there!

Please let us know when your Xebra arrives in!

daniel · 04-16-2007, 09:25 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tracysbeans @ Apr 16 2007, 02:58 PM) [snapback]424263[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

Yeah!! Daniel is going to getting into the world of electric driving!

At least you can get a start with the Xebra and go from there!

Please let us know when your Xebra arrives in!

[/b]

I certainly will. And since we get our electric energy from hydro, my Xebra will be water-powered!

tracysbeans · 04-16-2007, 09:36 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 16 2007, 09:25 PM) [snapback]424344[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

I certainly will. And since we get our electric energy from hydro, my Xebra will be water-powered!
[/b]

So does that mean you can take it out on the water and also use it as an electric boat!

daniel · 04-17-2007, 01:41 AM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tracysbeans @ Apr 16 2007, 06:36 PM) [snapback]424353[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

So does that mean you can take it out on the water and also use it as an electric boat!

[/b]

I highly doubt it.

tracysbeans · 04-17-2007, 02:24 AM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 17 2007, 01:41 AM) [snapback]424476[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

I highly doubt it.
[/b]

I was just joking!

darelldd · 04-17-2007, 02:26 AM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 16 2007, 05:25 PM) [snapback]424344[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

I certainly will. And since we get our electric energy from hydro, my Xebra will be water-powered!
[/b]

One of my odd little peeves (not directed at you, of course!).

We say that traditional cars are "gasoline powered." Yet bicycles are "human powered." If bikes are powered by humans, then cars are powered by engines, yes? Or if cars are powered by gasoline, then bicycles are powered by the food we eat.

This comes up in my little world because I use the phrase "solar powered" for my EVs. Many folks complain that I'm not telling the truth. My EV is "battery powered." So which did come first? The chicken or the chicken scratch?

