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Long Drive Question

Discussion in 'Prime Fuel Economy & EV Range' started by Russ Bohn, Jul 23, 2017.

  1. Russ Bohn

    Russ Bohn Junior Member

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    Planning a 450 mile trip from Overland Park, KS to Memphis, TN next week.

    Best relaxing route we have found is through west central Missouri down to Springfield, then east to Mammoth Spring, AK (this drive is flat to long rolling hills terrain) then, in north central Arkansas you have "mountains" for a while, then Mississippi flat land to Memphis. (this route is preferred to the white knuckle, I-70, I-55 route, Dennis Weaver's "Duel") There may be minimal driving in Memphis and probably not the ability to plug in.

    I have had my Advanced for three weeks now and still learning ......Previous car was Prius 2007 Touring....

    Will leave with full charge and full tank of gas.

    I have to add the wife will be in the car and she does not want me to fiddle with "settings" and I don't need her Jim Morrison lecture about,
    "keep your eyes on the road - your hands upon the wheel,....
    The future's uncertain, and the end is always near...."

    Aside from getting a new co-pilot... What should be the driving "mode" I set the car in for the best mileage and frame of mind?

    Or should I on the sly, just adjust according to the type of terrain
    Long rolling hills
    North Arkansas mountains
    Delta flatland

    Should I just leave the settings in Eco - EV Auto mode, set the cruise control once on the interstate at 70 mph and ferrrrrrrget about it?
    Outside temperatures will range from 80 to close to 100 degrees F during the trip, both back and forth.

    I searched previous threads and found the following to be possible good advice.

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    from #19 PT Guy, Apr 22, 2017
    There is the battery vs. engine operation. EV is all battery. HV is almost all engine. EV Auto lets the car's computer decide when to use the battery (if the battery still has some charge) and when to use the engine. If you have EV switched on and the battery becomes depleted, the car will switch itself to HV. Try EV Auto for your trip--and it'll still switch itself to HV when it needs to do so.

    There is Econ vs. Normal vs. Power modes. This is just the programming of the accelerator pedal. Econ gives little power for a bit of pedal travel. Power gives lots of power for the same pedal travel. Normal splits the difference. There ain't no free lunch. At the end of the pedal travel Econ gives more power for the pedal travel. Power doesn't have it to give--you get little added power. And, Normal splits the difference. Econ will give a bit longer battery life or burn a bit less gas. Power helps safely scoot into gaps in traffic. Set it how you prefer.
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
     
  2. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Use ECO in HV mode for long trips.

    Save EV mode for driving off the highway.

    Take advantage of CHARGE mode when you know EV driving later would be beneficial.
     
    #2 john1701a, Jul 23, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
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  3. Mark57

    Mark57 2021 Tesla Model 3 LR AWD

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    You've asked a great question and one that I'm interested in learning the answer to so I can use it when mine arrives.

    Regarding Econ vs. Normal vs. Power modes. 100% throttle is 100% throttle (stomping it to the floor) no matter which mode you are in. The mode shift the mapping in between, but the modes are not all just about throttle mapping. They do effect your A/C's ability to use of power. It was 103° here yesterday. I put mine in Power mode for a few minutes to give the A/C a kick and then back to Eco which is where I drive it.

    Have a great trip and let us know how it went when you get back.
     
  4. Prius Maximus

    Prius Maximus Senior Member

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    My advice? Just drive. Don't worry about settings. I'd limit adjustments to what John said above.

    You'll chew up gas going up those Arkansas hills but gain electrons coming back down. They're not monster mountains anyway, not like the Rockies.

    My one bit of really good advice-- when passing through West Plains, AK, do NOT stop for food at the Huddle House. I made that mistake once.
     
  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Personal style:
    • Fully inflate tires and bring quality music.
    • Use one tripmeter for the tank or trip (B) and the other for segments (A).
    • Normal mode - ECO is a little slow to respond and PWR is too fidgety but this personal style.
    • EV as it will convert to HV by itself.
    • Find a 'pace' vehicle and set cruise control.
    • Use "CHARGE" mode should the low-fuel light comes on, you have about 100 miles to get gas.
    Post the trip results when done and what worked for you.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  6. Chaughten

    Chaughten New Member

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    What's your psi prefernce?
     
