Specifications for the 2008 Prius

[sola]

Hi All,

I am wondering whether it is worth for me to wait for the 2008 Prius. There are not too many well-founded info about it yet, only some news items on AutoExpress UK and Japanese sites.

As I could collect the information available (some of it is certainly speculation):
- Refined, THS III hybrid system
- New, 1.8 liter engine, Atkinson cycle
- < 10sec for acceleration 0-100 km/h
- 2.5-4 l/100km in the city
- 9 km all-electric range
- Li-ion batteries
- Plug-in option (you can recharge the battery from the grid)
- Plug-out option (you can plug-in smaller appliances into the Prius, using it as a generator when off-grid)
- Lower sticker price than the current model
- Properly sold in Europe (here in Hungary, it currently costs twice the American sticker-price)

Some of my thoughts:

Better consumption of the 2008 model is very likely in the city if Toyota adds ultra-capacitors to the energy storage system since the efficiency of the regenerative-braking can be enhanced. The current model can regenerate only 10-50% of the kinetic energy due to the limited recharge capability of the current ni-mh battery pack. Ultra-capacitors are quite wide-spread in hybrid buses, I don't understand why the are not used in the current Prius. If they use ultra capacitors and/or li-ion battery packs city driving should become more efficient. Consumption is an issue for me since here in Europe we currently pay 4.5-5 USD/gallon and continuously rising.

The 1.8 liter engine may come in handy to make the Prius a no-compromise car. As far as I know, you cannot tow larger things (e.g. an other car) with the current Prius because it has not enough power. I suppose the 1.8 l engine would put this into the past, and consumption wouldn't suffer to much either. This may not be a useful improvement for me because I don't tow anything usually. The ski-box is the largest thing my car has to deal with.

Better acceleration is not a real whish-list item (at least not on mine) but of course it may come in handy sometimes. 2008 model would bring a ~10% improvement if the "1s better" info is correct.

9km all-electric range would be useful in a couple of years if I move to the suburbs. Currently, I live in the city and I don't have a garage so I couldn't recharge it at night with the lower-tariff. So at the moment, the current model would be as good as one with 9km all-electric range + plug-in.

I don't know whether the plug-out option is important. It may be useful sometimes but not very often and not regularly.

It is a big question whether the new model will have a lower sticker price. In North-America, it is sold at a very friendly price, but not here in Europe. Unless they start making them in a factory in Europe the EU import taxes will make them too expensive. And this seems unrealistic because a lot of the components are still produced in Japan.

Any thoughts?

Andras

[efusco]

I guess it all depends upon your situation. There are no assurances that there will be a new Prius for the '08MY. And if there is there are no assurances that it will be gridable.

Certainly it will be faster, will get better FE, will have lower emissions. Almost certainly will use a Li gel or Li ion battery. I'd bet it will have the same exhaust heat recapture system that's on the new Estima and will certainly have a more refined HSD (smaller lighter more effective Inverters, smaller yet more powerful MGs, improved algorythme for the ECU). I think its 50:50 if they'll integrate the terrain mapping system into those who get the NAV option (or maybe it won't be optional?).

I'd say all the other things are pure speculation.

For my money, I'd get a Prius now. You'll start saving gas for almost 2 years even if you got one of the first '08s on the road, you'll reduce CO2 emissions for 2 years, and resale will likely be quite high.

Also, if the '08 is as good as we all hope it will be VERY hard to get. Early adopters of the 2G and 1G prius will likely have first dibs and we may see 6mo-1yr waits for the car as we did with the 2G Pruis when it was released (though I don't think that will happen, Toyota will have production ramped up knowing this will be a huge seller).

[B Rad]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(sola @ Jun 17 2006, 06:13 AM) [snapback]272624[/snapback]</div>

Hi All,
I am wondering whether it is worth for me to wait for the 2008 Prius. -
Any thoughts?
Andras
[/b]

I think we are about to enter a new fast moving age in automotive technology. You may find yourself having to upgrade every year just to keep up with it. Kind of like buying a computer 10 years ago and finding it outdated by the time you have it installed. So I will take my new 2006 and wait another 6 or 7 years and then buy what will probably be and unimaginable NEW 2013 PRIUS.

