I'm back; breaking pledge -- electric problem...sosumi

It depends on how many wires are in the existing outlet house. BTW, need to measure the box dimensions as my 1960s era house has smaller boxes that the new fangled outlets won't mount.

Electrically, you need:

• White - typically neutral (less bad to touch if hot)
• Black - one of two HOT lines, the ones that tend to be dangerous
• Green - the safety ground

Does the existing outlet have just two plug or two plugs and a ground pin (i.e., 3 prong.) You may be lucky IF the old socket has the ground plug.

Start with the Wiki technical description: NEMA connector - Wikipedia

The NEMA 1 section has the technical detail. I don't cut-and-paste technical detail but refer you to that section.​

I recommend sharing a photo of the existing outlet. Then with the power off that circuit, remove the outlet and take a photo of the wires inside. Include the dimensions of the outlet box as the replacement has to fit inside OR you'll have to replace the box which can be a challenge. Then put the socket back in and screw in the box cover:

I have a ground fault outlet that won't fit in the wall outlet box.

Certainly share the photos with us but you'll really need them at your hardware store. Try to chat with 'the old guy' not the 'my first job clerk.' Measure the width of the socket to make sure it will fit in the box.

There are several 'pre-code' ways to wire in a socket. The video shows one that is "less bad" but the really ugly ones have the power line come in, stripped in the middle and out. That is why photos of the existing one let's us know what you are dealing with.

I get the impression that the outlet is not where you would want it to be 'over the sink.' A more difficult but satisfying job might be to plan where you want the new outlet to be and then use the old outlet as a covered junction box to a lateral feed to the next box. Perhaps a double-box with four 120 VAC outlets.

This is not rocket science except for the first one you do. <GRINS>

Bob Wilson

ps. Old school, I use a VOM instead of those fancy ($) outlet testers. The VOM can test other things like batteries and car circuits.

pps. A quick hack, you might put a small bend in the curling iron prongs to get a better electrical fit. IF SO, first use make sure the plug does not get hot. You're bending the plugs to more firmly meet the worn electrodes in the socket. They are too weak and will only come back to cause grief in the future. Fix it right so you'll not have to worry about it again,

​

 

+1 to the above, except for the VOM, which is vastly more useful but comes with a small learning curve and a non-trivial chance of getting false readings from a dead short between the operator and the circuit under test.
I recommend getting a Klein (or equivalent) from the big box store rather than the $5 one from HF.

They're a decent quality unit as Kleins tend to be and they can specifically test GFCI outlets for function.
Also, consider using WAYGO (real ones - not the ones from HF) lever nuts instead of the twisty wire nuts, especially if you're dexterity challenged.

Yes.
I know.
The old-school (1914) twist-on wire connectors are "better" in that they can provide a superior connection if they are properly installed.
HOWEVER (comma!!!!!)
Like Bob's VOM, if wire nuts are not used properly they're much MUCH worse....AND (!!) there is a nearly 100 year old debate on exactly HOW 'wire nutz' SHOULD be installed!!!

 

GFI don't last very long these days... Expect to replace them every decade or so.

 

Good job replacing outlets with GFCI but have you seen these that, also, have handy USB outlets built into them? I replaced a couple of GFCI outlets in my kitchen with them...very handy for charging stuff. This one has both USB-A and USB-C. (Mine only have USB-A....time to upgrade??)

 

Most GFCI has stranded wire connections. This is one of the few cases where I recommend tinning the wires, so it behaves like a solid wire. I've seen people use wire nuts that push the individual wire strands down - triggering the GFCI and heating up the wires. It all goes back to "properly installed".

Just my 2 cents.....

 

The wires coming into the box from the house will typically have white insulation, black insulation, and no insulation (bare copper) for the equipment grounding conductor.

If the house is old enough, there might be only a white and a black coming into the box, and no equipment grounding conductor. In that case, the NEC still allows you to put a GFCI there, just leaving its grounding terminal unconnected. You then have to apply a label that says NO EQUIPMENT GROUND. You'll probably find some labels like that inside the box the GFCI comes in (along with some other labels saying "GFCI protected outlet"—if you have other outlets chained downstream from the one you're replacing, you can use those labels for those after chaining them from the load-side terminals of the GFCI you install). So be careful, when unboxing, that those little labels don't fly out and get lost.

The way the GFCI does its job is clever enough it doesn't need a grounding conductor to function. It doesn't have to detect that current coming and going on the white and black might be leaking to ground somewhere—it only needs to detect that the currents coming and going on white and black aren't equal, which tells it the same thing.

 

My house is old and I put a dual function afci gfci breaker in the newer subpanel circuit that goes to the bathroom and bedroom and lights. That way I could keep standard outlets and protect more than only the bathroom. The outlets are not grounded. Not sure if afci works without looking it up, but gfci does.

 

New product alert from Leviton -- (click on the lever edge link below)

Lever Edge

Basically they have the WAGO-type connection ETC(SS) mentioned, built-in.

