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Just test driven the Peugeot 3008 diesel hybrid - It's impressive!

Discussion in 'Other Cars' started by GrumpyCabbie, Jan 26, 2012.

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  1. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    Just got back from a test drive of the new Peugeot 3008 diesel hybrid and I must say it's very impressive.

    Details from the manufacturer here;

    Peugeot | Diesel Hybrid Cars | 3008 HYbrid4 , http://www.peugeot.co.uk/Resources/...ot-3008-hybrid4-prices-and-specifications.pdf ,
    Peugeot 3008 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    I was invited down to test drive one of the handful of these new diesel hybrids released in the UK in RHD form. The 3008 is a crossover type vehicle and is quite a popular vehicle in the UK in non hybrid form since release back in 2009. The hybrid version is a 4x4 in that there's a diesel engine at the front and the electric motor powers the rear, though usually any combination of the two.

    Well to cut a long boring story short, it drives just like the Prius, the diesel engine kicking on and off in a very similar manner BUT you can hardly hear it other than if you floor it. The car comes with 200 bhp in total and a 0-60 of about 8 seconds.

    The automatic transmission is an automated manual but this one actually works well and is mostly smooth other than when floored (in a way only a taxi driver can :cool:). Driving round town uses the EV side much more than the Prius and can power the car for 3 miles upto 35 mph. Imagine EV mode, then add about 50% more power to it and you get an idea of the Peugeot electric drive. Regen braking is much more aggressive than the Prius too and more like a Leaf in that letting your foot off allows the car to slow quite quickly and rapidly charging the HV in the process. The Peugeot EV allows you to drive the car in city traffic rather than crawling as in the Prius.

    So all in all it's a European diesel car (diesel being cheaper in most EU Countries - apart from the UK) which does what the Prius does but does it better, in a bigger, nicer put together cabin that has been put together well and with a bigger boot/trunk. It's faster, much more powerful and smooth and quiet. You really can't hear the diesel fire on and off unless you try - a/c off and windows down.

    The car also falls below (only just) the magic 100g/km emission level at 99g/km meaning tax benefits and free road tax in the UK.

    To most people it ticks all the boxes that the Prius does but is more usable in that it is slightly better all round - apart from the price.

    I do have one concern and that's the car seemed to cycle the HV battery much more than Prius and I wonder how this will affect things long term. The dealer didn't know the full specs of the HV battery such as its chemistry or power output so it's hard for me to try and compare the 3 mile EV range against the 1.5 range of the Prius etc.

    Would I get one? Not at the price they're asking BUT they're keen to do a deal with taxi drivers to get the car seen, so you never know ;).

    I seriously think Prius and Toyota might have a competitor here, especially as Peugeot intend offering a hybrid option in most of their range in the coming 18 months.
    2 people like this.
  2. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North Staff Member

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    Thanks for the review!

    On paper, it does seem like a pretty good vehicle but the cycling of the HV battery will be one to watch. The specs say NiMH with a power output of 27kW (37hp), pretty close to the Prius.


    Didn't Johnny test drive one on Fifth Gear?
  3. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    The combination diesel+electric suggests MASSIVE low-end torque. A taxi driver's dream, for sure!

    What is the asking price? What warranty is offered for the hybrid battery?
  4. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    Hmmm this is where it all goes sour.

    Price £26,995 (all in) base model, Prius base £21,055.

    Warranty is only 60,000 for everything including hybrid system. Hmmm. (warranty time limit 3 years car, 5 years hybrid).

    So if the HV battery system is the same size as the Prius yet is used more often, moves the vehicle much faster and has less warranty? My alarm bells are starting to ring. :eek:
  5. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    I'd be curious to see a comparison of specs for the two HV batteries.

    I always found it curious that the Prius has a 1.5 kwh battery and has a max 2 mile EV range. The Prius phev has a 5 kwh battery and goes 14 miles and the Leaf has a 24 kwh battery and goes 100 miles.

    It just doesn't add up to my non physics educated mind that a 1.5 kwh battery only goes 2 miles but a 5 kwh battery goes 14. Shouldn't it be more like 6 or 7 miles for the 5 kwh? And if the same were true then wouldn't the Leaf only manage about 30 miles? Or is the Prius the odd one out and the 1.5 kwh HV battery could move the car about 5 or 6 miles and Toyota have chosen to be ultra cautious limiting it to 1.5 miles?

