Apparently America still doesn't get it

But are the reasons they are not offered related to Audi's internal decision making or some government/dealer conspiracy to sell gas guzzlers to the US?

 

On this note, someone on Tivocommunity today started a thread "Buying an Escalade today". A bunch of chimed in on how much they like/love the Slade along w/some other full-sized monstrosities they named (e.g. Tahoe, Yukon).

Yep, America still doesn't get it.

 

And I doubt they ever will. We'll go down like Rapa Nui (Easter Island) with their devotion to building ever larger moai, religion, over population, resource decline and power struggles.

 

Yeah, the two Facebook posts in the last month of friends (read: people I sort of know from high school and college) drooling over new cars were a Ford Escape (not the hybrid) for a single guy in his 20s, and a Jeep Liberty for a similarly aged girl.

The Escape is the worst offender for me, since after soliciting advice on Facebook, and getting suggestions for a Prius, a Cruze, a compact with good mileage, he went out and bought an SUV for himself - as a single male. He wanted to "drive with more confidence". The Jeep was just a shame, because this girl is going to spend $2500-$3000 on gas alone every year.

Financially self-destructive and harmful to others, it just baffles...

 

The Escape is considered a small SUV and the 4 cylinder non-hybrid isn't that terrible on mileage nor that bloated. The Liberty I believe is considered a small SUV as well but did poorly at Best & worst cars review, fuel-efficient vehicles.

I don't take a issue w/people driving small SUVs or much of one w/medium sized SUVs (if they need the space; e.g. Highlander, RX, MDX). Their curb weights are <5000 lbs. For those who need the space, I'd much rather people drive medium sized SUVs or minivans than the monstrosities below.

My big issue w/monstrosity class battering rams of death that weigh 5000+ lbs (sometimes WAY over) being driven solo or w/minimal passengers and cargo such as the Tahoe, Escalade, Navigator, Expedition, Yukon and Suburban. Them having terrible accident avoidance capabilities in the form of terrible handling and brakes doesn't help. What's even worse are the uber-monstrosities that are 6400+ lbs. like the Hummer H2 or Ford Excretion...

I just checked at http://www.chevrolet.com/vehicles/2011/tahoe/features.do and find the the Tahoe weighs a criminal 5659 to 6029 lbs., depending on trim and whether it's 4WD. The Slade per http://www.cadillac.com/vehicles/2011/escalade/features.do?styleIds=324235^324236^324237^324238&tab=tabHighlights weights 5488 to 5694 lbs. The Escalade ESV weights 5773 to 5963 lbs and is EPA rated at 13 city/18 highway, 14 combined.

 

I see someone's read Jared Diamond's book.

 

SUVs in general don't make sense to me. The only time my family has used them are trips out west for off road adventures. But there are fewer and fewer consumer SUVs that meet requirements for being off road. The only arguement I can see some validity for is being a "safe" vehicle for people who don't know how to drive: even if it rolls over...chances are they might still survive just as long as it isn't a huge ravine for them to fall into (unfortunately, I know several cases of deaths from SUVs rolling off mountains). I had a classmate in highschool who had gotten a SUV from her parents. She was still pretty new to driving: so once while we were all driving to some volunteer work, I saw her miss a turn completely...ran up the curve, and took out a stop sign. She did more damage to all the properties then to her new SUV. So again...if you've mastered basic driving skills, I don't see a huge need for a SUV. I often ride in a friend's SUV....and when we're out and about, I'm continually amazed how little trunk space the thing has. I can fit so much more in my Prius. I do sometimes use his truck, though, for hauling appliances.

 

That's true up to a point, but I think another significant issue is power.

The "typical" US car buyer demands more power than a European buyer. So the US car buyer has cars with larger, less economical engines and this contributes to small cars not being significantly more economical than larger cars.

Consider the Yaris.

In the USA it has a 1.5l engine.

In the UK it's a 1l or a 1.33l (and of course a 1.4l diesel engine is available in the UK too).

Combine low gas prices and smaller differences in economy and it's no wonder that many Americans won't buy small.

 

Until oil cost per barrel reaches a high price point we will not drill here because of the cost. The cheapest oil to drill is shallow in sand, anyone know anyplace like maybe aaaa the middle east?????

 

And a few others. While I do not assume such books are 100% accurate but the information is good.

 

Huh?

People who are just learning how to drive are the last folks who should be driving a vehicle more difficult to control, and more hazardous to others, than a regular passenger car.

Prior to the advent of electronic stability controls, SUV 'safety' was mostly about outweighing regular cars, and riding over the top of a smaller car's crash protection features to turn the opponent's entire passenger compartment into the SUV's 'crush zone'. The car's occupants were being sacrificed to save the SUV's occupants.

A downside within the SUVs was that in crashes with fixed objects (including the ground), or with opponents of their own size, SUV occupants came out worse than otherwise identical situations with cars.

Safely driving an SUV or pickup truck requires more driving skill, not less.

 

Time to see lawsuits against SUVs at fault in accidents for reckless endangerment, or at least demand a higher standard of driving as Fuzzy says.

