2013 Suspension Knock - Help needed

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by Fostel, Sep 28, 2020.

  1. Fostel

    Fostel Junior Member

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    Dear friends,

    Please help me diagnose the issue with 2013, 85k car.
    I did not expect to have any problems with the suspension at this mileage so my knowledge is marginal ATM.
    Now I am going to jack the car up and will post some more info later.

    In the meantime please watch the video. The noise starts at 9 sec.
    https://open.lbry.com/@CDIY:f/Toyota-Auris-Suspension-Knock:5
    During recording, the car was slowly rolling on uneven road.
    I do not feel any traction problems while on speed and in corners but I hear this noise (knocking) on slow speeds when even minor cracks are on the road.

    Would you please point me in the right direction? What to look at? According to Toyota-tech, the car has Macpherson struts on the front.
    Am I able to sort this out myself? I've got 2 jack stands, floor jack and some basic hand tools.
    My job is related to this car so any delay and repairs are pushing my family financially to the edge even more.

    Thanks.
     
  2. tankyuong

    tankyuong Senior Member

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    Stabilizer links
     
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  3. Fostel

    Fostel Junior Member

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    Got some pics

    LEFT SIDE
    IMG_20200928_134732.jpg IMG_20200928_134818.jpg IMG_20200928_134904.jpg IMG_20200928_134915.jpg IMG_20200928_134940.jpg IMG_20200928_135010.jpg IMG_20200928_135027.jpg

    RIGHT SIDE
    IMG_20200928_135129.jpg IMG_20200928_135828.jpg
    The grease was not there when I took the wheel off. I just pushed it with my finger to check the rubber and the grease got out. Second picture when I cleaned the lube.
    Do I need to replace the whole arm too?
    IMG_20200928_135204.jpg IMG_20200928_135244.jpg IMG_20200928_135256.jpg IMG_20200928_135340.jpg IMG_20200928_135357.jpg IMG_20200928_135413.jpg IMG_20200928_135445.jpg IMG_20200928_140421.jpg

    I couldn't say what is the issue 100%
    The whole thing looks like crap to me. Kinda shocked. It's 7 years old (85k miles) car but half of the mileage is from city driving over speed bumps. I heard people do 200-300k miles on those hybrids. Is this wear normal at this mileage?
    What should I order (and replace) 100%? What can I do myself?
    Thanks.
     
    #3 Fostel, Sep 28, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  4. Fostel

    Fostel Junior Member

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    A friend suggested that stabilizer bushes may also be worn. I didn't check that (or took pictures) when the car was raised.
     
    #4 Fostel, Sep 28, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  5. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    If you have the tools, time, and mechanically inclined, you can do all the work.

    Mileage doesn't always define wear. Sitting can shorten some parts life.
    Everything breaks(brakes?) down over time.
    This is why you should do a once over every few months, more when the car gets older.
    But those things are normal wear and tear items.

    The BEST thing is to replace all the parts at the same time. Then have an alignment done.
    Realistically, depends on your finances and time. The control are bushings are cracking for sure.
    But not horribly.
    If you drive on bumpy roads, the shocks are probably worn out. I couldn't tell anything from
    the video. The wheel bearing could also be worn.

    Replacing the bushings for the swap bar would probably be the least expensive, and easiest to do.
    If you still have a noise, I'd replace the struts. Easier to replace the whole assembly. If you buy the
    strut, then the bushing, and related parts, it will probably cost more than the assembled strut.
    I have not replaced them on a Prius, yet, but if you use a scribe and mark when they are attached and
    align the new one in the same place you could probably get away without an alignment. I don't know how
    much play there is for the bolts.

    Don't forget about the rear shocks either.

    Bushings, and bad struts will usually give you the knocking noises...

    In the 2nd video, they only showed replacing the one bushing, there is another on the other side.
    Maybe the "nice person-umed" you would know that and just do it????



     
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  6. Fostel

    Fostel Junior Member

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    Any recommended brands? Toyota parts are way more expensive and harder to get them.
    If I replace the whole struts, can I get the car higher?
     
    #6 Fostel, Sep 28, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  7. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    The brand decision is a personal one. I mostly have bought Toyota parts because they are
    only slightly more than aftermarket, for the most part.
    Though I know the hubs were a lot more. I went cheaper, and they only lasted 40,000 miles.
    And one of the rear ones had an ABS sensor go bad.
    You should check the cost at Toyota, then search ebay, and local parts stores for prices.
     
