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4kwh Enginer GenIII PHEV in UK

Discussion in 'Prius PHEV Plug-In Modifications' started by Flaninacupboard, Jul 25, 2010.

  1. Flaninacupboard

    Flaninacupboard Senior Member

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    Just to clarify, the 3.2 doesn't do -any- balancing, either top balance or bottom balance. This is great if your pack is brand new or already perfectly balanced, but if you've been using a v3.1 and have an unbalanced pack, you will need to balance manually when you get the 3.2.
     
  2. Simtronic

    Simtronic Active Member

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    Will we have to buy the v3.2 or will Jack change it over? anyway to turn on the top end balancing of the v3.1? I am still waiting for a charge lead since I bought the kit, using a kettle lead through an open hatch still. Will my batteries be any good by the time the balancer is sorted?
     
  3. Simtronic

    Simtronic Active Member

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    If it doesn't balance the top or the bottom does it coloumb count? or is it no longer a balancer?
    My pack started really well, cells 15 and 16 are now drifting apart :(
     
  4. Octane

    Octane Proud Member of 100 MPG Club

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    Why would cells 15 & 16 consistently drift? Question. I forget what the new system looks like. Are the two RF packs distinctly labelled right/left 1/2 or something like that so that there is only one way that you can put the two boxes into the 4kW system?
     
  5. Simtronic

    Simtronic Active Member

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    I have no idea why they can balance all the others just those two have a problem, mine is very slight but gradually getting worse. the two packs are labelled left and right and I have been thinking about swapping them around, to prove the fault but will probably put another 2 cells out of balance. They are 8 cell blocks so 24v nominal each in series.
     
  6. Flaninacupboard

    Flaninacupboard Senior Member

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    Ok, to clarify.

    None of the BMS16D series does top balancing, at all, ever, they only bottom balance. the V3.2 has balancing switched off by default, because the balancing function (at least on V3.1) doesn't work properly. It reads the wrong (too low) voltage on C15 and C16, so whenever you are using the kit it adds balance charge to them. this makes them go significantly higher than the other cells, and you end up with reduced capacity.

    V3.2 upgrade is free, but you must pay shipping. It's useless if your pack is already out of balance. That's why i decided to buy a miniBMS to do top balancing, to bring my pack back in line and keep it there. it's working great.
    If you swap the L and R packs C15 and 16 become C7 and 8. It now reads their voltage correctly (they are too high) but can't do anything about that because it has no top balancing. the new C15 and 16 it now reads low, and starts adding a balance charge. it will also try and add a balance charge to C1-6 and C9-14. Eventually your new C15 and 16 will be too high, and reduce capacity again. Now you have 4 over charged cells and can't do anything about it.
     
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  7. Mr.Toty

    Mr.Toty Junior Member

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    I have the same problem with BMS16D. How can you solve?
     
  8. SFGiant-and-Plugin-Fan

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    Depends on how badly damaged your cells 15 and 16 are. I returned my BMS 3.1 for version 3.2, but cells 15 and 16 were apparently too far gone. Jack is kindly sending me a new pack and I'm going to carefully try running it with version 3.2. I'm still concerned about the charger + BMS 3.2 combo. If I could adjust down the amps for the charger I'd be less concerned. I'd rather do a slow trickle-ish charge over night, but I'll just have to keep a close watch on it.
     
  9. Mr.Toty

    Mr.Toty Junior Member

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    The pack is discharge now. The voltage of the cell n.15 is 3.25V, the cell n.16 is 3.00V, all other cells are about 2.40V.

    How do I discharge only the cell number 15?
     
  10. mrbigh

    mrbigh Prius Absolutum Dominium

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    You would have to apply an external load, like a light bulb, to that particular overcharged cell in order to drop the uneven voltage and monitor the voltage
     
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  11. Flaninacupboard

    Flaninacupboard Senior Member

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    Use a 3.2 ohm resistor, put it across the pins for C15. Each hour it is connected you will be removing 1 amp hour from C15. In my case the 16D had made C15 about 20amphours higher than the others.

    It's extremely difficult to tell if you have got it right, because the voltage doesn't tell you much about SOC. That's why i got a miniBMS to take care of the imbalance for me (it's done a great job, i got 50 miles out of my pack today!) and then keep it in check.
     
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  12. SFGiant-and-Plugin-Fan

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    That's great! How many kwh were you able to get in from depletion?
     
  13. Flaninacupboard

    Flaninacupboard Senior Member

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    I don't know precisely. The Enginer charger has a very low power factor, and i assume a very dirty waveform. That makes it difficult to accurately measure. I have two different power meters, one reporting about 8kwh per charge, the other about 1.5. I'm pretty sure they are both wrong! What i can say for sure is that the charge cycle is lasting over five hours, so there is plenty going in.
     
  14. Flaninacupboard

    Flaninacupboard Senior Member

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    So i filled up on March 29th, and finally decided to fill up again today, 790 miles later, with the last pip blinking. This was my first complete tank with no system failures/downtime and the result was 99.7MPG. Good, but i think i can do better. Image attached for any doubters out there... :)
     

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  15. mrbigh

    mrbigh Prius Absolutum Dominium

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    Nice average and yes, you could do a little better........Flanin keep streeetching those numbers.
     
  16. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    Nah you just went down a very long hill. Anyway the Prius is no good - the Golf diesel can get 99 mpg and carry 5 adults and luggage. You Prius guys are just gay and duped into a car that damages the environment and doesn't get high mpg's in the real world. You should get yourself a GM product and life would be worthwhile again!

    Ooops, sorry I was having a tpfun moment there :D
     
  17. Flaninacupboard

    Flaninacupboard Senior Member

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    Haha cheers guys! I am suffering a kind of "range anxiety" with it, i don't want to drive anywhere that's futher than 23 miles away now! It also wasn't quite a whole tank, i only got in 37.something litres, so could easily have gone another 100 miles, maybe 150.

    and grumpy, we tried the diesel (2l mondeo) and the GM prodcut (2.2 vectra) and got 41 and 36 mpg respectively.... :(
     
  18. Floyd2

    Floyd2 progressio per sententia

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    Last pip blinking at 2.6 l/100km (90.5 mpg US) over 1575 km (979 miles). I should be able to strech it another 100 to 150 kms and maybe improve by another decimal.

    I'd better put a backup can in, just in case. Range anxiety just kicked in. :)
     
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  19. Jands

    Jands New Member

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    Show's what can really be achieved with an Enginer on a Prius.
    ...and so close to the magic 99.9...I wonder what will happen when it passes 99.9mpg...BSOD!
     
  20. Flaninacupboard

    Flaninacupboard Senior Member

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    Haha, no, nothing happens :(
    It actually went in for it's 30k service with the display saying 99.9 and i was tempted to ask them to check what was wrong with the gauge!

    Current tank has over 200 miles on it already, and stuck on 99.9, hoping it will stay there so i can officially join the 100mpg club.