electric miles are more costly than gas miles???

It's good to keep pointing out regardless. Toyota directly addressed owner feedback and delivered well.

 

I assume your $0.02/kWh is calculated considering your electric bill cost divided by Total consumption (pv and PGE). The lowest midnight to 7am PGE rates are around $0.038/kWh. And don't forget the $0.14/day connection/delivery charges.

 

Gas here in northern Jersey, just dipped below $ 3.00

 

This is somewhat of an aside...but I personally don't think we will ever see gas over $5 per gallon (as a national average) and maybe not much over $4. Even though there is a worldwide increase in oil usage there will be a continued move to more efficient vehicles many of which will be EV which will obviously bring demand down...thus keeping the status quo on prices. Totally my opinion though...it could very well be wrong.

 

You can only do the calculations on averages over many miles. But certainly for short trips, EV miles still make sense for you. If you drive just 1 or 2 miles for a particular trip, EV is best, based on your personal experience with the warmup of the ICE, correct?
Even if every trip you take is long (say 10 or 20 miles or more), you still start every trip with some stop and go before you get the ICE warmed up. If you can use EV miles instead it is a win. Sitting at a red light with the ICE on to warm it up is not efficient. If instead you are driving while the ICE is warming up your gas mpg will increase as well because you used highly efficient EV for the portion of your drive where you would have been sitting still with the ICE on.

Mike

 

The ICE (internal combustion engine) only warms up when it is on. The idea is to not have the ICE run at all until you are on a stretch of road where you will not be stopping (for a few miles). This is the most efficient way to allow the ICE to warm up.

Mike

 

While we are on this topic....
What would you guys say is the absolute ideal speed to be going during ICE warmup? I would assume that speed would start somewhat slow and then be around 40-50 right before the ICE is ready to shut off?

 

Even though it doesn't contribute much the ICE can contribute to some propulsion during it's warmup cycle.

 

electric miles are more costly than gas miles??

Spoiler Alert:
Yes.
Nearly always.
BUT
Electric miles are also very nearly always greener.
People generally drive electric for either selfish or selfless reasons. That's why the social engineers have to bribe (or reward) 'lectric drivers with tax kickbacks, HOV access, etc.
Some people do it just because that's how they roll.
Others are posers.
Most probably really could give a rats.

You'll always have the cheerleaders and the haters with the daffy formulas and reams of data cleverly disguised as "facts" but today...for right now....that's how it shakes out.

Go figure.
The one advantage of the current setup (pun almost unintended) is that you can use the posers money (less the kickbacks) to fuel (pun definitely unintended) development in dragging the 'give a rats' people into a greener utopian future....or a Government-gone-wild dystopian future if you're one of the haters.

 

It's not bad. It's just not the best choice.

The engine warms up most efficiently under load, which naturally happens while it is providing thrust for the wheels. Fortunately, load still occurs even while sitting. The engine runs the generator, which replenishes the battery.

Plan ahead. If you can avoid warm-up while not in motion, great. If you can't, overall MPG won't be as good, but it will still be better than what a hybrid without a plug can deliver.

 

My housemate, at my suggestion, starts the car in HV mode to start the ICE for her commute. She only lets it sit for a minute, then drives it at modest speeds (less than 35MPH) until it's warm, then switches to EV, having warmed up the interior of the car. This is probably the way to do it in Winter. For short trips she leaves it in EV mode and uses the seat heater.

 

Problem with this method is that your battery is already full and the ICE can't put any extra energy back into the battery, which would obviously be the case if it is just sitting there for a full minute.

Starting the engine and just sitting there is never the answer.

 

Hi.. okay I am at my desktop so I can pull my spreadsheet. I have the following info based upon my charge rates from Southern California Edison (note these rates were entered into the spreadsheet when I purchased the vehicle, and rates may have changed as I have not checked them).

Tier 1: $0.12/kwh | 2.7 kWh | 13.5 miles | $0.324 Cost per charge (CPC) | $0.024 Cost per Mile (CPM) | $1.20 Cost per 50 Miles
Tier 2: $0.16 | 2.7 | 13.5 m | $0.432 CPC | $0.032 CPM | $1.60 CP50M
Tier 3: $0.27 | 2.7 | 13.5 m | $0.729 CPC | $0.054 CPM | $2.70 CP50M
Tier 4: $0.31 | 2.7 | 13.5 m | $0.837 CPC | $0.062 CPM | $3.10 CP50M
Petrol/Gasoline: $3.80 | N/A | 50 m | N/A | $0.076 CPM | $3.80 CP50M

Please correct me if my figures are wrong.. the 2.7 kWh is the full charge I witnessed going from 20% soc to 85% soc using a charge point charging station. I estimate 13.5-15 miles of surface street driving (40 mph and under) for the EV range.

 

Also note.. I get free charging at work and there are a few free locations still located around Southern California.. you just need to know where they are and get there before the campers do.

 

It is very simple...the engine gets warm due to waste* heat. You can produce the waste heat while idling...thus doing nothing in term sof propelling the car, or you can produce waste heat while driving and getting somewhere.
And, yes, if you are idling and the battery isn't full the car will use the engine to charge the battery...so its not a total loss. However, using the engine to charge the battery isn't the most efficient...and if you are justing starting a trip, presumably the battery will be full.
Again, the Prius and the Prius plugin are already pretty much optimized if you do nothing but drive it. These are all tips of how to get an extra 5 or 10% efficiency.

* it is "waste" heat because in a perfect (not possible) thermodynamic system all the heat created goes towards moving the car. Of course we enjoy some of the waste heat to warm the cabin. And the catalytic converter uses waste heat to remove harmful emissions.

Mike