 

Yes, those driving monster SUV,SUV,trucks... will keep buying and driving them till they can't afford the gas price and then either ride a bicycle or quit from job and still never drive something else like Prius .
They think they are in America, they should drive American car or at least big car or truck. Then they will close their eyes when die. Especially those come from outside the south border. If they are not driving a SUV or truck, they thing they are not in USA.

 

i met a lady at the Lacey Alternative Fuel Fair and Electric Car Rally who drove a 6,000 lb Chevy SUV who claims it was the best car on the road and twice ignored my question on her gas costs. she stated she gets it on post (her hubby was currently in Iraq) much cheaper (about 10-15 cents/gal less) so it was "not enough to think about".

she was leaving with her 3 kids and they were only parked about 100 feet away. it was at least a 15 minute scene as she fought with her kids who were arguing about where each one wanted to sit. two were in booster seats. it was almost comical.

i thought about asking her if she accepted that her hubby was risking his life essentially to insure that gas costs could be kept artificially low for another decade or so before the economics of the situation hit the proverbial brick wall but was at the limit of my tolerance of her view point so i passed

 

I own two Priuses and my wife and I use them as our commute cars. I do however tow a 5th wheel trailer from time to time and work as a general contractor. Try going to the lumber yard and putting 6 1 1/4 inch plywood 4x8 sheets into your Prius or 40 2x12 x20 foot floor joists in the back. I do this on a regular basis with my Dodge Cummins diesel 3500 pick up. Yes, it has a 36 gallon tank and today diesel is more $ then unleaded. Lets see... do I get it?!?

Don't belittle people who need a larger vehicle to tow or haul the big stuff. I love my Prius but it will just crap out in a hurry asking of it what I ask my 3500 to do. 2/3 of the time I need a big vehicle there is nothing in the bed or on the lumber rack.You have to drive to get the materials, then deliver the material, and drive back. Thats 3 trips, 2 of which are empty and my payment on that truck with $20,000 down is still 650$ a month. That's why my hourly rate is almost as much as your lawyers. Add to this my workers comp, and my insurance, both sides of social security, retirement, and medical...
Everyone spends their $ on different things. Some on booze or drugs or shoes or women. Others on jewelry or their home.They just do it differently then you ... that doesnt make them wrong, it just makes them different.
-Paul R. Haller-

 

Paul,

There is a big difference between someone who uses a large fuel inefficient vehicle for real work and those who drive them for pleasure or egotistical reasons. I don't buy into the usual comeback of "it's there money and it is their right to drive what they want" because it's a taxpayer subsidized pleasure and the health issues associated with their pleasure is cast upon everyone regardless of what everyone else drives. I.E. their pollution negatively affects everyone and our economy. I'm of the opinion that they should be penalized for taking pleasure in wasting fuel and polluting more.

 

F8L,
Penalized for driving a gas hog? No
Pay for the actual cost without subsidy, and taxed to include externality costs ? Definitely

Paul,
I have no problem transporting the 4x8 plywood or lumber I buy for construction with a car, I just use a rack. I have required a truck twice in the past 5 years. I rented for about $50 each time. Make fuel $10/gallon and watch how quickly the number of truck owners shrink to those who actually require the vehicle to work. Based on historical numbers I guess about 5% remain. And if fuel costs are even higher, lumber yards will deliver to multiple job sites as part of a 'run' to improve transport efficiency. Or small general contractors will realize that two trips to the store instead of one for the unusual load does not justify the cost of a gas guzzler for the other trips. Cost drives adaptation, and those who cannot adapt find other work (or not.)

 

driving a truck to make a living i do not begrudge and i know a "handful" who do so. but i also know a Ford Mechanic who works in a shop, never hauls anything for work and drives 50 miles RT in his truck a diesel 4X4 with oversized tires. he makes $75,000 a year so he can afford the fuel but i cannot afford to subsidize it

that Sir is a world of difference.

 

Trucks and SUVs are different.

Many people who buy pickups will likely use them for a purpose from time to time and taxing them would hurt private contractors, carpenters etc.

In contrast the vast majority of people who buy SUVs do so for image purposes so the burden of proof should be against them. Unless they can prove an SUV's utility (first car for a family = or > 5) you should be slapped a gas guzzling annual state tax for it for 20% of the average gas price for that year. Someone I know has been driving a massive Nissan SUV @14 mpg on her own for the last 5 years.

That should help some states increase their revenues.

 

Using a pickup from "time to time" does not justify using it as a daily driver. I go on climbing trips from time to time, but I don't drive a Land Rover. If I guided for a living, or lived somewhere without improved roads, then I would consider a Land Rover or Jeep as my daily driver.

I don't know anyone on this forum that would begrudge a builder or farmer for driving a pickup truck. That's just part of the cost of business. However, many members of this forum think it unwise to drive a pickup truck as a everyday commuter, just so you can haul wood and mulch twice a year. It doesn't make economic sense. Rent a truck for those occasions.

Most pickup truck drivers that I know drive them because they think they are cool, not because they need them for work. And I live in an agricultural region; I'm sure the numbers are worse in the city.

Tom