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Can windshield camera be accessed after a crash?

Discussion in 'Prime Main Forum (2017-2022)' started by dlddvm, Dec 3, 2018.

  1. dlddvm

    dlddvm Junior Member

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    So on Nov. 17th my (less than 4 mos old) Prime Plus and I were hit nearly head on by a driver who had crossed into my lane on a two-lane road. I was approaching the leftward curve going close to 55 but cannot remember whether I had the cruise engaged. Suddenly she was in my lane in a really big car. She corrected to her right, and I tried to swerve a little right but there was no shoulder, and bang! We were dead stopped in the ditch in only a couple seconds. She was spun into the opposite ditch. Everyone was okay in both cars except for airbag bruises (thank you Toyota safety engineers!).

    I finally got in touch with her insurance agent today only to learn she was claiming it wasn't her fault and she was not in my lane. The divots in the asphalt in my lane show right where we hit, and the trooper saw that right away when he looked over the area. He told both myself and the other driver that it was the other driver's fault. I guess she has reasons for maintaining her story. P1100120.JPG

    What I want to know is whether the camera on the windshield that helps with lane departure and pre-collision is accessible to me or Toyota or law enforcement in case her insurance company wants to fight. Does it store any useful information? Does the onboard computer act like an airplane black box?

    The car is still at the collision center until this is all worked out, but has been totalled, and I just got my replacement Prime on Friday. The guy at the collision center does not know how to access the camera. We took lots of pictures at the scene, but video or stills of it happening would be even better.

    Having read Tideland's excellent explanation of the pre-collision system, I'm guessing mine functioned at the time, but it happened so fast and was over so quickly I don't remember. I was using my cruise off and on for the winding roads because some turns required slowing down. There was only a couple seconds between when she was facing me head on and when we hit. I don't know if the car did anything. I'm pretty sure I didn't brake, and neither of us left skid marks. It would be cool if this information was recorded in the computer.
     
  2. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    This (braking) and other basic information about vehicle operation info is recorded in the Event Data Recorded whenever an airbag is deployed.

    But camera video from PCS? No idea. But took to this thread:
    Additional Data Recording for Prime | PriusChat

    This paragraph is interesting:
    "The recorded data varies according to the vehicle grade level and options with which it is equipped. These computers do not record conversations or sounds, and only record images outside of the vehicle in certain situations."
     
  3. ml888

    ml888 Member

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    If trooper said it's the other driver's fault, then the police report will state so, and you should be fine. I doubt that the windshield camera will record video long enough (if it does record at all) for your purpose but I'm not certain. In fact I'm not sure that the lane departure uses camera at all - I don't see a lens.

    BTW we bought dashcam for every car after 2 minor accidents (so we didn't call/wait for police) where the other driver admitted fault at the scene but later changed statement. It's sad that the moral values of a lot of people really won't hold up against just a few hundred dollars. Dashcam is definitely a very worthy investment.
     
    #3 ml888, Dec 4, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2018
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  4. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    +1

    The most important thing is that YOU are OK.

    Since this is a hull-loss accident without serious injury it's probably not going to matter that much whose fault it was - but it sounds like the investigating ossifer may (or may not) point a finger at the other driver.
    Insurance companies look at how many accidents you're IN.....and THEN they start looking at how many of them are your fault.
    That's why they don't even bother to ask, usually but rather they just want enough of your personal data to pull your records.

    1. If they total the car, see if they will let you buy it back. You may be able to repair it with a salvage title (somebody will.....) and drive it for years, and many times the insurance company will cut you a deal so that they don't have to sell the hulk off to somebody else downmarket.

    2. If they repair the car, see if you have a diminished value claim. Your car was worth 'X'. It's cost you 'Y'
    Those are not equal....and many times a car with an accident in its pedigree is only worth about half of what a car with a "clean" title is worth.
    In some states, this "diminished value" is actionable in small claims - or even with the assistance of some slimy, sniveling, ambulance chasing attorney...which is the same as saying.....an attorney.
    You don't even have to shop around for a neck brace.

    3. Primes still have some government kickback money this year. Other cars (i.e. Volt, T3, etc...) have MORE.
    The kickbacks may be stackable.
    You still have time to noodle that out.

    Good Luck!
     