The devices are designed with innovative installation features such as color-coded lever terminals for faster, efficient wiring; a larger strap with a unique tongue and groove alignment for quicker trim-out on multi-gang installations, and no exposed metal parts for safety. Lever Edge is the future of wiring.

I have not tried them yet. But I will on my next job. Seems like it would be handy. Seems the lever edge and the "standard" GFCI are about the same price -- at least from an admittedly quick look-see I took on the Ace Hardware site. I may be wrong. The site was giving me trouble.

Anyway, ignore code and live dangerously (?) and replace with a standard non-GFCI and you can get by about $20-some cheaper.
Of course, no one should ignore code.

Note, my electrical skills are minimal. My wife still "lets me" do electric work as long as it does not involve wire nuts. Just because 20 years ago I was replacing a part in the clothes dryer (some high electrical load thing that makes the heat) and did not tighten the wire nut properly. Started a small fire. Hey, I caught it immediately and no harm done -- or not much...

She did not complain last week when I saved us some $400USD by replacing the starter battery in her car myself.

 

LoL; those electric dryers catch fire anyways. I had to do my mom & dad's because it took several hours to dry clothes. Ripped it apart and found packed lint surrounding the heating coil. Surprised it didn't catch fire; so I guess the on-off timing circuit was working. Cleaned it out and clothes was dry in 20 minutes. It was a very old Kenmore that I had to replaced the drum belt twice.

 

Two or three wires are ok with a gfci.

Every gfci I have seen has standard screw connections and some have additional holes for push in solid wires. Normally you want to use the screws rather than the pushin holes.

 

The push-in or "backstab" holes are horrible. First, I seldom find success in trying to take a wire OUT of a backstab. I usually end up braking apart the outlet to get the backstabbed wire free. So, I guess that is a plus, as they are secure.

And, the "twist the wire around the screw" is O.K., if they include a flat copper plate under the screw head, which usually they do not unless it is a 20 amp outlet. Otherwise I have real trouble getting the wire to properly stay in place under the screw so I can cinch it down nice and tight. Not that it is horribly difficult, but it takes a bit of fussing and I am always afraid if I'll be bending the wire so much I will break off an inch or two -- and sometimes there is little slack in those wires.

I have used the Wago connections in place of "wire nuts" (there's that term again) on a few products in the past few years and love them -- hoping for good results in the lever edge connections.

High-Performance Wire & Splicing Connectors | WAGO USA

 

Ask 10 PriusChatters the same electrical question and get 11 answers and all are mostly right.

Bob Wilson

 

I use a paperclip or similar to release the wires. it's a Chinese finger type of connection, so you have to push the wire and paperclip in, then pull the wire out.
if all else fails, I snip the wire as close to the outlet as possible.
grab the wire with pliers and wiggle as you pull.
this guy makes it look easy: search

 

First you have a ground so its a normal 3 wire power source.

Do have another bath or outlet nearby that always had a gfci? If so I would verify that pushing the "test" on it does not turn off power on the worn out outlet. One gfci can protect many downstream outlets.

Obviously you remove the outlet with the breaker off AFTER testing for no power with a meter or a non contact voltage probe.

To do this job properly AND install a GFCI for safety, you need a voltmeter and should determine which black and white pair of wires is feeding power to the outlet and which pair is sending power to the next load. This requires removing the outlet and then testing the disconnected wires with power on.

If you don't have experience doing the above I would get help.

Second that outlet feeds another outlet or possibly several downstream loads as noted by two blacks and two whites. Not a big problem but installing a gfci there will either gfci protect all loads downstream or will only protect that outlet, depending how you wire it.

The gfci will have instructions for both.


Right pic protects downstream loads. Its the one I would use.

A "mini pick" tool would help release the existing outlet. In more recent outlet designs the screws themselves may release the wires.



Third, if the black and white wires won't reach the new outlet, you have to add "pigtails" (extra lengths of wires) using wirenuts or Wago lever nuts. In that electrical box pigtails might be nearly impossible due to the limited volume of the box. Which could lead to a box replacement. That can be tough on a tiled wall. Save the existing wire length and reuse them directly.

Fourth, there are gfcis that are slimmer than others. Pick one that is close to your original outlet's dimensions.

Finally, while not nearly as safe, you could put in a non gfci outlet instead. Or with more work, a gfci breaker and a non gfci outlet. I would not do a breaker swap by yourself.

 

So, a somewhat related question.

What about doing this without a voltmeter or current tester? I do have a Klein VoltMeter that I mostly use on the cars.

But for something like this...is it horribly stupid to hit the breaker off and then go plug a hairdryer into the outlet to see if there is power? That's my method.

The hair dryer is right there, not buried in my work shed.

 

Not horribly stupid but I have seen boxes fed by two breakers which could be a shocking discovery.

While most 120 vac contacts with bare skin will "knock you off", some situations are not so forgiving.

On top of those concerns, a gfci install with a downstream load requires identification of the power feed pair after wiring is disconnected from the outlet.

 

Labeling would not help if you are installing a gfci.

You have to find the pair that has 120vac on them with the breaker on.

They go on the LINE side of a gfci.

A point I tried to make twice above.