Featured CA Support for EVs

hybrids are great. but they are still creating some tailpipe emissions. eventually, more and more electric production can be carbon free, if we so choose.

 

Hefty rebates or other incentives are all well and good but there is still substantial evidence that electric vehicles aren't ultimately any better for the environment. The environmental impact of the battery production alone largely offsets the CO2 gains from driving a vehicle that produces less or no CO2. Then we have the cost of electricity. Most electric sources are far from being carbon neutral. Then there is the question of what to do with all these depleted batteries. I'm all for going green but we need to look at real cost and not just the cost we see in our wallets.

I've had my Prius C for nearly 5 years now and I'm just beginning to see any real savings if I had simply purchased a Corolla instead. Don't get me wrong I love how little I spend at the pump but I'm not fooled into thinking the cost of my car was all that great for the environment.

 

oy vey.

 

keep in mind where he lives and as a result what lies he has been fed...we should give him a break since it is hard for anyone to escape that

should be a warning for us as to where we get our news...and I mean only one sided news...good to hear and learn both sides of the story...the right and left are both guilty of this

 

There's a tool available that projects the emissions (both GHG and air pollution) of many light-duty vehicle technologies (e.g., BEV, PHEV, HEV, GDI, diesel) combined with dozens of different fuel pathways (e.g., petroleum-based, renewable) available free-of-charge. It's called the GREET (Greenhouse gases, Regulated Emissions, and Energy use in Transportation) model, developed by Argonne National Laboratory. It's available at Argonne GREET Model again free-of-charge, only registration is required. Both the "Fuel-Cycle Model" and the "Vehicle-Cycle Model" need to be downloaded if a full life-cycle analysis is desired.

The GREET model is Excel based, and is very flexible, e.g., a "user defined" option is available in the model which allows the latest electricity generation mix to be input (option "13" in #10. "Electric Generation") in the "Fuel-Cycle Model". Regional electricity generation mixes are also available.

I typically toggle the options to include well-drilling and well infrastructure to "yes" (defaults to no).

As far as I can tell (there are literally hundreds of possible vehicle technologies/fuel pathways combinations), diesel using DME from biomass has the lowest GHG and air pollution emissions of any technology/fuel pathway combination currently available in GREET (GHG emissions are actually negative by a large margin). That's when the DME facility is configured to co-produce electricity (apparently, DME from biomass production is highly exothermic). The electricity produced by the DME plant can displace the electricity generated from the grid. Even in a relatively clean grid like California, the GHG emissions are negative (net uptake).

GREET is usually updated yearly (current version is GREET_2016).

 

thanks! what is DME?

 

DME = dimethyl ether. It has properties similar to propane, i.e., is gaseous at STP.

 

Independent science isn't free, and direct funding from individuals is the closest you'll get to truly independent.

The report sites their sources if you think they are bending the story for their own goals..

If what you have heard is true concerning plug ins, the data would be readily available.

 

We're a little off track as far as litigating EV vs. Hybrid vs. etc.

We have to take as a given that CARB has previously said that they will do "whatever it takes" to make Plug-Ins successful in CA. We can argue til the cows come home if that is a good policy or not...I am just glad I do not live in CA.

As I see the situation, CA is by itself almost the whole USA plug-in market. Over 50% plug-in of sales are in CA, and one post here quoted 75% of EV/plug-ins still on the road are in CA ( I have not been able to verify that stat yet).

The thing CA is doing that really stimulates plug-in sales, is giving the free HOV access which is a huge incentive in CA with all their traffic. So if they stop free HOV in CA, essentially the whole plug-in market potentially collapses, not to mention the expiration of federal tax rebate for some companies such as Tesla.

So there is potentially need for CA to increase $$$ rebate to off-set the HOV incentive, if CARB sticks by their guns to do "whatever it takes". A lot of (blue) states have added plug-in incentives in response to CA's call for help to stimulate plug-in sales, but CA remains the lead player.

I just see it like E10 ethanol, mandates/incentives/strong plug-in lobby needed to politically force a plug-in market.

 

I'm curious as to why you care about the numerical value of the efficiency. Sure, higher is better, all things being equal -- which they aren't.
For example, most common rooftop solar cells are about 15% efficient -- but who cares, unless you are sending them into space?
Since I have enough roof space, I'd gladly pay 1/2 as much for panels that were only 10% efficient. If your roof space was limited would you pay double for 20% efficient panels? Cost, available area and cost to deploy all matter in this case.

For nuclear, we just find (mine), then process the fuel. Why does it matter if we can collect only 35% of the energy released when an atom splits? Of course if someone else is collecting 50% then we are bad engineers. But the numbers do not compare to other efficiency numbers such as 60% for combined cycle NG or 90% for charging a battery, etc.

Mike

 

i wish i lived in california. all the benefits of massachusetts, without the snow.

 

What's sad is not only does my 2005 Accord sedan get only about 22 or 23 MPGs, it's actually somewhat gutless, especially with A/C running. If I really stuff my foot in the Accord, it will downshift 2 gears and get going, but I know it's just sucking gas like crazy like that.

An EV motor has 100% torque from 0 rpm, right? They must be great to drive from a stop, boom they get going quickly.

I will buy an EV when the right car at competitive price becomes available.

 

You must mean the taxes. I will have to say one thing, it is high entertainment watching the workings of the Cali government.

 

from everything i can see, it isn't much different from here, just a higher level.

 

Getting back to the OP, the $3 billion proposal cleared the CA State Senate Appropriations Committee today over the objections of the State Department of Finance and will move to a floor vote before Sept. 15.

$3-Billion Electric Vehicle Rebate Bill Moves to California Legislature for Full Floor Vote | KTLA

 

excellent. keep the bean counters out of it.