2013 Ford Fusion Energi at $39,495, Priced Higher Than Volt!

Remember that economics is not the driver for purchase of hybrids and certainly not for plug ins.

People buy them to use less oil and/or pollute less. To feel one is doing something about oil wars, climate change, oil pollution, etc.

What buyers of hybrids want are features and a good looking car. Much of PriusChat is taken up on trying to make the Prius look good. The Ford Fusion looks GREAT out of the box. Hot wheels. Volts OK but Fusion is more of a real car and real good looking car.

The key is not the price difference but if the Fusion delivers the hybrid and EV miles.

 

i bought a plug in for the fun of driving electric without range anxiety. am i alone?

 

More typical I'd say. You paid a premium for EV which is why the price difference on the Fusion plug in vs. Volt is not really a factor in why one would buy one vs. the other. It would be the fun factor for the buyer.

My Ford Escape Hybrid was $36K. I could have gotten an AWD Subaru with similar mleage for $28K.

 

I doubt it. Last month's Dashboard report showed several thousand were sold in October and tracing back, plug-in sales and do-it-yourself plug-ins have been going on for years.

We are a two-Prius family, 2003 and 2010, and they fully meet our transportation requirements. We do have an electric moped/bicycle but the 10 mile range (measured!) is half of what a practical commuting e-bike needs to accomplish. But I have some plans afoot.

Bob Wilson

 

No, you are not alone. Try a test drive in a full power EV powertrain. You'll really be amazed.

 

not sure what you mean?

 

I bought mine to use EV for around town short frequent trips and HV for longer high speed trips.

PiP works very well and I love it. I am averaging 260 wh/mi (including charging loss) on electricity and 54 MPG on gas.

 

Ford didn't go banko as did GM - due to poor quality ... poor reputation... poor management ... poor union negotiations ... poor mileage vis a vis SUV's etc. Ford wasn't bought out by the Feds's. Ford's bottom line makes sense. GM still has a huge amount of its ownership in the Fed's stock. GM has no intention in giving back its cash in order to buy back its own company. GM can thus sell at a loss. The Volt would cost a lot more, but for the fact that the Fed's back it. Thus, all of us have a stake in the Volt, compared to the C-max. Then again, we have a huge stake in other heavily subsidized items that the Fed's want/need. Abrams tanks ... cruise missles ... spy satelites ... $1,000 toilet seats ... stealth fighters/bombers ... ground troups ... not to mention what ... 16 or 17 trillion debt ... but who's counting. Yes ... GM can sell the Volt for another $20,000 less - and it still won't matter. Not for a while at least.

.

 

True. But.....

"In a Jan. 30, 2009, report on the bailout program, the Congressional Research Service noted that Ford “is counting on $5 billion from the DOE loan program to support a $14 billion plan to reorient its lineup toward more fuel-efficient vehicles.” On June 23, 2009, the Department of Energy announced it would provide $5.9 billion to Ford “to transform factories across Illinois, Kentucky, Michigan, Missouri, and Ohio to produce 13 more fuel efficient models.”

FactCheck.org : Ford Motor Co. Does U-turn on Bailouts

 

I can't believe it. Are the people on this forum really falling for this?
Let's compare apples to apples. The $41k top of the line model, after federal rebates, is just $4k above the equivalent hybrid grade. Take away the CA rebate, and now it's just $2500. This is basically the same pricing as the PiP when it came out. If sales are poor, they'll discount it more toward the end of the year.
Also, comparing this to a Volt is like comparing the Prius to a Corolla. The Fusion seats five and is a midsize sedan, rather than a compact like the Volt.
And look at the features that are actually on the car. This is like a high-end Camry.

 

Of what use is a 200 mile range pure plug in on a 250 mile trip? Of what use if you can't find a refueling station at your comfort stop, if the station is busy or broken, if you are in a hurry, if there is no fueling station on the way? Motor Trend gave their COTY award to such a car. Didn't factor in the expense of installing or cost of the home charging station, BTW.