    If that is correct then Peugeot should be ok with 3 miles, even considering the cycling it experiences. Theoretically it could handle 5 with many many cycles? Or am I on the wrong track?
  6. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

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    al great and great and great
    what about the mpg? the NOX? and dont read anything about the fuel use during your trip? thats what its al about with hybrids not about taxes and no taxes
    thats for me the only reason this car wil be better
    if thats better and if not then its useless to me.

    edit
    seam to be 3.8 litres(dirty diesel)/100 km nothing about NOx
  7. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    Nox is a disgrace. I was very alarmed at the figures when I saw them. But as we all know, in Europe everybody concentrates on the CO2 and not the Nox.

    The Peugeot 3008 Hybrid Nox is 0.154g/km !?!?!
    The UK Prius gen3 Nox is 0.006g/km (actually 0.0058g/km on some websites)

    Prius data obtained from UK Government website; Select a search : Directgov - Car fuel data, CO2 and vehicle tax tools

    Peugeot data obtained from the brochure details handed to me at the test drive; as NOx emissions don't show on the Peugeot website (and I can see why!). Saying that, it's not as bad as the Renault Espace 2.0 diesel auto which produces 0.367g/km! Shocking eh?
  8. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Remember the Prius keeps the SOC between 80% and 40%. SO it is using only about 0.3kwh total. An EV like the Leaf can drain the battery down to zero and be charged up to 100%. Nissan doesn't have a warranty on the battery for lost capacity from use. PHEVs are somewhere between two extremes there. Most on the conservative side.
  9. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    I believe Toyota are fairly cautious about battery usage in the standard hybrid. Given that EV usage has to be paid back by running the engine, the battery is best reserved for its primary tasks: starting the engine, capturing braking energy, and releasing energy for either direct propulsion or power balance (to make the drivetrain CVT-like). I don't believe any hybrid should see regular use in EV mode, apart from pulse/glide or warp stealth going downhill.

    To first order, hybrid battery life depends upon the engineering design for its application: cooling, depth of discharge, maximum rate of charge/discharge, cell balance algorithm. Given your climate, it is hard to imagine you ever having a problem with cooling, which is the #1 source of battery failure in Toyota.

    In a sense, comparing Prius to Peugeot is apples and oranges. Does Toyota sell the Highlander Hybrid in the UK/Europe? That's is a much closer match. I have a feeling that the Peugeot is better in most categories, even price. For example, Gen III base is priced $23,500 for 50 MPG, while the Highlander Hybrid base is priced $38,250 for 28 MPG.

    Here is the warranty section from the brochure. Does this mean 3 years, unlimited miles warranty? Sounds perfect for a cab :)

    All vehicles first registered in the UK and purchased from a UK Peugeot Dealer benefit from a Peugeot 2 year unlimited mileage manufacturer's mechanical warranty and a free optional additional 1 year of warranty provided by the Peugeot Dealer Network in the UK. All electrical drive train components (the hybrid control unit, electric drive machine, high voltage cables and connectors and the traction battery) benefit from a 5 year or 60,000 miles manufacturer warranty.
  10. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    Grumpy,
    Prius is NiMH battery chemistry, while the PiP is Li-ion. Depth of discharge (DoD) is quite different between the two. Prius is 40%, PiP is unknown for now, but other car manufacturers have allowed 60 - 100% DoD in their Li-ion variants.
  11. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    Oh, one caveat for the Peugeot (other than being a Peugeot): how costly is the regular maintenance for the diesel motor? I know on VW TDI, it is a killer.
  12. PriQ

    PriQ CT+iQ

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    It makes sense for Peugeot to push the battery more than Toyota does. You don't buy Peugeot because you want years of trouble free miles (Unless you get a 107). The extra drainage of the battery can give it a perceived advantage to Prius, so it's definitely worth it for the car maker - especially if they can dodge any warranty issues on the batteries. GG.
  13. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

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    :eek::eek::eek::eek: 0,154g/km wow thats high:eek::eek::eek:.:eek:..:eek::eek:
    thats a BIG bummer.:(
    but then again better then a NON hybrid diesel
  14. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    I didn't quote mpg's as I didn't bother looking. The manufacturers figures are pretty good, but I also hammered the car at some points which would destroy any mpg figures. When driving in town (30 mph limits) the car was on electric virtually all the time, even when pulling out of junctions and away from traffic lights. The engine only kicked in when I floored it or when the battery eventually got low. The regen was very aggressive, even when you just let your foot off the accelerator - much more than the Prius. The Peugeot drove almost as if it were a plug in and the HV topped up quite quickly when braking or coasting. It was this aggressive cycling that also concerns me.

