2013 Toyota RAV4 EV Driving Impression & Review !!!

Discussion in 'RAV4 EV' started by HAWAIIANBUILT, Apr 1, 2013.

  1. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    BTW, this thread layout is terrible to scroll through on a tablet or smart phone. Way too many large pictures in a row. :p
     
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  2. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    People who own EVs generally charge at home, which is usually much cheaper than relying on paid public charging.
     
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  3. WE0H

    WE0H Senior Member

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    What does it cost to charge at home? Gas is only $3.45 a gallon up here and that is unusually high right now.

    Mike
     
  4. WE0H

    WE0H Senior Member

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    Pictures are cool but that many all at once sucks for a browser on any device :( Throw in a not so fast Internet connection like on Edge or 3G and all bets are off.

    Mike
     
  5. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    That's a tough one to answer, given that the cost per mile will depend on how efficiently you drive and cost per electricity. It gets even more complicated if you have multiple rate tiers and if you want to take the average electricity price or the marginal amounts (for adding an EV). See Understand Your Electric Charges and put in 95136 for example. PG&E has ripoff electricity.

    I don't know the Rav4 EV's charging efficiency, but I have some for the Leaf at My Nissan Leaf Forum • View topic - "typical" Miles/KWh figures for a couple scenarios? along w/some efficiency figures for the Rav4 EV at My Nissan Leaf Forum • View topic - Official Toyota RAV4 EV Thread. I believe Tony's figures are based on the displays on the car and doesn't take into account charging losses.

    For kicks, I took 3.3 mi/kwh * 0.85 = 2.805 mi/kwh. At $0.20/kwh, that means $0.071301/mile.

    Per Daily Fuel Gauge Report--national, state and local average prices for gasoline, diesel and E-85. , average price of gas is $4.04/gal right now in CA, which is the only place where the Rav4 EV is sold.

    At $4.04/gal and 50 mpg, that comes out to $.0808/mile.

    How much do you pay for electricity in your area, on average? Do you have a complicated rate structure where you'd probably get pushed into more expensive tiers by adding an EV?

    EIA - Electricity Data claims for MN, average residential price is 11.05 cents/kwh. If I used the figure, the Rav4 EV would be $0.039394/mile, or less than 1/2 the price to drive a Prius.

    Rav4 EV has WAY faster acceleration than any Prius.
     
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  6. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    HI BACK AT 'CHA HAWAIIANBUILT !!!

    When I recently had the opportunity to read your review of the RAV4-EV, I thought,"Well let's see what he has to say."

    I noticed the use of large fonts and a substantial number of photos, some having no Prius content. Ok, another set of eyes, lets see what folks have to say.

    But when I came back late Monday evening, I noticed something else:
    • 70 clicks - to get past "the review"
    • 3 clicks - for "one page" of comments

    Then I realized, my original comment was not following the HAWAIIANBUILT style guide. So I have adopted it including these important images:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    This clever posting in the "newsgroup" forum eats a tremendous amount of rendered screen estate. For a small, inflated amount of content, it all but prevents any questions or follow-up.

    I briefly thought about hitting "report" but then the posting date, April 1, suggests this is the work of a master trickster . . . and I can appreciate that!

    Bob Wilson
     
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  7. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    BTW, back to the numbers, if one ends up at the highest PG&E rate tier of $0.34/kwh (it's actually a bit higher due to taxes and fees), the cost/mile given the efficiency figures I gave would be $0.1212/mile.

    Rav4 EV has comparable acceleration to the 22 mpg combined V6 Rav4 (Compare Side-by-Side), which would be $0.183636/mile at $4.04/gal.
     
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  8. WE0H

    WE0H Senior Member

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    Are those incentives only for certain states? What if you had a zip code of 55303 and gas costs $3.45 a gallon and to add to that you are retired and living off someone else's income so any Federal tax credit would be worthless 'cause you don't have any taxes to file? Will big Gov hand over $7500 cash or is that incentive just a credit if you actually owe $7500 in Federal taxes?

    Mike :)
     
  9. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    As stated before, that varies widely on how you drive.
    Last month I used about 800kWh to drive 1700 miles. It cost me about $45. This was in a car much less efficient than the Rav4ev and in cold weather. A similar vehicle to mine in size tends to get about 22mpg. That would take about 78 gallons of gas or about $270.

