2005 Prius ICE won't start, Red Triangle

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by DrAce2005, Jul 7, 2020.

  1. DrAce2005

    DrAce2005 Junior Member

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    The other day when I went to start the car, the red triangle and several other dash lights came on VSC, (!), CEL, and on the information screen, the car icon with the !. The electric motor was working, so I put it back in it's parking spot.

    I found the oil was low. The dipstick was dry. So I added oil. I thought it was empty so added nearly 4 qts. Apparently this was too much, as it probably still had 2 qts in it, so sad to say I did overfill the crankcase. So, I watched some videos and drained out the extra oil and cleaned the puddle of oil out of the bottom of the throttle body. I am sure the oil overfill didn't help, but since the triangle appeared before that, it's not the original source of the problem (maybe the oil being low was). The ICE wasn't starting, so I hope that kept the oil from going too many places where it shouldn't. Is there anywhere else I need to check and clean? I also spilled a little oil while adding it, on top of where the spark plugs are. Are those sealed well enough to keep the spill from getting inside?

    I checked the codes, and when the oil was overfilled, it was reading P0A7A, P0A4C, and P0A4D. (I hadn't check them before adding the oil, unfortunately). However, it is still showing the triangle, car with !, and other indicator lights. The P0A7A has gone away and stayed away, so now the only codes I am getting are the P0A4C and P0A4D.

    I did find that the 12V battery seems bad. It was 11.6 when I first checked it. I hooked it up to a charger and got it up to 12.4 or so, though attempting the start the car quickly drains it again. A few times in IG ON it actually read 14.1, but only for a little while before going back to 11.6. The ICE still won't start. I do hear clicking from the back of the car when attempting to start it. Once I head some clicking from the front. Does that meant the battery just doesn't have enough power to start it?

    I will often get the issue of the car not being Ready and only being able to shift into Neutral or park. (Got the P lock error message a time or two as well). Charging the battery and resetting the codes will make that go away and allow the car to go into Ready mode and let me move the car via the electric motor. But still no ICE, and attempting to start the ICE brings back all of the lights and stops the car from going into Ready mode again.

    I am wondering if replacing the 12V will be enough to fix this or if there is something else going on to cause the ICE not to start. What other checks or test can I do?
     
    #1 DrAce2005, Jul 7, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2020
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    you have to start with a healthy 12v. are you unwilling to invest in one, in case something expensive causes you to junk the car?
    if that's the case, can you borrow something to use temporarily?
     
  3. DrAce2005

    DrAce2005 Junior Member

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    I did go ahead and order a battery, since it cost less than the towing it would need to have someone look at it (and at that point, I wouldn't have enough left to have them actually fix anything). If additional repairs do turn out to be needed, it would be unlikely that I could afford them. So I wonder how hopeful I should be that the battery will solve everything. A couple of relatives also have a Prius, so if the 12V turns out not be the issue, they may have a use for the battery at some point, and I can recover some of the cost while they can save a little. They live a few hours away, so borrowing one from them is not practical, however. The new battery should arrive in a couple days. So, I have a time before then to investigate a little more. I am especially concerned about whether any of the oil could have gotten into the spark plug well.

    I'm not usually a DIY car person, but not being able to afford repairs has led me down that path. I replaced the HID bulbs myself last year, since the dealer wanted to charge several hundred dollars to change just one of them. After having to remove the extra oil and clean out the throttlebody, (and a couple of days ago, I had no clue about how to do any of it-- it's all new to me) I'm starting to enjoy learning about how to do small repairs.
     
    #3 DrAce2005, Jul 7, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2020
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  4. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    just keep searching the net for instructions. i would sop up any oil in the plug wells, and pull them for inspection.
    how many miles on her? all regular service completed?
     
  5. DrAce2005

    DrAce2005 Junior Member

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    It has about 143,000 miles on it. The brakes need some work, and it is due for an oil change (the next thing to tackle after sorting out the current issue). The A/C was running very hot. It's charged now, but I wonder how long that will last.

    At least I see turbulence in the coolant for the inverter water pump.
     
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  6. davidc83

    davidc83 Member

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    Take paper towels to clean up around the spark plugs...oil won't seep down into the cylinders and no big deal if it did, the oil would burn off with combustion and there won't be damage to exhaust systems as there won't be much oil burning off. Your 12v battery is bad, causing much of those error codes....charging a bad battery only leaves you with a bad battery. Don't try starting the car until battery is replaced. First clue your 12v battery was going bad is when it didn't go into ready mode.

