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2016 Prius Eco

Discussion in 'Gen 4 Prius Main Forum' started by Gokhan, Sep 9, 2015.

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  1. UsedToLoveCars

    UsedToLoveCars Active Member

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    uh - I believe the VW XL1 got about 120mpg on diesel only.
     
    #121 UsedToLoveCars, Sep 25, 2015
  2. civicdriver06

    civicdriver06 Active Member

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    Yes on paper it did....
     
    #122 civicdriver06, Sep 25, 2015
  3. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    paper is an energy source.
     
    #123 bisco, Sep 25, 2015
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  4. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    When I made that introduction, I was mainly referring to the thermal efficiency of the engine, not the MPG.

    VW has made many claims regarding their diesels, and now that it's all exposed, we know that none of them are true.

    Toyota's Atkinson cycle seems more efficient than the diesel cycle, at least for automotive applications. Also, given that VW XL1 has such a small engine, highway mileage would be poor, lowering the actual MPG greatly.

    On paper, that's for sure. My guess: Given that the diesel Golf gets 36 MPG in EPA tests that are very close to real-world driving, XL1 would get 40, perhaps 45 MPG. Its highway mileage would probably be worse than the Golf, as the 1 L diesel engine would be running in a very inefficient region with the car doing 65 MPH.
     
    #124 Gokhan, Sep 26, 2015
  5. energyandair

    energyandair Active Member

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    Not from what I've read.

    My impression is that at least one claim is untrue and that VW can't be trusted.

    Being untrustworthy means that other claims could well be false also but I don't know that they are.
     
    #125 energyandair, Sep 26, 2015
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  6. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    That has to qualified with "in a hybrid". Without the electric, or even hydraulic, motors to supplement the ICE, most people would pass on the reduced power output of an Atkinsonized engine. With their low torque range, a diesel can give the efficiency and the power alone.
     
    #126 Trollbait, Sep 26, 2015
  7. frodoz737

    frodoz737 Top Wrench

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    I can hardly wait for the problems ULS gasoline causes.
     
    #127 frodoz737, Sep 26, 2015
  8. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    The only effect of ULS gasoline I'm aware of is that oil life increases due to less acid build-up from sulfation and therefore engine life increases as well. You can also increase valve life in direct-ignition engines by using less detergent in the oil (low-SAPS oils) as there is less acid to neutralize. Less detergent reduces ash deposits on the valves that results from burning of the detergent. Low SAPS also helps with emissions, catalytic-converter life, oxygen-sensor life, and especially the diesel-particulate-filter life. We've had ULS gasoline in California for decades and it's time for the rest of the US.
     
    #128 Gokhan, Sep 26, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2015
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  9. UsedToLoveCars

    UsedToLoveCars Active Member

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    on paper it was supposed to make over 200mpg.

    the production version got 120.
     
    #129 UsedToLoveCars, Sep 26, 2015
  10. UsedToLoveCars

    UsedToLoveCars Active Member

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    wikipedia claims 40% thermal efficiency for diesels, 38% for atkinson. Too close to say which is more efficient than the other.

    though diesels will never be good engines for hybrids because they are more sensitive to engine temperature to get peak efficiency.
     
    #130 UsedToLoveCars, Sep 26, 2015
  11. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    Well, Generation 4 Prius engine for the core model is said to be over 40% efficient. The Prius Eco engine could be even more efficient.
     
    #131 Gokhan, Sep 26, 2015
  12. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Not likely. Most fuel efficient trims involve areo tweaks and weight reduction, maybe different gear ratios in a traditional transmission. If the engine is more efficient, why not spread the costs and put it in all the trims.

    Toyota's new small(2.8L?) diesel has 48% efficiency.
     
    #132 Trollbait, Sep 27, 2015
  13. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

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    The "eco" in Prius eco stands for "economy", not "eco friendly". It's a "stripper". For those on a budget. Yup, the stripped down models often do get better mileage. But that is not usually the reason for their existence.

    So the Prius eco won't be doing things any differently than the other models, it will just have no options installed.

    At least that is my understanding based on what Toyota has officially said, reported on this forum.
     
    #133 David Beale, Sep 27, 2015
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  14. TCW1184

    TCW1184 Junior Member

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    I'm interested to get official specs. I'm pretty consistently getting 58-61 mpg range in my gen 3. Logic says a gen 4 rated for 60 could see close to 70.


    iPad ?
     
    #134 TCW1184, Sep 27, 2015
  15. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

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    Peak efficiency figure means nothing if the operating line can't be maintained there. HSD does a superior job than step gears in Diesel.
     
    #135 usbseawolf2000, Sep 27, 2015
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  16. GasperG

    GasperG Senior Member

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    44% is the correct number, but Hilux with that engine suposedly gets only marginaly better fuel economy than previous 3.0 model on NEDC:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    #136 GasperG, Sep 27, 2015
  17. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Ken1784 is posting some interesting information regarding the ECO model in this thread:

    Gen 4 Staff Manual (In Japanese) =/ Specs/Design/Other Info | Page 4 | PriusChat

    In post #67, he lists ECO model deletions, aimed at saving weight. Some of them quite severe: no height adjustement of front seats, and no rear spoiler for example.

    Reading the link (in the same posting), it seems the main, maybe sole reason for the ECO model is to have a lighter model which puts the car in a more favourable mpg testing regime?
     
    #137 Mendel Leisk, Sep 28, 2015
  18. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    No rear stabilizer bar. The spoiler is still there (part of the body design).
     
    #138 Tideland Prius, Sep 28, 2015
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  19. giora

    giora Senior Member

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    I doubt if we see the E grade 'as is' out of Japan.
     
    #139 giora, Sep 28, 2015
  20. nagrath

    nagrath Member

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    WAIT A MINUTE! Isn't that ~75mpg US?
     
    #140 nagrath, Oct 5, 2015
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