Yes, it works for 90% of the trips you take. But my wife and I have to go on a 250 mile trip in probably 20 degree weather, stay three places in the big city and then drive 250 miles home. Electric, PriusV, Avalon? Can't do (range anxiety, temperature impact on mileage, lack of filling station infrastructure on the main routes north and south in the East) in the electric. Prius should be no fill ups at 43MPG I'm getting. Avalon 2 comfort stop coordinated with ~$3.199/gal fillups with many options for where and at what price. Three different cars...which is better for the trip? Which is totally impractical?

 

That is a lame argument. You know how many impractical cars there are in this world? One could rent a car/truck for the few times a year that long trips are required. Not to mention the fact that anyone buying a Model S can afford rentals and/or another car.

The Model S deserved the win. It pushed technology in a new direction and showed you can have style and comfort with efficiency.

 

When comes to PHV, some can be blinded by EV range and fall for the hype.

 

yes and no - you may get 50 miles per gallon when you run out of electricity so anxiety is no big deal - but PHEV's with worse mpg's ( especially in winter time) around here apparently have all kinds of anxiety. Gas Anxiety - that dread of having the internal combustion engine turn on. To the detriment of EV drivers - there are way too many PHEV drivers who'll feel the need to top off ... " just in case". The top off will take just an hour - but the charging stall will be blocked by them all day. (Sigh) Ford's PHEV will undoubtedly add to this scenario - due to it's lower mpg's. Once PHEV's get around 50mpg's anyway - the anxiety seems to diminish. Maybe that's due to the similar cost of gas @ 50mpg versus the cost of electricity. Free charging stations only exacerbate this scenerio.

SGH-I717R ? 2

 

this charging station problem could be solved by continuing to charge your credit card after your car finishes charging. might need a sensor to detect if they're still in the parking space tho.

 

actually, both ChargePoint and Blink continue to charge you money after you've completed the charge as long as the charger is still plugged into your car. Of course, there's nothing stopping you from unplugging as soon as it's done and continuing to remain parked there, but it does force you to stop whatever you're doing to come back to the vehicle.

 

This matches my thinking for what a PHEV should be:

. . . reasonable EV range but non-EV efficiency is also important. I'm amazed that an efficient EV vehicle has poor gas-only power mode. The vehicle has already solved problems of rolling and aerodynamic drag which suggests:

• poor engine performance
• poor transmission efficiency

Now if the design reverts to just serial hybrid mode where the engine drives a generator that in turn drives the motor, this would be a poor decision. However, it doesn't need to go 100% engine driven. A smarter set of control laws:

• low-speed and acceleration - EV power
• 30 mph and above - gas power with charge maintenance, tall gears

Another approach might be to divide the EV charge into "n" ranges such as:

• 100-66% SOC - full EV mode
• 66%-33% SOC - blended EV and gas used for warm-up and higher speeds
• 33%-0% SOC - gas primarily and using EV for acceleration

Without my own plug-in to play with the rules, this is just idle speculation. Although it might be fun to model it and run some Monte Carlo simulations.

Bob Wilson

 

Do we know batt size on the FORD PlugIn? But furthermore on your comments, some states such as WV have humongous Plug_in discounts ($7500). Hope FORD has WV as a roll-out state. In the case of WV, the tax credit seems to apply to all Plug-Ins incl. PiP. Some states like PA have $3500 discount if batt size is >10 kwhr.

 

The battery size was discussed above. The $7,500 is not a discount - it's a tax credit ... which means you have to owe that much tax ...so under several circumstances you may not get it ( or you may only qualify for part of the whole amount ). If that doesn't rain on your parade enough - the battery capacity on the Ford is not large enough to qualify for the entire $7,500 amount. ONE nasty trick did GM was doing - Dealerships were buying and selling the Volts back and forth between each other. They would take the tax credit for them self then sell the car to you the consumer. They got a lot of bad press for it.

SGH-I717R ? 2