    This also depends largely on your cost for electricity and the annual changes in gas prices.
    If 55303 is your area code, that probably puts you in Connexus' area. You can get off peak at 5.7 cents/kWh (8pm-8am).
     
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  10. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    Ad no, they won't, if you don't have taxes due, you don't get that credit. You would simply get the pleasure of driving electric:)
     
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  11. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    Hey Rodney. Would you mind reformatting this thread? It's screwy even on a PC. I think thee is a lot of good info in here and more people would likely follow the thread if it didn't mean scrolling forever and/or waiting for full size pictures to load.

    Good work!
     
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  12. a_gray_prius

    a_gray_prius Rare Non-Old-Blowhard Priuschat Member

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    This is the most epic Bob Wilson post ever.
     
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  13. bedrock8x

    bedrock8x Senior Member

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    You proved nothing!!!


     
  14. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Heh, in response to Bob's reply.... The moderators long ago did widen this area up to include "Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News"...
     
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  15. HAWAIIANBUILT

    HAWAIIANBUILT Senior Member

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    Hello PriusChat Folks ...

    My apologies.

    I have since reformatted this thread and have removed over half of the pictures posted so it is more bandwidth friendly.

    Hope this helps.

    Rodney
     
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  16. seasidetraveler

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    So much great info here and nice to see all the tech info from all the replies. This technology is growing and I am sure user experiences will improve. I'll probably be shot for saying this but I will venture to say if the Gen 1 Prius was never improved upon and still sold as it was, it wouldn't have the world watching it today.

    The Rav4 EV has the ability to haul items that will not fit in a Prius V or Leaf which makes it even more versatile; government incentives help make it more affordable. I agree that if you were using this car for long road trips it would be a LONG process and not the most practical. For someone that drives around town, makes frequent trips to home improvement stores, and can rely on their home charging station for most charging this would be ideal.

    To say that people would buy an EV to save money is a similar argument to those that say "I bought a Prius to save money". If you strictly commute and charge at home; maybe you will spend less on electricity than gas? I am not sure but I would think so. Is using electricity better than using gas? That is an entirely different argument! Maybe if you have your EV charged by solar or windmill you are better off ;)
     
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  17. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    In almost every situation here in the U.S. you are better off using electric vs. gasoline. This is especially true on the West Coast where the blend of electricity is more non-fossilized sources or cleaner burning ones.
     
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  18. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Heh. Have you put some of the removed pics up elsewhere?

    I pointed some folks at mynissanleaf.com and myrav4ev.com to this thread for those who might want to see some more pics.
     
  19. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    Let me suggest that had the original posting been located in "Other cars" any any other forum, the size would soon not matter. We don't see 'the first post' at the head of the subsequent pages of comments. In fact, the "Knowledge" forum would be an excellent start.

    The size problem is exasperated by the automatic, repeat of the first thread posting in all subsequent comment strings. In effect, the ratio of "first post" to "comments" was measured and found to be diluted, ~70 to 3 based upon elevator clicks.

    I don't fault the report but rather the forum where a massive posting all but cuts off comments and follow-up. Now at least, the community members have a chance to 'add value.'

    As for the review, I remain more curious about the charging stations and the ability to 'take a nap' in the vehicle while it charges:
    1. Are the seats 'nap friendly?'
    2. Are there bathrooms and drinking water handy?
    3. Is it practical to combine drive and charge-car/charge-human for longer distances?
    4. Do they come with free WiFi to let the people keep updated?
    It is a new technology so there is a learning curve. However, if I need to meet a job interview a couple of hundred miles away, I would either leave a day early so I could wait-out, 'full' charge stations or take the Prius.

    Bob Wilson
     
  20. david_cary

    david_cary Junior Member

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    Let's see. I pay 5 cents at night per kWh - and in my Leaf I usually get 5 miles/kWh. So for me it is just about 1 cent per mile. With that savings, it is actually possible to spend less for an EV over time. When you try to find a super quiet and quick car in the price range with good gas mileage - good luck. Much quieter and much faster than a Prius for example.

    In much of CA, you can get time of use rates and pay far less than 35 cents at night. There are costs associated with this but using Tier 5 rates isn't fair either.

    I suspect we are still at a time where a majority of EV owners use solar or other non fossil source.
     
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