I haven't seen any news articles on this yet, so its Prius Chat Breaking News!
No word yet from the EPA as far as I've seen, but CARB has just published their emissions testing results for the '09 Jetta TDI:
http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/onroad/cert/pcldtmdv/2009/volkswagen_pc_a0070271_2d0_l2_diesel.pdf
Here is a comparison article I posted over tdiclub.
CO: (g/mi)--- FTP75 - US06 - SC03
'03 TDI: ----- 0.2
'09 TDI: ----- 0.4 -- 0.01 - 0.02
'08 5 cyl: --- 0.3 -- 0.6 -- 0.2
'08 Fit: ----- 0.2 -- 0.2 -- 0.4
Camry Hybrid:- 0.1 -- 0.5 -- 0.01
Prius: ------- 0.1 -- 0.0 -- 0.1
NOx: (g/mi)-- FTP75 -- Hwy
'03 TDI: ----- 0.7 --- 0.5
'09 TDI: ----- 0.05 -- 0.03
'08 5 cyl: --- 0.000 - 0.01
'08 Fit: ----- 0.04 -- 0.03
Camry Hybrid:- 0.004 - 0.01
'04 Prius: --- 0.01 -- 0.01
NMOG: (g/mi)- FTP75
'03 TDI: ---- 0.02
'09 TDI: ---- 0.012
'08 5 cyl: -- 0.004
'08 Fit: ---- 0.044
Camry Hybrid: 0.008
'04 Prius: -- 0.009
HC-NM + NOx: - COMP - US06 - SC03 (g/mi)
'06 TDI: ---- 0.748 - NA --- NA (federal numbers, no '03 avail)
'09 TDI: ---- NA ---- 0.08 - 0.12
'08 5 cyl: -- 0.002 - 0.02 - 0.001 (comp from fed)
'08 Fit: ---- 0.06 -- 0.01 - 0.01 (comp from fed)
Camry Hybrid: 0.01 -- 0.01 - 0.005 (comp from fed)
'04 Prius: -- 0.03 -- 0.03 - 0.04 (comp from fed)
PM: (g/mi) -- FTP75
'03 TDI: ---- 0.05 (CA @ 50k miles)
'06 TDI: ---- 0.046 (fed @ 100k miles)
'09 TDI: ---- 0.000 (CA @ 120k miles)
rest -------- NA
HC: (g/mi) Prod/Trans/Storage - Driving/Sitting/Fueling - Tailpipe (NMOG FTP75) - Total Local HC
'03 TDI: ---- 0.00064 --- 0.0 + 0.00002+0.000004= 0.000024 -------- 0.02 ---------- 0.02
'09 TDI: ---- 0.00064 --- 0.0 + 0.00002+0.000004= 0.000024 -------- 0.012 --------- 0.012
'08 5 cyl: -- 0.18 ------ 0.0 + 0.0019 +0.00167 = 0.00357 --------- 0.004 --------- 0.00757
'08 Fit: ---- 0.145 ----- 0.01+ 0.00146+0.00133 = 0.01279 --------- 0.044 --------- 0.05679
Camry Hybrid: 0.13 ------ 0.004+0.0019 +0.00334 = 0.00924 --------- 0.008 --------- 0.017
'04 Prius: -- 0.095 ----- 0.005+0.0013 +0.0000435=0.00634 --------- 0.009 --------- 0.01534
This part is still pretty over my head, so I'm pretty much using wxmans formulas. The exception is in the sitting calculation I think there was an error. For the 5 cyl Jetta 365 days / 3 day test * 0.23 g/test = 28 g/yr / 15,000 mi/yr = 0.00187 g/mi, not 0.006 g/mi. I also seperate anciliary emissions from the others. While they are important from an overall air quality perspective, they are related to production, transport and storage rather than specific to vehicle operation. As such, they are not generally localized to the area where the vehicle is operated. This is signifigant, as the NOx limited smog theory used to promote the importance of HCs over NOx is a localized effect specific to some dense urban areas. In that context I belive the vehicle emissions are more important than ancilliary. I also believe the evaporative emissions must also be looked at in the context of the tailpipe HC emissions, which I believe are represented in the NMOG measurement.
