LiBSU - Redesigning the "Battery Support Unit" to Support Lithium

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Technical Discussion' started by mudder, Jun 7, 2024.

  1. A.J

    A.J Junior Member

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    I really wish this can come to life sooner. Because i need a new battery pack for my Gen 3 and wish to use Lithium if there is a proper solution out there.
     
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  2. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    You want the Sodium ion battery.

     
  3. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    I would also prefer Mudder's engineered lithium solution over any other new aftermarket pack when it is available.

    Otherwise I would go new oem (which is sometimes available at similar costs as aftermarket) or mix and match used for short term if necessary.
     
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  4. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    ha ha ha ha ha ha
    redesign the wheel... stay in the past... :rolleyes::rolleyes:o_Oo_O
     
  5. Rami Boul

    Rami Boul Junior Member

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    can you please give information how to decipher these data?
     
  6. mudder

    mudder Active Member

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    Not yet... I'll release it eventually, but not anytime soon. For now you'll need to reverse engineer the data structure yourself. My color coding in that image is quite helpful as you begin your journey.
     
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  7. mudder

    mudder Active Member

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    Here's what 12 square inches of cross sectional airflow looks like from the pack bottom:
    12sqin.jpg

    LiBSU's pack has 40% more cross sectional airflow than OEM.
    In fact, the OEM air plenum's cross section is only 8 square inches, so that'll be the limiting airflow factor.
     
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  8. mikesozin

    mikesozin Junior Member

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    I'm just curious, why'd you decide to cram all the components into the OEM metal ECU case, especially since there's so much room on both sides (the red space in the pic)? Plus, you could totally fit all the blocks instead of just one blade (the green space in the pic), and I bet the lithium pack would be way shorter than the stock NiMh. Anyway, I'm super excited to buy your product and I really think you're on the right track!
     

    Attached Files:

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  9. mudder

    mudder Active Member

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    Great questions, Mike!
    Several reasons:
    -I wanted to retain the wire harnesses, connectors, and mechanical enclosure in their OEM locations.
    -Simplifies installation and reduces cost.
    -I didn't need additional space.
    -Fun challenge.

    I think you're suggesting placing the BMS computer inside one of the blade widths?
    I didn't explore this idea, primarily because it would require lengthening the OEM wire harness.

    Yes, the 'LiBlade' lithium modules I designed form a pack that is shorter than the OEM blade length, while also delivering more energy than OEM. Specifically, replicating the OEM voltage range leaves QTY7 OEM blade widths empty (~14 cm).
    However, we might as well fill that empty space to increase pack voltage, which will increase power output if we spoof the voltage lower... QTY9 LiBlades yields 72S, but I don't yet know how well the inverter hardware will tolerate that voltage. Certainly the car tolerates 60S and 64S in my testing so far.

    I'm having a good time... can't wait to share more.
     
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  10. mikesozin

    mikesozin Junior Member

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    I checked, all the wires can easily reach the first blade's space. Maybe later you'll add more features like grid charging, etc., and this space could be useful. Plus, it'll get extra airflow from the main fan.

    By the way, I saw around 270v on the battery sometimes during braking.
     
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  11. mudder

    mudder Active Member

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    I like the concept of a complete pack that doesn't require a separate computer and cable (in the BSU's OEM enclosure). This streamlines some of the annoyances involved with the existing BSU enclosure.
    Probably (edit: no, definitely) worth re-investigating on my end.

    Thanks for the tip/concept.

    With a "BMS blade" in slot 1, I could change from:
    -"external modular expansion via ribbon cables", to;
    -"internal modular cards that insert into said BMS blade".

    This is probably due to high NiMH pack ESR. For example, a pack with 500 mOhm ESR would increase 30 volts during 60 amp regen. In general, the Gen3 Prius tries to keep the pack below 240 volts.
     
    #111 mudder, Feb 18, 2026 at 6:37 PM
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2026 at 6:50 PM
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