04-12-2007, 11:32 AM	#1
daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 11,278 My Car: 2004 Prius Model: Package: #6 Thanks: 59 Thanked 201 Times in 127 Posts Friends: 0	On Tuesday I flew down to Grants Pass, Oregon, where I visited Sean and Tiffany at Grants Pass EV (www.gpev.us) to test-drive the Xebra. (Which I learned is pronounced zebra, not eggzebra.) I drove several different configurations of both the sedan and the pickup. Following are my impressions. This is all subjective: The car is not especially easy to drive. Steering is hard. You have to really stomp on the brakes and you can lock them up, which would be very dangerous on ice. The fit and finish will tell you right off the bat that it's not a Toyota. However, having said that, it's a fun little car to drive, and it never uses gas. Imagine being in EV mode all the time! The sedans were unsettling to drive at first, but as I spent several hours throughout the afternoon driving different configurations, I got more used to them. The one with larger tires was harder to steer (Sean said that was due to the larger tire area on the ground). There was a small but noticeable difference in power between the 72 v and 84 v versions. None of them accelerated away from a stop as quickly as the Prius does, but all of them accelerated as quickly as the average car driver, so that the Xebra will not be seen as holding up traffic. We took several of the vehicles up a steep hill, and while they slowed down considerably, they all made it up the hill. I think the 72 v PK slowed to about 20 mph, and the 84 v stayed a bit over 20 mph. On the very steepest of hills, you will slow down the traffic, but it looks as though the "hill climber" version (the one with the more powerful controller and 84 v) will still make it up the hill okay. The 2006 model pickup (PK) has a narrow cab, so that the door crowds your leg. The 2007 pickup seems to have a wider cab, as there is enough room for your leg. (The very first 2007 Xebra PKs arrived the day before I was there, so I may have been the second person, after Sean, to drive one.) The 2006 pickup drives much more nicely than the sedans. Steering and braking both feel nicer and smoother, and the pickups seem to accelerate faster than the sedans, though nobody seems to know why, as they are about the same weight. It might be an illusion, but the sense is strong of peppier power and nicer handling. However, the 2007 PK handles much like the sedans. The pedals on the PK are very awkward, so much so that it is difficult to operate the brake pedal with the right foot. That, and the fact that I have no need for a pickup, are why I ended up prefering the sedan. The seats in the PK are very comfortable. The seats in the sedan are not. The turn signal stalks are touchy. Sometimes they don't want to engage, and on some (but not all) of the vehicles, they do not automatically turn off after the turn, so you have to disengage them manually. And the turn indicator lights on the dashboard are difficult to see. This is an example of the Chinese quality, and it generally describes the vehicle. Instead of a shifter, there is a rotary switch on the dashboard with three positions: F, N, R. To back up you turn the switch to R and press a red button, then step on the accelerator. On level ground, at a stop, you can remove your feet from the pedals and the car does not move. I.e., it does not creep as the Prius does. There is no regenerative breaking (a disappointment in an EV!) and taking your foot off the accelerator does not apply any braking other than the normal friction of the car. Visibility is good, though the front post on the driver's side in the sedan is very wide, and blocks the view somewhat. On the plus side, Sean says that this makes the whole cabin stronger. The car would be disappointing to drive if you were expecting a normal car. But considering the dearth of choices available today, if you want an EV and you can live with the speed and range limitations, this in my opinion is an acceptable car. I ordered the sedan, and Sean thinks he can have it ready for me in about a month. I ordered the biggest, most powerful batteries Sean has available, in the 84 V version, with the more powerful controller, plus the air ride suspension and more comfortable seats. Tracy pointed out to me that my points of comparison, my Prius, and before that my Honda, are really an unfair comparison. Probably if I'd been driving an older car, the Xebra would have felt better. So keep in mind when reading this, that I am fussy and I want the best. I am used to the best. And this car was made in China. On the other hand, Darell points out that there is no reason for an EV to be less than stellar in every respect. The EV-1 was an excellent car, and EVs today could be just as good and go a lot farther. I take a middle ground: I won't hide the Xebra's faults, because if you're going to try one you should know beforehand that it has its weak points, but on the other hand, this is a tiny, start-up company, trying to do what the big auto makers won't, and if we want to drive an electric car NOW and help boost the fledgling industry, we can't expect Toyota quality from a company like Zap. (Though I expect very high quality of the Tesla when it finally goes into production.) __________________ Daniel Primary car: 100% Electric 2003 Porsche 911 Carrera. Estimated range at 55 mph: 81 miles total or 64 miles to 80% discharge. Top speed 70 mph. Secondary car: Zap Xebra SD, also 100% electric. 1.9 cents per mile. Range: 40 miles total, or 32 miles to 80% discharge. Top speed 35 mph. Faster downhill. Both EVs use electrons generated from water power. Gas guzzler for when I have to travel farther than 60 miles: 2004 Prius. "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal." -- Emma Goldman "Anyone who has ever looked into the glazed eyes of a soldier dying on the battlefield will think long and hard before starting a war." -- Otto von Bismarck

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04-12-2007, 12:08 PM	#3
DaveinOlyWA 3rd Time was Solariffic!! Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: South Puget Sound, WA Posts: 12,382 My Car: 2010 Prius Model: IV Package: Solar Roof Thanks: 24 Thanked 121 Times in 103 Posts Friends: 10	thanks for the candid report. would you mind posting or PM'ing me details on cost, range, options, etc you got? or maybe better, wait until you have some real world driving time in. i live in the middle of town, but next to the bay so also in the steepest part of town (i live on the side of hill facing bay from the west) so an EV with a range of 20 miles would suit me fine for more than 50% of my current driving needs including my work commute.

04-16-2007, 05:58 PM	#5
tracysbeans Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 905 My Car: Model: Package: Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Friends: 0	Yeah!! Daniel is going to getting into the world of electric driving! At least you can get a start with the Xebra and go from there! Please let us know when your Xebra arrives in!