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Featured And then there were 6

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by austingreen, Sep 15, 2015.

  1. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    Audi is the 6th car maker to say they will make a 200+ mile bev by the end of 2018
    310 Mile Audi e-tron Quattro Concept Revealed, Production in 2018 (w/videos)
    Pretty cool 0.25 drag coeficient for an SUV, but of course it will be higher in the US because of regulations.

    Maybe we should count it as only 5 as Porsche is part of vw group like Audi, and they may be sharing batteries, but porshe has a fater charging car concept
    Porsche Mission E Revealed: 500 km/310 Mile Range, 60 In 3.5 Seconds, 15 Minute Charges

    Ford, Chevy, and Nissan have already made their announcements, and Tesla is currently selling one.
     
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  2. Ashlem

    Ashlem Senior Member

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    Looks like Musk's goal of goading other automakers into making EV's is coming to fruition. A few years back they all said "nobody wants EV's."

    Then the Model S started eating into their sales...
     
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  3. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Then Toyota admitted 'some' actually DO like EV's - despite perceived warts from some . . . . but qualified by saying plugins are only for those with four hours to waste. Most likely a deflection to justify FC direction. Then - after sticking FC expense with Cali tax payers - Toyota moves their headquarters to Texas. Hmmmm, what with all that natural gas in the lone star state ... and appreciation for relocating Toyota headquarters ... I wonder what state will be next.
    IMO, it's not so much the manufacturers WANT to build EV's but rather the more costly sport/luxury auto (bmw, MB Porsche et al) manufacturers see their sales eroding due to Tesla success. Put in the big money of multinational car manufacturers, to try & undercut Tesla pricing, and try to drive Tesla out of business maybe?
    .
     
  4. el Crucero

    el Crucero Senior Member

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    Or is it to meet compliance standards?

    300 mile range and 15 minute recharges - a 5 passenger vehicle cannot be far behind! That would definitely put me in the BEV market! I tried to get on the waiting list for Tesla's proposed family sedan (with a deposit), but they said no, not taking any deposits yet.
     
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  5. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    That would make sense but texas is firmly in the plug-in camp, although cng and lng trucks are part of the states priorities, Austin is the only city with hydrogen, and that is part of university research and government education, not commercialization. Still if there are breakthroughs texas will support fcv like plug-ins.

    vw group and bmw are on record as wanting to build plug-ins. Tesla has gone directly after bmw and porsche's target market and has made money selling bevs. Both VW group (lamborgini, porsche, audi, vw) and bmw think that most of their plug-ins will be phevs not bevs, they realize that 10 years down the road when bevs may be cheaper to make, and need to get experience now.
    Audi: 40% Of Luxury Cars Will Be EVs By 2030 - Gas 2

    The reason is the cafe and european co2 requirements simply won't allow luxury cars to stick with V8s. If they want to keep selling the performance they need a battery boost to meet emissions. Most of the bet is on the PHEV side, and bmw's i8 may out sportscar the gas only 911. Porsche is going to try both bevs and phevs to retain its profit margin. Audi has a lot more time, but when investing for a battery for porsche, why not use it in a higher volume audi to help cover R&D.
     
  6. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Another nail in the 'Top Gear' coffin.

    Bob Wilson
     
  7. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    Probably not, they do have to give up on the big displacement bump. Here we have the most efficient true sports car the 911 versus the phev i8, and the fatest tesla against the best fuel economy sports sedan.
    Compare Side-by-Side
    The bmw phev and tesla bev easily comply with the future regulations, while the 911 and lexus GSh will have to pay fines. Note the tesla and bmw are more expensive today, but battery prices and light weight materials are falling in price. In a decade lexua may be able to get away without fines because of ct and es, but the upper end very profitable LS and GS look like dinasaurs. The thing that can save the LS and GS is low gas prices, otherwise regulations will make them more expensive than plug-ins in a decade.
     
  8. UsedToLoveCars

    UsedToLoveCars Active Member

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  9. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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  10. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Hummm, can someone list these super EVs?

    The reason why is I may observe these are 'green cars' for some of the petro-headed auto reviewers. <GRINS>

    Bob Wilson
     
  11. UsedToLoveCars

    UsedToLoveCars Active Member

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    apple has already bought land in san jose to build a factory. One of apple's strengths is manufacturing to high tolerances using high grade materials at scale. Bentley quality at a consumer price point.

    Ford? You have to be kidding.

    If apple pulls it off, they will slaughter existing car makers, just like they slaughtered Nokia
     
  12. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    this is great news. i can't wait.
     
  13. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    All I have heard is rumors most of them shot down. Apple Car based on BMW i3? ‘Nice idea’: CEO
    Tim Cook talks Steve Jobs, personal life, Apple Car, &amp; more on &#8216;Late Show&#8217; with Stephen Colbert [Video] | 9to5Mac
    As a shareholder I would expect a proxy item if apple was going into the car business versus doing something like carplay, or google self driving but with modified i3's.

    Hey if you know anything real tell us. Yes, Ford would probably be the cheap way for apple to enter. The market cap - $56B is fairly easy for apple to do, and if they change the multiple from 8 to 12 that is a 50% gain. Building a car company is slow work, and given the size of apple, it won't get a tesla like multiple for that business. But yes if they have a killer car, and its not built by foxconn in china it would be cool news.

    But to me it seems unlike that project titan is about apple challenging Toyota in the car business. Who knows? If I get a proxy item on a shareholder volt requesting something for project titan I'll let you know.
     
  14. Jeff N

    Jeff N The answer is 0042

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    I'm not aware of Ford announcing a 200 mile EV. When did that happen? I remember them making noises that they "could" build such a car (so could Toyota....) but I'm not aware of them ever saying they would do so within any particular timeframe or based on any particular concept.
     
  15. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    Anounced in march with not much detail.
    Ford Will Unveil Chevrolet Bolt Competitor This Year
    It is vague enough that maybe it won't happen, but ....
    Ford already has used compact power (LG) batteries in the focus EV, and that is the gm vendor that seems to have gotten battery prices down enough to make the bolt next year or maybe the year after.

    But for used to love cars this automobile article talks about potential apple car. To me the most likely apple branded car will be a partnership, and this month that seems like with bmw, perhaps sold at bmw i dealerships.
     
  16. Jeff N

    Jeff N The answer is 0042

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  17. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Apple is utilizing virtually slave labor - building products in China. It's notoriously bad press with high suicide rates. I can't grasp that they would build anything in high-cost United States.

    Revealed: Inside Apple's Chinese 'sweatshop' factory where workers are paid just £1.12 per hour | Daily Mail Online

    They'd have been better off just buying up CODA, getting rid of its 1980's body, & goung from there.
    .
     
  18. dipper

    dipper Senior Member

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    Not only that. They were the first to get rid of employees and make them contractors. Many Silicon Valley companies are doing that now using that model. HP is the latest to go that route.

    Ever noticed Apple has never been a preferred company to work for in any survey? Steve Jobs believed his employees are slave labors.
     
  19. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    So, I guess that would mean under that business model they would likely be able to build really super cheap electric vehicles?

    .
     
  20. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    back on track, why are all these car makers planning a 200+ mile bev. There is a market for it.
    One Million Global Plug-In Sales Milestone Reached - HybridCars.com
    Which makes you ask when will 1 M/year happen in the US? It may come just as the 54 mpg cafe standard hits in 2025.
    Electric Cars Will Take 10 Years To Hit 1 Million Annual Sales: Analysis
    I think china will be a bigger market than the US by then, but these are the two big plug-in markets -US and China. They are also the most profitable markets for foreign automakers