  5. SteveMucc

    SteveMucc Active Member

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    from page 362 of the owners manual:

    "The pre-collision system is equipped with a sophisticated computer that will record certain data, such as: • Accelerator status • Brake status • Vehicle speed • Operation status of the pre-collision system functions • Information (such as the distance and relative speed between your vehicle and the vehicle ahead or other objects) • Images from the camera sensor (available only when the pre-collision braking function or the pre-collision brake assist function was operating"

    so, the answer is *maybe*. it all depends if the radar decided you were going to get hit and slammed the breaks on for you (it might very well have which may have mitigated the accident). The real question is *HOW* can you get those pictures out of it... it's not at all clear. Probably best thing to do is to tell the police about the existence of those pictures and ask them to contact Toyota to get ahold of them. If there is a dispute over guilt it you may be able to get the police to pay Toyota to recover the images (doubtful but it's worth a shot).

    The big question is if the cost to get them exceeds your insurance increase/deductible... (and then you're hoping that they captured something worthwhile).

    That said, you can always file a criminal complaint of lying to the police and state that you have evidence (it may not prove it, so you may not be able to push the issue), but the simple fact that your car might have caught the other driver in a lie may be enough to make them tell the truth to risk a perjury trap.
     
  6. padroo

    padroo Senior Member

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    #6 padroo, Dec 5, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2018
  7. dlddvm

    dlddvm Junior Member

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    So, an update. I called Toyota and they said the LDW camera does not record. The local dealers cannot access the black box information, so I would probably need a subpoena to get Toyota to get it. But apparently, our local Highway Patrol routinely pulls out the black box in any fatality accident and takes it in as part of their investigation. I'm extra glad there weren't any fatalities in this one.

    The other driver's insurance guy called me today and said they looked at the cars and the site and concluded she was in my lane and they would accept liability. So the black box data won't be needed. I sure wish I had a "moment before impact" photo, though.

    I was actually given a dashcam last xmas but couldn't figure why I'd need one and didn't want to deal with the dangling cord so I never put it in. Might have to consider at least taking it on trips now.

    Meanwhile I've taken delivery on my replacement 2018 Prime, same exterior, but to my surprise, a silver and white interior. Yech. I'll never keep it clean. I already asked my accountant if I could take the tax break twice, and she will research it.
     
    Doug McC likes this.
  8. triggerhappy007

    triggerhappy007 Active Member

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    It's easy to push the wire between the headliner/A pillar and glass. Check out the dashcam thread.

    As for the tax credit, you can get it for the 2nd Prime but you'll need a tax liability of $9,004 to get the whole amount. If you don't have that much, you'll get up to what your tax liability is back. Or your tax pro can help you with Roth conversions to make you owe more taxes.
     
  9. padroo

    padroo Senior Member

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    I installed a dash cam this summer and was able to hide the power cable under the headliner, down the roof pillar, along the door sill, around the passengers seat and plugged it into the power port on the back of the center console. Only took ten minutes.

    No one rides in my rear seat anyway.

    The one I bought is voice activated.

     
  10. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Glad to hear you’re ok. This is a good example of why the small offset crash test is important. Glad to see the car’s structure held up and dissipated the energy around the car so you only had airbag bruises and nothing else.
     
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  11. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    In case readers didn't get it from two previous replies, let me repeat it a third time: no dangling cords needed, tuck it behind the headliner edges and A-pillar trims.

    And use it all the time, not just on trips.
     
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  12. SteveMucc

    SteveMucc Active Member

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    that's very interesting... That completely contradicts what the user manual says.
     
  13. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

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    That's good.
    Makes life much easier for you.
     
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  14. Elektroingenieur

    Elektroingenieur Senior Member

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    Indeed. As discussed in my previous posting (which also applies to the Prius Prime), Toyota’s owner and service information says the forward recognition camera can save images. Perhaps the Toyota representative meant that the camera doesn’t make video recordings like a dashcam would.
     
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  15. padroo

    padroo Senior Member

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    My camera records one minute clips and will take a picture by just saying,"Take a Picture" and it saves the picture.
    The camera should be used all the time because most accident happen within 20 miles of home. Then there is the old joke about moving.
     
  16. SteveMucc

    SteveMucc Active Member

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    maybe... or maybe the rep had no idea and just assumed that it didn't and served that up as the answer. (I give equal likelihood to either possibility).
     
