Are the fire and police departments examples of socialistic agencies?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Godiva @ Jun 25 2007, 02:52 PM) [snapback]467736[/snapback]</div>

I'm right there to tell you the system is screwed up. Just not in the way you think it is. You and polyana think that everyone else is looking out for everyone else and that's just not the case. I have 5 bucks in my wallet so I'm going to pay for the free sandwiches being handed out by Subway? No... gonna accept their free sandwich just like the guy who had nothing in his wallet and spend my $5 another time.

You think I'm sponging off of the system because our state has a program to pay for shots and I used it. Well, your state and school system has a system set up to pay your salary. You can cut back on some things and refuse your paychecks. I'm sure the system could use the money for something else.

Next year if you qualify for a tax refund, I'm sure you'll not cash the check because the fed needs the money.

Oh... right... lot of talk, but NO action... You'd never do it, but you condem me for using this legit program available for me. Nice... talk about Queen of hypocrits, you are the winner.

Our state can't afford this program like you can't afford to go buy a new Bentley.

Illinois shouldn't have the program just like you shouldn't be driving that new Bentley. But, we have a democrat in the govenors seat and a house/senate overrun with 'em too.

Are you suggesting I did something by slight? Is that how you do it or what? Here, it's just an option. Pick 1 to pay for it yourself, pick 2 for the state to pay the bill, makes no difference to us(clinic). Which button do you push Miss Self Righteousness?

I didn't make the state program and I don't support the state having it. It doesn't run out for poor people because people with jobs use it, just the state goes broke faster, so don't move to Illionois or you'll inherit the bill for this program later in life when the state runs out of ways to avoid paying the bills.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(EricGo @ Jun 26 2007, 12:55 AM) [snapback]468130[/snapback]</div>

Good for you. Here are some factors which may have contributed to your weight loss:

1. High metabolism.
2. Working so many hours that eating at all becomes difficult.
3. Making good choices.

I never said anything about choices being irrelevant. But to say that everyone is in a position to make good choices is like saying that anyone can be President. You are who you are because someone ELSE taught you to make good choices, and you had the mental, financial, and social network in place to make those good choices. In this game of LIFE, not everyone starts on the same square of the board. Sure, you can get ahead with good choices, but the odds of the game say if you started poor, obese, etc., you're going to end that way, and so are your children.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daronspicher @ Jun 26 2007, 08:33 AM) [snapback]468213[/snapback]</div>

I disagree with the others. I don't think you did anything wrong.

But you are saying you'd rather pay out of pocket instead of paying taxes for the exact same service, and then you want everyone else (regardless of income) to have to also pay out of pocket.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daronspicher @ Jun 26 2007, 06:33 AM) [snapback]468213[/snapback]</div>

I repeat that Daron was perfectly right to use the state system for medical care, just as he'd be perfectly right to send his kids to public school if he felt his local public school was a good one. (I don't know whether he does or not, and it's irrelevant to the topic.)

We have public schools, paid for by taxpayer dollars, for everyone who wants to use them, and that's how it should be, because an educated populace makes for an economically stronger country. We need to have public health care, paid for by taxpayer dollars for everyone who wants to use it, because a healthy populace is stronger in every respect. It's good for everyone if everyone is healthy.

I don't know the details of the Illinois program, but it sounds good, and if it's available to everyone, and Daron lies within the set of everyone, then Daron is within his rights to use it.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Jun 26 2007, 09:55 AM) [snapback]468251[/snapback]</div>

If nothing else had to change for this to work, I'd say let's go for it.

But, there is no way to pay for this under the current system. When you start looking at ways to pay for this, you start ripping down so many of the blocks that hold the rest of the structure up, that the entire system collapses. Once it falls down, everyone is more screwed at that point than they all are right now.

The magic funding plan is the only one where the math works. There doesn't seem to be any way to get the costs down, so the money has to come from somewhere. Any ideas?

We don't have it... We being the public.... We (using averages) have way too much of our own debt to pay off to afford to start paying for pie in the sky programs where everyone is allowed to bring their biggest cup to the drinking fountain and take all they want.

We could just all wish that everyone has everything. Maybe that will do some good and it won't bankrupt society.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Jun 26 2007, 09:55 AM) [snapback]468251[/snapback]</div>

I'm not saying he has no right to use it. I'm saying that using it when he has healthcare and badmouthing the fact it's there, etc. makes him a hypocrite.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Godiva @ Jun 26 2007, 12:07 PM) [snapback]468361[/snapback]</div>

It's a bad program.

It paid the bill when I would have otherwise paid out (so far) about $1700 from my bank account.

It's still a bad program, this state can't afford it.

If that makes me a hypocrite, then I say the hypocrite is a real solid position to take on this issue.

What does it make you if you just use the program without speaking out against it? Welfare mama is one thing that comes to mind..

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Jun 25 2007, 08:44 PM) [snapback]468059[/snapback]</div>

B.S.!!! </span>I never said that my doctor and nurse friends and family said, <span style="color:#009900">"everyone using the emergency room arrives in a shiny new car." Not one of them said "everyone."
I dare you to show where I made such a claim.
Is that really the way your brain is wired? <_<

And so what if you only paid about $100 for your medical experience in Spain.
Speaking of meaningless anecdotal evidence. [I can not roll my eyes back in my head far enough ]
You did NOT pay the full cost of the service you received!
If you were also paying the taxes which the Spanish people paid on your behalf, you wouldn't be crowing so loudly about how wonderful it was to 'only pay $100.' [not a quote]

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sufferin' Prius Envy @ Jun 26 2007, 06:52 PM) [snapback]468595[/snapback]</div>

No, you didn't say "everyone" but you sure implied that all poor people are abusing the system.

In Spain I went to a private hospital that gets no money from the government, where people go who have private insurance that pays the full cost of care. Since I had no insurance, I paid the full cost, in cash, out of my own pocket. But since the Spanish system is not totally corrupt like ours is, the cost is a fraction of what we pay.

 

Do insurance policies for churches exclude 'acts of god', or are they 'covered' for that sort of thing?