another story knocking the prius

Like Charles I used to have a Mercedes Diesel (back when I could go across the Mexican border and buy it for 18 cents a gallon). I discovered you could generally tell if a car is a diesel at night just by looking at the rear lights. The ones with a dim light (the one over the exhaust pipe) would be a diesel. That's because the exhaust would corrode the wiring if there was a small hole. That isn't as noticable now, but it was interesting.

I know Mercedes makes a diesel/electric hybrid. Popular Mechanics once did an article comparing diesels with hybrids (similar to this). The conclusion of the PM article was that both were good, but for different reasons and the best diesel/electric hybrid idea would be a bus.

 

I have no problems with the original article; it is an opinion piece
by a diesel proponent. It clearly shows his bias.

I did not see any lies or attempts to deceive; he just really likes diesels.

Only time and the market will prove who is correct.
And that is the way it should be.

Robert

 

Diesel already costs $3.15 here (vs. $2.85 for gas). Expect 25-30 cents more when the low sulpher diesel comes to Cali, already short of refinery capacity.

Do the math.

Prius 45mpg, $2.85/gallon, 15K miles: fuel cost = $950 per year
Diesel 27.6mpg, $3.40/gallon, 15K miles: fuel cost = $1847 per year

Prius savings = $897

At $900 per year, the Prius has paid the alleged "hybrid premium" of $3K by the fourth year. After that it saves another $900 every year.

Which is the expensive car?

 

""Despite the big public debate right now, it (hybrids) will just be a niche technology," German luxury car maker BMW AG chief executive Helmut Panke told Reuters at the Tokyo car show. "

Oh, really? Maybe I should rethink purchasing my estimated 45mpg Prius and go for a 27mpg diesel instead? Of course, once they have cleaner emissions that allow them to pass the stringent emissions standards in CA, where the sale/purchase of new TDI's is not currently allowed unless you purchase it elsewhere and register it elsewhere. Brilliant idea!

""They (hybrids) do not have long-term economic prospects because they are a lot more expensive to produce (than diesels) with the same results," said Jean-Martin Folz, chief executive of French mass car manufacturer PSA Peugeot Citroen. ""

Same results? So in what dimension does ~27mpg = ~45mpg????? Or did I misunderestimate the results???

""Toyota lacks one fundamental element -- image - unlike BMW or Mercedes. Toyota cleverly used the environmental theme to boost this," said Schmidt. "

I guess image trumps reliability every time, right? I swear, I was just reading my Consumer Reports 2005 guide last weekend, and according to reliability ratings, companies like Honda and Toyota were at the top of the chart, whereas BMW, and Mercedes though being considered 'luxury' makers, were more towards the bottom based on reliability. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

I didn't even have to open the link to get a good laugh. Detroit news? Aren't they a little Bias? I'm surprised they don't talk about how good Fords are

 

read about half the article... had to stop... too much spin making me dizzy...

the reason for these articles is clear. most people believe what they read. its nothing but a smear campaign in an attempt to derail Toyota's hybrid express.

will it work??? hope not.

might it work?
unfortunately, history says they have a real good chance. the lack of product makes word of mouth advertising (by far the most effective) weak. many times that will be enough if the product is good.

a good example of what bad press and rumours can do...

once upon a time there was a company call Digital Research. their flagship product was a computer operating system call DR-DOS. now it wasnt the best, but still good enough to become the #2 OS in the industry.

well the #1 OS company didnt like that DR-DOS was a competitor and decided that they would start spreading lies about DR-DOS in hopes that people would hear about the made up bad things about DR-DOS and not buy it based only on rumour.

well to make a long story short, it worked simply because this other OS company created a software program that would say that DR-DOS caused the computer to not work properly. this was a lie. but people believed it even though, in reality, DR-DOS ran this other software just fine.

soon Digital Research went from being #2 to bankruptcy.

 

Who can forget VHS vs. Beta?

Rancid: you go, girl! Said it better than I did.

I doubt we'll see much change in the Europe/diesel vs. USA/hybrid equation anytime soon. If nothing else, tightening emission standards (unless we elect yet another Bush) here will hold down diesels.

But hey, it's not ABOUT this vs that (diesels/gas engines) if we're all in the R & D mode, right? Nothing to say a diesel hybrid might not be the best combo, no?

 

I was wondering if a diesel hybrid might not be a viable solution. I have been reading a lot about biodiesel lately, and it seems to me that this might be good for those of us that are into decreasing our dependency on foreign oil.

 

I hope so. I work at a company that makes hybrid engines for busses. Most are ICE/Electric, but there's also HICE/Electric, Fuel Cell and Diesel/Electric.

 

I could see diesel too if it didn't cost 30% more than gas.

Its a good thing for us that most "like this author" are still uninformed.... hopefully hybrid supply will accomodate by the time the public gets informed.....

 

he used "hullabaloo" HAHAH LETS MAKE FUN OF HIM

and then his life will all go "caddywhompus"

stupid stiff.

 

I'm getting better than 50MPG driving fast, slow, highway, city, doesn't matter. And while doing it having to listen too often to annoying commercials on the radio for something called a Volkswagen PZEV, which is supposed to get 30 MPG on the highway. Considering it's a modern Volks, I'm willing to bet it's a POS, and considering the figures and the usual "windage", it probably gets closer to 20 MPG in realistic driving. My BMW 325i did better than that!

 

It makes you smell more like a European!...not that thats a bad smell or anything..

I guess its according to who she is!

 

I don't know why these diesel folks keep praising diesel. All you have to do is drive any interstate hwy and check the price difference. At one time diesel was 5-10 cents a gallon cheaper than gasoline now it is 10 to 20 cents more than premium.
I'll take my hybrid ice/electric that burns regular thank you.

 

Ok.. letmein... I guess I want to bash diesels too!

When I'm at the gas station and one pulls in.... it just gives me a headache they are so stinkin noisy!.. I can't imagine having that noise constantly to deal with.
I've been in diesels on long trips... they do run and run.... but they are no longer profitable to use.. the bads all outweigh the good at this present time..

I guess were all just jealous?... not!

When biofuels become abundant, and cheap then we can talk.