CO2: (ton/yr @ 15,000 mi/yr):
TDI @33mpg: --- 6.4 -- EPA 29/40
TDI @40mpg: --- 5.3 -- AMCI 38/44
Jetta 5 cyl: -- 7.7 -- EPA 21/29
Fit: ---------- 6.1 -- EPA 27/34
Camry Hybrid: - 5.4 -- EPA 33/34
Prius @46mpg: - 4.0 -- EPA 48/45
Prius @52mpg: - 3.5 -- Personal Lifetime Av
Crude oil Consumption: (gal/yr @ 15,000 mi/yr)
TDI @33mpg: --- 500 -- EPA 29/40
TDI @40mpg: --- 412.5 -AMCI 38/44
Jetta 5 cyl: -- 600 -- EPA 21/29
Fit: ---------- 479 -- EPA 27/34
Camry Hybrid: - 424 -- EPA 33/34
Prius @46mpg: - 311 -- EPA 48/45
Prius @52mpg: - 275 -- Personal Lifetime Av
Annual Fuel Cost: (15,000 mi/yr @ US Av $4.08 regular, $4.69 diesel):
TDI @33mpg: --- $2132 -- EPA 29/40
TDI @40mpg: --- $1759 -- AMCI 38/44
Jetta 5 cyl: -- $2552 -- EPA 21/29
Fit: ---------- $2038 -- EPA 27/34
Camry Hybrid: - $1799 -- EPA 33/34
Prius @46mpg: - $1328 -- EPA 48/45
Prius @52mpg: - $1177 -- Personal Lifetime Av
Interior Volume: - Passenger - Cargo - Total (cuft)
'03 TDI: ------------ 87 ------ 13 ----- 100
'09 TDI: ------------ 91 ------ 16 ----- 107
'08 5 cyl: ---------- 91 ------ 16 ----- 107
'08 Fit: ------------ 90 ------ 21 ----- 111
Camry Hybrid: ------- 101 ----- 11 ----- 112
'04 Prius: ---------- 96 ------ 16 ----- 112
5 Year Ownership Costs (Consumer Reports):
'03 TDI: ---- $36,928 (Edmunds, CR NA)
'09 TDI: ---- $40,600 (Est CR 5cyl +12% from Edmunds '06 TDI vs. '06 5 Cyl)
'08 5 cyl: -- $36,250
'08 Fit: ---- $26,750
Camry Hybrid: $35,750
'08 Prius: -- $28,500
Consumer Reports Reliability:
'03 TDI: ---- Average
'09 TDI: ---- Average
'08 5 cyl: -- Average
'08 Fit: ---- Much Better than Average
Camry Hybrid: Much Better than Average
'08 Prius: -- Much Better than Average
Relative performance within the group:
Summary Score Card: '03 TDI - '09 TDI - Jetta 5cyl - Fit - Camry Hyb - Prius
CO FTP75: ----------- ok ------ poor ----- ok ------ ok ----- good ---- good
CO US06: ------------ NA ------ good ----- poor ---- ok ----- poor ---- good
CO SC03: ------------ NA ------ good ----- ok ------ poor --- good ---- ok
NOx FTP75: ---------- poor ---- ok ------- good ---- ok ----- good ---- good
NOx Hwy: ------------ poor ---- ok ------- good ---- ok ----- good ---- good
NMOGs FTP75: -------- ok ------ ok ------- good ---- poor --- good ---- good
HC-NM + NOx COMP: --- poor ---- NA ------- good ---- ok ----- good ---- ok
HC-NM + NOx US06: --- NA ------ poor ----- ok ------ good --- good ---- ok
HC-NM + NOx SC03: --- NA ------ poor ----- good ---- good --- good ---- ok
PM FTP75: ----------- poor ---- poor ----- good ---- good --- good ---- good
HC Ancilliary: ------ good ---- good ----- poor ---- poor --- poor ---- ok
HC Local: ----------- ok ------ ok ------- good ---- poor --- ok ------ ok
CO2: ---------------- ok ------ ok ------- poor ---- ok ----- ok ------ good
Crude Oil Cons: ----- ok ------ ok ------- poor ---- ok ----- ok ------ good
Fuel Costs: --------- ok ------ ok ------- poor ---- ok ----- ok ------ good
Pass Vol: ----------- poor ---- ok ------- ok ------ ok ----- good ---- good
Cargo Vol: ---------- poor ---- ok ------- ok ------ good --- poor ---- ok
5 Year Cost to Own: - ok ------ poor ----- ok ------ good --- ok ------ good
CR Reliability: ----- ok ------ ok ------- ok ------ good --- good ---- good
Total poor: --------- 6 ------- 5 -------- 5 ------- 4 ------ 3 --------- 0
Total ok: ----------- 8 ------- 10 ------- 7 ------- 9 ------ 4 --------- 7
Total good: --------- 1 ------- 3 -------- 7 ------- 6 ------ 11 -------- 12
I give VW cudos for a vast improvement in the Jetta TDI. I would certianly turn my own recommendation from a "don't buy" on the '06s and earlier to a "nuetral". There's nothing particularly aggregious in the emissions data, though its not stellar. There does seem to be some validity to the arguments regarding evaporative emissions, although I think they need to be considered in the proper perspective. If you are set on a Jetta I think its definately worth considering vs. the 5 cyl. and almost certainly over the turbo. It seems like you're basically trading not quite as good emissions for lower CO2 and oil consumption. The fuel cost advantage looks to be lost in the higher initial cost and maintenance though. It would be a pretty good competitor against the Camry Hybrid excpet that the Camry is bigger. It would be a pretty good choice vs. the Fit except that the Fit is much cheaper. Probably a better choice than pretty much any American car, and certainly pretty much any SUV (except maybe Escape Hybrid).
If your primary concerns are Energy Independance, Fuel Costs, Total Ownership Cost, Global Climate Change, or Air Quality, I still don't think that the '09 TDI is in the same league as the Prius. Also bear in mind that the Prius is now 5 years old in its current incarnation, and much of it is 10+ year old technology. There is a ground up refresh slated to arrive spring '09 as a '10 model that is somewhat bigger (almost Camry sized), faster, lower emisions, and 10-15% better fuel economy. You might be ready to call BS, but that is exactly what they delivered with the '04 Gen II refresh, so it sounds feasible. The same year we should see a high end Lexus version with similar efficiency, and the larger Prius makes room for a smaller even more efficient mini-Prius. Pluggins are expected to start showing up in fleets in 2010 and general release sometime after that. Seems to me that will make sure the Jetta TDI stays a league down. Now what Honda does next year could be very interesting....
Imagine the 2010 Toyota Prius - Inside Line
Rob
2009 VW Jetta TDI Emissions Results In!
Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by miscrms, Jun 27, 2008.
Comments
Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by miscrms, Jun 27, 2008.
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