    The warranty is unlimited mileage for the first couple years and to be fair the local Peugeot dealers were very helpful for warranty claims when I had my last Peugeot some years ago. But the worry is after the first couple years when the problems might start to show themselves. If they did good lease terms it might be worth a punt.

    Servicing costs for a diesel are not expensive over here as diesels make up 50% of cars and dealers are set up for them.

    I would say that the diesel engine transition from EV was very quiet as is the diesel engine when running. No clunks, bumps or bangs as I'd imagined.

    No we don't get the Highlander or Highlander hybrid. We get the Rav4 and then a small Land Cruiser 150 Prado (sold as a Lexus GX460 in the US) and then the bigger Land Cruiser Amazon. SUV's are becoming less popular so having this many in their lineup is considered a high number.
  15. telmo744

    telmo744 HSD fanatic

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    Peugeot, known for a not good reliability for the past decade, has in this model some other concerns.
    Diesel "cold" on-off (bit new for PSA) and hybrid train (as GrumpyCabbie expressed)...
    Adding the complexity of a diesel engine (turbo, FAP, etc.) with the automatic gearbox...
    I think I'll pass for now, and wait for real numbers before being pro-hybrid4...
    1 person likes this.
  16. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North Staff Member

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    Like seilerts said, Toyota is being overly cautious with battey management and it has certainly paid off. The Prius' battery has been very reliable and has low failure rates.While Toyota has always gotten flack for being an ultra conservative company, I'd say battery management is probably one area I'm glad that they're being conservative!

    While more EV range is nice, the standard Prius is really all about combining the best of both worlds and not relying heavily on one or the other. The PiP can take care of the EV side of things!
  17. Bodgerx

    Bodgerx Junior Member

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    It would be interesting to get some real world MPG on this.

    I was fairly excited about this car (apart from its looks) until I saw the Autocar test - I think they said the economy was little better than the standard diesel ver...
  18. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    But their reports also say the Prius is c**p and doesn't get the mpg's it's advertised for. As we all know this is wrong.

    I did say that the Peugeot heavily uses the electric drive in town use - more than the Prius, so should get good town mileage. It also has an aggressive regen and did charge the HV battery up quite quickly.

    Give them a ring and arrange a test drive, they're dead keen. If you get a small bloke from Peugeot head office who looks a lot like Joe Pasquale then say hi from me :)
  19. Bodgerx

    Bodgerx Junior Member

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    :)

    Yeah, I think the official figure is 70+ which in itself is better than the std diesel version. Plus, you are getting 200bhp. Given the amount of space the car has, it's impressive. Not cheap though...may give it go regardless - deadly!
  20. krouebi

    krouebi 2012 Peugeot 3008 HYbrid4

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    Hi there,

    Well, we also went for a test drive in the 3008 HYbrid4 - and from mid/end April, 2012, our 2007 Gen 2 Prius will be replaced by a 3008 HYbrid4 Limited Edition :rockon:.

    Our future vehicle will be one of the 300 one-offs that were pre-launched via the Internet back in March 2011 (all gone in less than 3 days). This version has a couple of features that will not be available on the regular production versions, most importantly a full-leather covered dashboard and door panels, which transforms the interior to near-Audi level. Finishing and equipment is, I'm sorry to say, a VAST improvement compared to both Gen 2 and particularly Gen 3 Prii. Close the door of the 3008, and by the sound of it you'd think it was a traditional Mercedes.

    It's the local dealer's demo vehicle - which was the only way to get a "Limited Edition" - and we managed to get a nice discount: instead of 40 K EUR we'll be taking it home for 32 K, including tax.

    We look forward to this vehicle - and will of course report here about our experience with it.
    1 person likes this.
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