  7. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Start with maximum sidewall embossed on the tire, 44 psi. Then during the trip, discuss tire pressure effects on ride (harder), handling (more precise), and efficiency (higher) with the copilot. The tires will be coolest at the maximum sidewall pressure which leaves the tires less subject to heat-induced failure.

    At the first rest stop, offer to reduce the relative tire pressures ~5 psi. While driving, tires heat up which increases the internal pressure above what you'd started with. Then you can observe the change in ride, handling, and if using a trip meter for segments, efficiency. On the trip, you can safely reduce the relative pressure another ~5 psi but no more. (*)

    After the car has been parked at least four hours, it is safe to set them to the door jam pressure. Then note the final change in ride, handling, and efficiency. Driving couple of city miles to an air filling station can still be treated as 'cold' for inflation.

    As tire pressure is reduced, they get warmer in operation. At maximum side wall, the tires can be as much as 10F cooler because of the reduced rolling drag:
    [​IMG]
    SUMMARY
    • Maximum sidewall - tires will be coolest in operation; ride hardest; handling most precise; lowest drag
    • Door jam pressure - tires will run warmer (~7-10F); ride easiest; handling a little less precise; highest drag
    Anything in between is OK.

    Bob Wilson

    * - The Firestone and Ford tire controversy - Wikipedia rollover accidents, many fatal, were traced to insufficient tire pressure that let them run too hot and fail. Heat weakens the tires more than the stress of maximum sidewall pressure which runs cooler.
     
    #7 bwilson4web, Jul 23, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
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  8. Russ Bohn

    Russ Bohn Junior Member

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    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    Not to be picky, but it's West Plains, MO. I am sure the Mizzou'rians would consider being part of Arkansas an insult. :cool:
    As an aside, between Springfield and West Plains, there is a considerable stretch where Amish or Mennonites run their horse and buggies along side the lanes where cars and semi's are doing 70 mph. At times you see them way up ahead trying to race across the highway from a crossroad, Now that's white knuckle! With having to travel like that, I cut them some slack when I see a horse and buggy parked at a McDonalds.

    I have made this drive many times (visiting grand children) and I do recall seeing the Huddle House in West Plains. I am good at remembering trivia, what I should remember, not so much. By the way, viewing the inter-webs today (thank you, GW Bush!) I see the Huddle House is now permanently closed. What did you do to it!

    West Plains is the sweet spot in the drive where its time to eat lunch. We stumbled upon Kings Garden Buffet, not too bad, and it's my kind of place because when you approach the front door there is a large hand written sign on it that says, "We are NOT responsible for accidents inside or outside of the restaurant....... Nice!

    As for the drive, will probably use Eco or Normal mode, and HV.
     
  9. Russ Bohn

    Russ Bohn Junior Member

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    At times during the drive there are long downhill stretches, should I put the car in Charge Mode when going down these long hills?
     
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  10. Russ Bohn

    Russ Bohn Junior Member

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    I saw you post about inflating the tires to max. Is this going to affect wear on the tires? My 2007 Touring I added more air than stated on the door sill and they wore out faster. Also, I don't think the co-pilot will appreciate letting air out along the journey. It's going to be bad enough with me testing out the lane departure features and the auto emergency braking (maybe not that feature!).

    We are on the same page about find a pace vehicle, maybe a state trooper!

    Does not Charge Mode use MORE gas when running, which will drain the tank faster as you are running on empty?

    As for the Quality Music, I do miss not having my 6 changer CD Player, With my XM streaming on the phone, you can have a special Tom Petty's Buried Treasure channel and such.... Is there an easy way to get this from my phone to the Advanced' audio system. Eventhough it is "jbl" it really doesn't sound that great. Years ago, I had an "Eagle Talon" with an Infinity Sound System in it, I have not had a car since with such sound. Really crappy car though, transmission broke at 12,000 miles in zero degree weather, near the middle of no-ware.
     