    Z6201V ?
     
  7. DrAce2005

    DrAce2005 Junior Member

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    I didn’t find any oil in the spark plug well, though I do see some deposits built up on them. The socket also got stuck and the extender bar kept coming off the ratchet, so I had an adventure trying to get that unstuck. (Note to self: use a magnetic spark plug socket in the future instead of the kind with the rubber).

    Since I had to take the air box off to get to the spark plugs, I checked the mass airflow sensor. I am guessing this is not how it should look.
     

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  8. DrAce2005

    DrAce2005 Junior Member

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    What is Z6201V?
     
  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    have you plugged the vin into toyota.com/owners for maintenance history?
     
  10. DrAce2005

    DrAce2005 Junior Member

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    I've had the car for 15 years. I did have the hybrid battery replaced about 3 years ago. Last year it had work done on the water pump (though not at the dealer). I think this may still be the original 12V, but it seems like it should have been replaced at some point during 15 years.
     
    #10 DrAce2005, Jul 8, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2020
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  11. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    The MAF sensor also includes the intake air temperature sensor, which is the only thing you really got in your photo (that little colored bulb on the side). The actual MAF sensor is pretty hard to catch in a photo; you'll have to aim the camera way back in the little passageway, and should see two skinny wires.

    Temperature sensor looked to have a little carbon on it ... I think it usually does.
     
  12. DrAce2005

    DrAce2005 Junior Member

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    Well, I was thinking that the little diode could probably use a cleaning, but I just put it back in since I don't have the correct cleaner yet.
     
  13. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    I think it's a thermistor. And probably gets the air temperature more or less right even with a bit of carbon on it.

    It's those hard-to-see tiny wires way back in the plastic air passage that are the real MAF sensor, and want to be cleaned with real MAF sensor cleaner.
     
  14. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Here is the workup for DTCs P0A4B P0A4C P0A4D : https://share.qclt.com/%E4%B8%B0%E7%94%B0%E6%99%AE%E7%91%9E%E6%96%AF%E5%8E%9F%E5%8E%82%E8%8B%B1%E6%96%87%E6%89%8B%E5%86%8Cpdf%E6%A0%BC%E5%BC%8F/repair%20manual/04pruisr/05/21bpm/0a4b253.pdf

    There are nine (9) different subcodes (INFs) for DTC P0A7A. You will need the supportive INF to proceed with the appropriate workup.

    To retrieve that INF you'll need a Toyota hybrid compatible OBD2 reader, or use a mini-vci cable and a techstream on a windows device.
     
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  15. DrAce2005

    DrAce2005 Junior Member

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    Tried a new battery, all charged up. Still no change. So, evidently the battery isn't it.
     
  16. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    You replaced the 12v battery, started the vehicle, then used a hybrid compatible OBD2 scanner and retrieved the same codes (DTCs)?
     
  17. DrAce2005

    DrAce2005 Junior Member

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    I used a FixD connected via bluetooth to the CarScan app. It seems hybrid compatible, as it will tell me the voltage in each of the hybrid battery cells, but if hybrid compatible is something other that, then maybe not. Still getting the same two codes though. And attempting to clear them with the OBDII no longer works or they come back immediately.
     
  18. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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  19. DrAce2005

    DrAce2005 Junior Member

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    No, today I just tried replacing the 12V. It took a few days to charge it. I'm not sure where to find the connectors shown in the document.
     
    #19 DrAce2005, Jul 11, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2020
  20. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Not sure if this helps.. Hybrid Vehicle Control ECU behind the passenger dash or glove box area..
    [​IMG]In the 4th color image at the link below, and not the green arrow, but just above the two hoses is the six wire multicolored M5 generator resolver connector (thank you @hobbit for the great images) @ https://techno-fandom.org/~hobbit/cars/starthole/

    [​IMG]

    Here is another shot, 3rd color image down, leftmost blue arrow. This page is also a good read, as it talks about issues relating to M5. Thank you once again @hobbit :whistle: @ 100K maint - 6

    [​IMG]

    Given your location, a visual check for corrosion might be the easiest step.
     
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