[DaveinOlyWA]

im sorry but a FASTER Prius is about the most unnecessary thing i have ever heard. one with a larger engine?? sorry, real hard time swallowing that one as well. the other options are more than enough for me to get one. have been waiting for a plug in option although 9 km would not be any where near my wish list, i would still get it simply because of the factory install.

[efusco]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(DaveinOlyWA @ Jun 17 2006, 10:40 AM) [snapback]272676[/snapback]</div>

im sorry but a FASTER Prius is about the most unnecessary thing i have ever heard. one with a larger engine?? sorry, real hard time swallowing that one as well. the other options are more than enough for me to get one. have been waiting for a plug in option although 9 km would not be any where near my wish list, i would still get it simply because of the factory install. [/b]

I guess "unnecessary" is a fair assessment, but it would make it more desireable to the masses. If you put out an 80mpg Prius with lower emissions than the current one that accelerates 0-60 in 7 or 8 seconds it makes it very attractive to those who still view hybrids as slow and underpowered. I would be pleased to have the additional power/acceration available when needed to merge into fast moving traffic or to pass someone in some of the short passing zones we have here in the Ozarks.

I think of a faster Prius as a sort of bonus, like the SKS--something else that could easily be called "unnecessary".

[Godiva]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Jun 17 2006, 11:01 AM) [snapback]272686[/snapback]</div>

If you put out an 80mpg Prius with lower emissions than the current one that accelerates 0-60 in 7 or 8 seconds it makes it very attractive to those who still view hybrids as slow and underpowered.
[/b]

If it gets better mileage, has fewer emissions, etc. I don't care if it goes faster or not.

But I still want the hatchback!

I usually buy a new car every 10 years. But....if the redesigned model year 2009 Prius is that much of an improvement....I'll sell my 2005 and buy "early". I might even get the top package this go around with a gray interior. (I hope they'll have a dark blue by then. I just love the dark blue Camrys and RAV4s.)

[KMO]

I certainly hope they don't make it any faster. They're releasing loads of more powerful hybrids now; what would be the point of increasing the power of the nominally environmentally-friendly one rather than making it even more efficient? It's got to have some sort of distinguishing feature from the other Toyota hybrids, or it has no point.

Personally, it seems clear to me from what I read on here that the USA real road design problems. If you really feel you need something faster than the Prius to join traffic from a slip road, your traffic engineers need slapping.

[auricchio]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(KMO @ Jun 17 2006, 10:04 AM) [snapback]272720[/snapback]</div>

Personally, it seems clear to me from what I read on here that the USA [has] real road design problems.
[/b]

Agreed. If traffic engineers would begin to add traffic sensors to most of the traffic signals in populated areas, they could cut the amount of waiting time dramatically.

Here in the States we are woefully unable to create roundabouts; the answer is always to add traffic signals, which simply increase congestion.

In my small town of 6000, I fought last year against a traffic signal at a new bank facility. Because the signal's planning period had passed two years earlier, county officials voted to continue construction of the signal. Traffic engineers used data from a seven-year-old "traffic studies data book," using incorrect math, to estimate traffic at the bank building. The figures were based on building size, ignoring service capability. (For example, a 7000-square-foot building is assumed to have 160 trips per hour; the fact that four bankers cannot serve that many customers never enters the equation.)

When I saw the page from this reference book, I was appalled at its incorrect use of the data. A simple trend line applied to the 33-point graph showed their math to be totally wrong. And 33 data points for the entire US is a laughably inadequate sample!

My personal opinion of traffic engineering is that it's not advanced much since the 1940s. Highways are designed for faster speeds, but smaller roads are simply slapped into place. Local politicians and planners seem more concerned with shopping at a new Wal-Mart than smoother traffic flow.

Ahh....don't get me started. The traffic signal was installed late last year; it's overbuilt for the roadway, with over 30 lamps. It works, it serves the occasional car. What a waste of over US$100,000.

[savaged]

Don't forget Toyota's primary objective is still to make a profit. They will make a hybrid based on what the public demands - including faster ones. Unfortunately, most humans do not have a "global effect" mentality. (More like: What's best for me and right now)

[DaveinOlyWA]

roundabouts have always had problems being accepted especially out in the wide open west. but their advantages outweigh the disadvantages by so much that even here with a TON of opposition, they are popping up all over the place. in my area, 5 years ago, there were none that i knew of. today, that is always the most logical, cheapest, most efficient, way of moving traffic.

i am proud to say that i can no longer keep track of them all.