  11. CharlesH

    CharlesH CA HOV Decal #5 on former PiP

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    I don't see what that would gain. Regeneration from going down long hills already goes into the battery. I think that pretty much the only scenario for using CHARGE mode is to put charge into the battery when you know that you will be in a low speed stop-and-go situation later in your trip, where EV mode is very efficient. Except for some very specific conditions, it makes no sense to use the ICE to charge the battery to later move the car, rather than using the ICE directly to move the car; conversions losses get you.
     
    #11 CharlesH, Jul 23, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  12. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I found there was very close to one gallon remaining when the low fuel light went on BUT you do not get an exact metric of how much remains. I recommend converting some of that gas to battery SOC because that is accurately measured. When the last of the gas is burned, you will have 20 miles to find a safe place to stop and solve the refueling problem. Run out of gas with no SOC and the car becomes an inertial mass.

    Happily, a warmed up Prime will maximum convert a fraction of the gas to 80% charge.

    Bob Wilson
     
  13. Prius Maximus

    Prius Maximus Senior Member

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    Yeah I meant MO but had AK on my mind. We've been stopping at skillets cafe in west plains.

    Huddle house. Bad service. Poor food. The smoking section was in no meaningful way separated from the non smoking. Hadn't noticed they closed, but no great loss IMO.
     
  14. Russ Bohn

    Russ Bohn Junior Member

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    We will give Skillets a try! Nothing like a 2 to 5,000 calorie lunch!
     
  15. JamesBurke

    JamesBurke Senior Member

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    Flew this route with Google Earth/ Street view. Looks like a 95% HV drive. 4 lane 55 to 70 mph with some 55 to 65 2 lane roads. Nice open grass/farm land. Few stoplights. Hills are only 2 to 3% max and only a few miles long and are in just a small part of the drive. EV for the beginning and ending neighborhoods and for the pit stops and maybe for slow traffic or construction zones. No real EVAuto uphills or downhill regens. HV will just stack the small amount excess charge. So maybe make sure to have used ~10% EV before the Mountain Grove area. Remember Charge Mode works below and up to 80% EV battery capacity.
     
  16. Russ Bohn

    Russ Bohn Junior Member

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    Finished the drive today. About 1,000 miles with overall 54.9 mpg. I drove without worrying to much about gas mileage.
    I suspect one could get better mpg, if they do not use cruise control and pay attention to maximizing mileage. On the trip down to Memphis, I mainly used ECO HV with cruise control going 75 mph.

    In the hills/mountains south of Mammoth Springs, Arkansas, I used Normal Mode and no cruise. This was the very fun to drive, as the car handles quite well and can accelerate well when necessary. Here I got about 61 mpg.

    On the return trip, I used Normal Mode and HV. I was not liking the responsiveness of the car in ECO mode with cruise control on. I am thinking cruise control does not optimize the car's mpg?

    Left with full battery and ran Battery only in Memphis. Return trip had about 4 miles left on the battery, which I kept almost all the way, but in hour 7 of the trip, I stopped to get gas, forgetting car defaults to battery mode and accelerated up to 75 mph quickly to get going in traffic. Battery quickly went to less than 0.5 miles remaining.

    Great riding car, responsive, somewhat quiet, (I bet those low rolling resistance tires make alot more noise then a normal tire?).

    QUESTION. How does the car know the speed limit changes which is posted in the HUD and the smaller screen with the compass in the dash display. For the most part, it was very accurate and I was surprised how fast it corrected itself.

    About Skillets in West Plains, MO, it was a very good mom and pop cafe. They must have 15 different types of home baked pies available. I had Rhubarb Pie with real chunks of Rhubarb in it. They had a chocolate pecan pie which looked quite decadent, next trip!
     
    #16 Russ Bohn, Jul 31, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2017
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  17. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Excellent review.
    Cruise control is driver relief ... so you can enjoy the trip.
    The indicated, navigation mph comes from the database. We have construction going on and it does not read the posted signs like our BMW i3-REx does.

    Bob Wilson
     
  18. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    In US-spec cars, it's in the map database.