A couple of WS Alternatives.

Oh! Now I see your point. Yes, it may have become conductive, in which case forget about dielectric strength. And, in which case, it's even more important that it not chemically attack and weaken or dissolve the insulation on the windings. If the Toyota insulation is chemically the same as the plastic parts and insulation used in other cars, then no worries: random ATF should not dissolve it over time. But if the Toyota insulation is not the same as those other materials then it's a crap shoot.

If someone tries this on their Prius it would be interesting if they would check in every few months or years and let us know how it's working out.

 

Of course, the WS fluid may have different frictional properties to work in Toyota automatic transmissions, which does not apply to a Prius. If you use the incorrect fluid in an automatic transmission, you can experience shudder, slipping, or harsh shifting

 

It would be more useful if they (people using WS substitutes) would have UOA performed periodically to know how the fluid is performing in the Prius transaxle. I personally don't think the risk is worth the benefit in this case, but performing UOA would give us some concrete data. There is already a collection of data on WS ATF from several Prius at various mileage.

 

Yes, certainly, analysis data would be more useful. I'm just thinking that anyone too cheap to buy the right fluid in the first place would never pay for proper analysis of it in use. A report on the order of, "no problem so far!" or "waa, my transaxle blew up" might be the most we could hope for.

 

I also had been used to paying this price locally. Unfortunately my local dealers in OC are now charging $7.78, an increase of ~50%, while the sales tax % has gone up. Net price is now $8.46 per quart.

 

I remember Bob Wilson going through a very careful evaluation of substituting the transaxle fluid and starting to get UOA results that had him shift back to Toyota Fluid. It was on a NHW11, but it's been done.

 

Thank you that's all I was saying. I think WS is an excellent product.
Never said otherwise. But...there are other high performance alternatives out there.Which is the point of this getting rather long thread.

 

Yes..he got a UOA report back that showed alarming copper content iirc. I googled it and found a thread that said that Amsoil ATF attacks copper.

OK hold on...I know there's alot of Amsoil lovers out there and I am not putting Amsoil down as its an excellent product but in this case I found an exact complaint corresponding with Bobs findings and posted it too.
The Gen1 CVT bearing races are not sealed like Gen2 bearing races are.I suppose thats where the copper came from. But it was the reason Bob went back to WS.

 

And my local garage did a transaxle drain and fill for me on Thursday . I mentioned on the phone that they have specific spec for thefluid but my wife dropped it off so I didn't get a chance to repeat it. They use Wolf's Head.

I'm at 63k miles.

I guess I have a 60k experiment.

 

Good lord! That's cheaper than motor oil. Why would I use anything else?

 

Sounds pretty fatalistic to me. From what I've read, the trans oil change is easier than a motor oil change. If you're confident that the Wolf's Head is good stuff, that's fine. If you're not, have an oil analysis done after a while or just cough up the $40(?) and have it done right.
[Edit]: ...particularly if it's not about the money.

 

Unfortunately, it has gone up since I posted that. Last time I bought some WS (last fall) it was over $8 /quart.

 

Give it a rest. The only one writing such accusations is you. Keep it civil.

Does anyone have something from Toyota in writing that states their concern over electrical shorts due to trans fluid? I'm all for trying a smoother, quieter trans fluid, but I'd like to see something in writing either way.

 

Another 4 year old post resurrected.

I'm 60,000 miles and 6 years later and my trans windings have not melted yet using Redline D6. Glad I did as it probably looks like a new trans inside it. And its as quiet as the day I bought it new.

 

It's fun reviving old threads, normally I kill new ones.
My transaxle is also performing like a new one, quieter than a mouse, running genuine Toyota WS oil after 1 change at 100,000km (60,000 miles) It is now almost due for the 200,000km change and again I'll use WS. Reason, see earlier post. Material compatability.

 

Whatever that is.

 

How much research have you done into the compatability of the oil you are using in your transaxle with the materials Toyota used to build it? I'd assume Toyota did a little more than you did when they decided WS oil was right for the job.

 

I have run 2 UOA's on the D6 I am running. Getting ready to do a third over 60,000 miles. Found in Trans Draft sticky. Excellent wear numbers. How about yourself with your WS?

WS was not designed exclusively for the PRIUS so that kinda blows your unfounded claim of design compatibility. It is used in many Toyota cars and trucks. Its claim to fame is it's low viscosity which helps the vehicle get better mpg.
It has a very high calcium pack which helps reduce TAN which is why it has a "lifetime" tag. Calcium is also a wear agent.

My assertion is WS is nothing special and is easily substituted. Like most factory fill fluids it's ok and does the job. I'm not recommending to use anything else but superior fluid is available.

But saying its "winding friendly" or it has any dielectric properties or it will help mitigate any kind of electrical failure in the trans or has been tested to 600 volts is utter nonsense.

 

I agree, the oil has nothing to do with electricity. I'll bow out as your knowledge on this topic exceeds mine. I'd love to see something from a transmission engineer and a chemist at Toyota.