Featured BORON as alternative fuel for cars

i'm onboard. can you mail a copy to steven chu? correction, ernest moniz.

 

I don't know. Will the reactor fit into my garage?

 

build a bigger garage.

 

Or get one of these: Toshiba 4S - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Just drill a well under the garage, about 30 meters deep and the problem is solved. Sell the excess power to the neighborhood. <GRINS>

Also, sell the waste heat to the neighborhood and cooling too. <GRINS>

Bob Wilson

 

Not a well thought out concept. Two different things are forced into one concept. A nuclear energy source and a massively difficult Boron recycling infrastructure to transport energy. Electricity will be superior to boron transport and refueling in every possible meaningful way. No way boron can be considered viable as a vehicle fuel from any engineering or financial analysis. With electricity, you are paying only for the energy. For any other energy carrier, you are paying for the energy and the energy carrier and the infrastructure. Guess which costs more.

 

If you're going to bring practical, this thread could become boroning.

Bob Wilson

 

People are working on something much simpler than boron ;-) It is aluminum air batteries, and solves a lot of those boroning problems. Inexpensive aluminum plates and water are used, and Al(oh)3 (aluminum hydroxide) is produced that can be recycled. Key benefit over boron is alcoa is already on board to recycle and mainly uses hydro and nuclear so you don't need to build a lot of new nuclear reactors. You do need to collect the aluminum hydroxide and truck it to a recycling center. Perhaps something like jiffy lube can collect the aluminum hydroxide and replace spent plates and water.

 

For the water in Al-air battery, you just need distilled water available from the store for less than the bottled drinking water. The battery needs topping off more often than the plates need replacing.

 

Doing a quick back of the envelope calculation about 25 kg of aluminum are used up to produced the energy in 6 gallons of gasoline. That can get a 100 mpge bev vehicle 600 miles + range of the lithium ion. That will use up about 25kg of water or 25 liters, so you would need a 6.6 gallon tank to replace at the same time. The aluminum hydroxide will be a paste that will need a storage tank too. You may want to stop every 300 miles or so, if they can set up recycling, add the water, take the aluminum hydroxide, and replace the tank, every two stops change the plates. If you are on a road trip, bring an extra storage for the aluminum hydroxide in the trunk, and add water ;-) That aluminum hydroxide paste from 25 kg of aluminum will produce 72 kg aluminum hydroxide with the added water and oxygen. Kinks need to be worked out. 25kg of aluminum is about $25 + $10 of distilled water. You get to recycle the aluminum but someone needs to make a profit, my guess is it will cost $60 for 600 miles. If most of the distance is done on a lithium battery that can be recharged much cheaper. The 18 kwh one in the volt may do fine with this aluminum air as a range extender. There are still technical hurdles to collect the aluminum hydroxide (if you leave it on the plate then the battery doesn't work) and prevent carbon dioxide poisoning, but these things have been worked out in the lab. Its much simpler than boron.

Think maybe 30% of the miles on a aluminum air rage extender. On a 15,000 mile year, that is 4500 miles or 8 changes of the plates for about $450 (assume plates are pro rated and can be changed early). If other electricity cost $0.15/kwh and you get 100 mpge add $531 for electricity. In california, texas, or florida you can be renewable at that price assuming in california you have roof space to put panels up.

 

I'm guessing Phinergy has solved most, if not all, of the technical hurdles on the battery end.

There press release from when they unveiled their test mule a few years ago said a water top for the 1000 mile battery off every 200 miles. No details on how much water, if the 200 mile figure was a low fuel light or "running on fumes" one. They might have gone with a 200 mile water tank simply for space on the test car, and it is the range a BEV will likely be able to cover in the near future. Then there is the slight weight savings of carrying less water at a time, which can be important if they are designing with the goal of the car carrying the aluminum hydroxide until the plates need replacing. That could entail less required plate swap shops on roll out, too.

Whatever their reasoning and plans, the main point is that user servicable element, distilled water, that can be frequent on a long trip depending on tank size, is something already something that readily available.

 

An old man who drives his wife and her dogs around, would pee substitute?

Bob Wilson

 

I'm sure they solved the lab tests, but that is far different than a battery that works for years in the field.

could be a bigger tank. 75 kg is a heavy tank, so probably need multiple or shops like oil changers that empty from bellow. I was giving there 1000 mile battery 600 miles of range extender duty @100mpge ;-) YMMV. That would require about 25liter water tank, 1/5 would be 5 liters or pretty small.

Yep no question of that. I'd put in a 13 liter water tank, which is still pretty small for a 25 kg primary cell (1 liter needed per primary cell kg of aluminum). Makes sense that you recycle when filling, but adding distilled water ( 3.5 gallons) to keep going till the plates need replacing would work on long trips. That would be 500 miles on the phinergy cycle, and 300 miles on the tougher than epa cycle (because you are going fast on a long trip ;-))

 

Pee is often acidic, the solution needs to be basic. So no pee would not work unless you add some base at the same time, or have a diet and metabolism that makes your urine basic.

 

A true Peeus