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  8. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Do check Amayama for genuine Toyo parts. As far as l know they ship world wide, and their prices were good, the few items I've got.
     
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  9. Fostel

    Fostel Junior Member

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    I checked them earlier. Great site but no luck with delivery to the UK. When shipping is possible, it is expensive and will be stuck on the border for duties. Not cost-effective.

    I need to do it manually, unfortunately. I am completing the list of parts numbers and will try to source them locally with an option to return if faulty/ poor quality.
    I am not entirely sure yet if 2013 Auris Touring Sports is closer to Prius gen.3 or Prius V regarding the suspension.

    I gave myself a bit more time for research. I almost went with the wholly assembled crap struts to replace everything but I bumped on Scotty Kilmer video:


    And decided to replace only the faulty part with a premium quality part (genuine Toyota or equal) as the rest of the suspension may still be better than random replacement

    I would really want to raise the car through.
    photo_2020-09-29_12-23-04.jpg
    I am hooked!
     
    #9 Fostel, Sep 29, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2020
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  10. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    Like he said, research! You can find better ones. There will always be cheap parts out there.
    The bearings for your struts may be fine, along with the bumper and boot. Maybe just the
    strut is worn out. It's extra work, and a pain, but if it lasts longer, it's worth it.

     
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  11. Fostel

    Fostel Junior Member

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    UPDATE:
    I found that KYB supplies the OEM struts/shocks for Toyota and they are made in Japan.


    I think I need to jack the car up again and by hand, double-check if the tie rod ends are not the cause of my knocks issue here. No? The bushings on those look kinda same bad as the links itself. I can feel some playing when rocking the steering wheel left and right.

    I also watched a ton of videos on how to test what went bad in the suspension.
    This one explains in-depth how to know the strut/shock is bad.


    Mine does not look as bad in cornering, no body roll and no bouncing.
     
    #11 Fostel, Sep 29, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2020
  12. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    I haven't looked at the Prius steering wheel play spec, but I suspect some play is ok, even normal. Just going from Honda's we've had, recall there was a spec in Shop Manual, something like 10~15 mm? I can have a look for the Prius in a bit.
     
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  13. Fostel

    Fostel Junior Member

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    I am just researching this latest discovery (ENGINE MOUNT)
    shock/strut replacement tips | PriusChat

    Not sure what part number that is yet. Repair manual shows two types *A and *B
    2020-10-02_14:35:09.png 2020-10-02_14:35:45.png 2020-10-02_14:27:08.png

    Pictures of mine:
    IMG_20200928_140845_.jpg IMG_20200928_140810_80.jpg engine_mount_light1.jpg
     
    #13 Fostel, Oct 2, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2020
  14. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Here's the spec for that; should be under 30 mm free play.
     

    Attached Files:

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  15. Fostel

    Fostel Junior Member

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    Thanks to everyone for your replies.


    The issue is still there but I thought I will update what happened in the meantime.

    I had the car checked by the MOT garage. He drove the car and had the suspension/ steering tested.
    He too, could not point 100% a failing part! He would pass the car at the MOT inspection deeming it safe. MOT test - Wikipedia

    SUMMARY:
    The mechanic said that tie rod ends, stabilizer links and ball joints did not fail in an obvious way. The wheel bearings are good and the suspension still tight. The steering rack link bushes seem to be in the good shape too.

    There is some play when grabbing a wheel at 9 am - 3 pm position. The inner tie rod has a play, more on the left slight on the right. The car guy said that this is minimal and still ok.

    The knock I feel when moving from left to right may not be connected to the suspension knock issue at all.

    In the end, he mentioned that it may be the strut mounts.
    I am going to check them as soon as the weather will allow. I will see if the central bolt is loose and everything torqued to the spec.

    Part 48609-02240 (SUPPORT SUB-ASSY, FRONT SUSPENSION) cost £136.99 a piece from the UK stealership!!

    I ordered KYB SM5639 Strut Mounting from Amazon (£95 a pair) in case they need to be replaced. Did not get the estimate shipping time yet.

    No shipping to the UK from Amayama:
    Genuine Toyota 48609-02240 (4860902240) SUPPORT SUB-ASSY, FRONT SUSPENSION - Amayama

    Not available from https://www.toyodiy.com/

    Saga continues...
     
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  16. Fostel

    Fostel Junior Member

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    #16 Fostel, Oct 21, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2020
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