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    spwolf Senior Member

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    European Toyota Media Site - News


    At worst, around 10% lesser mpg than standard Prius, which is really good.
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    bisco cookie crumbler

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    did they change it from the v to the +?
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    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    v = North America = NiMH = 5 seats
    + = Europe = LiON = 7 seats
    Alpha = Japan = LiON = 5 or 7 seats

    I think
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    spwolf Senior Member

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    yep.... although it seems like some euro countries will get their own naming scheme, like netherlands
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    bisco cookie crumbler

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    wow, seems like were getting ripped off.:(
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    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    My Theory: They can't sell LiON profitably in CARB states, 10 year/150,000 mile warranty, so none of the states get it. NiMH is bulkier so it has to go in what would be the third row foot wells. LiON is in the center console.
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    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North

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    Not really. Take a look at the cargo area and imaginea 3rd row there. Assuming that the bin & battery is the floor so you're roughly sitting at the height of the cargo area. You also lose centre console box space as the Li-Ion battery sits between the front seats. You just get a wallet-sized holder.

    The Alpha is available in bth 5 and 7-seat configurations.
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    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    But you do get the flexibility of a larger Prius with the option for 2 extra childrens seats if needed and still get superb fuel economy.

    Why the negatives about LiON battery? It won't last in Carb states eh? Well you better worry when the Prius PHEV comes out then. Anyhow the Prius+ sounds great - you get good mpg's (below the magic 100g/km), have the ease of a Prius to drive and you get large luggage capacity or the option for 2 extra seats if needed. Sounds like it'll be a seller.
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    cwerdna Senior Member

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    I do wish we'd get the 7 seater li-ion version. As for CARB states, well, AT-PZEV hybrids have 10 year/150K mile HV battery warranties.

    The Volt ('11 didn't meet emissions requirements SULEV/AT-PZEV requirements) and Leaf have only 8 year/100K mile li-ion battery warranties. I can't speak to the Volt, but the Leaf has no warranty on battery capacity...

    I do wonder what sort of battery warranty will be provided on the PHV Prius.
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    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    Firstly this is just my theory, and secondly it just shows a difference in strategy, Toyota is making cars that meets the toughest pollution standards, GM and Nissan are not. I do not see either as 'better' than the other, but they WILL produce different cars.
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    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    I have not done extensive multi-year testing on a PHV, but I bet the typical HV battery usage of a PHV is somehow different than the HV Battery usage on a 'all gas' hybrid. I have no clue about 'better' or 'worse' but I do predict 'different'
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    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

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    I think the owner manual for the prototype lists 10 years / 150k miles warranty for the battery.

    CARB also listed it as Enhanced ATPZEV so it has to have 10 years / 150k miles warranty.

    We'll have to wait for the production version but it should not change.
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    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North

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    Methinks it's to do with cost (and probably the same reason why the new Camry Hybrid doesn't have a lot of toys). Toyota doesn't want to sell a $40k Prius even if it has Li-Ion batteries. (PHV not withstanding if it actually touches $40k lol). Most people would look at the Prius v then say, well i'm gonna get a loaded Sienna. It's much bigger and has way more luxurious features to justify the mpg difference (stuff like dual moonroofs, 2nd row "ottomans", rear sunshade (even though there's tinted windows), tri-zone climate control, leather trim and HIDs.

    In Europe, it's easier to sell a more expensive vehicle since you're used to having a higher purchase price. Toyota has more flexibility in providing available features.

    Here, even if the Prius v started at $27k or whatever the price is, people would focus on the $40k price tag of a 7-seat Prius v instead of the base price which won't help sales.

    That's just my guess.
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    hill High Fiber Member

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    Easy now . . . Nissan's Altima hybrid is SULEV . . . . . and then there's the Leaf . . . . I'm just sayin' NO company wants to get lumped into the GM bin.
    ;)

    .
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    amm0bob Permanently Junior...

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    :pray:
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    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    They also shortchanged us in the past on goodies (EV button).
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    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North

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    True but they've also given us goodies and a low price (e.g. HIDs on the Gen 2 were not available anywhere else except for one special edition in 2007 in Japan). US prices are the lowest in the world for a Prius.
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    spwolf Senior Member

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    $50k for base Prius here :).
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    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North

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    Exactly. Even though the starting price for the 2010 Prius L in Japan was close to the US$22,000 price in the US, it was a stripped out model.
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    evnow Active Member

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    Well the "toughest" standards are the completely watered down CARB standards after a lot of lobbying. Only Nissan Leaf meets the original ZEV standard.

    Various superlatives like Super, Ultra are a joke.

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