  17. Rieuk

    Rieuk Member

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    Um I'm sorry but if this serious incident didn't spur you into immediately planning on installing at least one dashcam in your next car to be used at all times then something is not right with you.
     
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  18. 2015BlizzardPriusFour

    2015BlizzardPriusFour Active Member

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    Glad to hear everyone was OK.

    +1 on installing dash cam asap. I’ve got a dash cam in 3 of my 4 cars, the 4th is our workhorse Jeep and rarely gets used now.


    iPad ?
     
  19. Dael

    Dael Member

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    Page 10 2020 prime manual:
    Vehicle data recording:
    The vehicle is equipped with sophisticated computers that will record certain
    data, such as:
    The recorded data varies according to the vehicle grade level and options
    with which it is equipped
    These computers do not record conversations or sounds, and only record
    images outside of the vehicle in certain situations.
    • Engine speed/Electric motor speed (traction motor speed)
    • Accelerator status
    • Brake status
    • Vehicle speed
    • Operation status of the driving assist systems, such as the ABS and precollision
    system
    • Images from the camera (available only when certain safety systems are
    activated, which varies depending on the vehicle specifications).
    • Hybrid battery (traction battery) status
    ● Data Transmission
    Your vehicle may transmit the data recorded in these computers to Toyota
    without notification to you.
    ● Data usage
    Toyota may use the data recorded in these computers to diagnose malfunctions,
    conduct research and development, and improve quality.
    Toyota will not disclose the recorded data to a third party except:
    • With the consent of the vehicle owner or with the consent of the lessee if
    the vehicle is leased
    • In response to an official request by the police, a court of law or a government
    agency
    • For use by Toyota in a lawsuit.
    • For research purposes where the data is not tied to a specific vehicle or
    vehicle owner
    ● Recorded image information can be erased by your Toyota dealer.
    The image recording function can be disabled. However, if the function is
    disabled, data from when the pre-collision system operates will not be available.
    ● To learn more about the vehicle data collected, used and shared by Toyota,
    please visit http://www.toyota.com/privacyvts/.
    If your Toyota has Safety Connect and if you have subscribed to those services,
    please refer to the Safety Connect Telematics Subscription Service
    Agreement for information on data collected and its usage.
    To learn more about the vehicle data collected, used and shared by Toyota,
    please visit http://www.toyota.com/privacyvts/.
    Vehicle data recording
    Usage of data collected through Safety Connect (U.S.mainland
    only)
    Page 11:
    Event data recorder
    This vehicle is equipped with an event data recorder (EDR). The main purpose
    of an EDR is to record, in certain crash or near crash-like situations,
    such as an air bag deployment or hitting a road obstacle, data that will assist
    in understanding how a vehicle’s systems performed. The EDR is designed to
    record data related to vehicle dynamics and safety systems for a short period
    of time, typically 30 seconds or less.
    The EDR in this vehicle is designed to record such data as:
    • How various systems in your vehicle were operating;
    • Whether or not the driver and passenger safety belts were buckled/fastened;
    • How far (if at all) the driver was depressing the accelerator and/or brake
    pedal; and,
    • How fast the vehicle was traveling.
    These data can help provide a better understanding of the circumstances in
    which crashes and injuries occur.
    NOTE: EDR data are recorded by your vehicle only if a non-trivial crash situation
    occurs; no data are recorded by the EDR under normal driving conditions
    and no personal data (e.g., name, gender, age, and crash location) are
    recorded. However, other parties, such as law enforcement, could combine
    the EDR data with the type of personally identifying data routinely acquired
    during a crash investigation.
    To read data recorded by an EDR, special equipment is required, and access
    to the vehicle or the EDR is needed. In addition to the vehicle manufacturer,
    other parties, such as law enforcement, that have the special equipment, can
    read the information if they have access to the vehicle or the EDR.
    ● Disclosure of the EDR data
    Toyota will not disclose the data recorded in an EDR to a third party except
    when:
    • An agreement from the vehicle’s owner (or the lessee for a leased vehicle)
    is obtained
    • In response to an official request by the police, a court of law or a government
    agency
    • For use by Toyota in a lawsuit
    However, if necessary, Toyota may:
    • Use the data for research on vehicle safety performance
    • Disclose the data to a third party for research purposes without disclosing
    information about the specific vehicle or vehicle owner
     
  20. aaf709

    aaf709 Ravenpaw of ThunderClan

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