carb icing -- small engine -- any brilliant cures

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by cyberpriusII, Jan 11, 2017.

  1. cyberpriusII

    cyberpriusII Prodigyplace says I'm Super Kris

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    Been poking around the web, but mostly just finding suggestions to fashion some sort of carb shield out of sheet metal.

    Not going to work for me....am I out of luck, or does is there someone here with a better idea.
    kris
     
    #1 cyberpriusII, Jan 11, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017
  2. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    amazon.com/Johnsens-2962-Premium-Isopropyl-Anti-Freeze/dp/B001DKR9OQ
     
  3. Eastside

    Eastside Member

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    Iso-HEET Premium antifreeze and injector cleaner. < $3 at any auto parts store, Walmart, etc.
    The Premium includes 2-cycle engines. The regular is only for 4-cyle.
     
  4. cyberpriusII

    cyberpriusII Prodigyplace says I'm Super Kris

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    So, humor me.

    I read a couple of the things on the gas line anti-freeze....but as I understand it, carb icing is caused by air traveling through the venturi. I know fuel also enters at that restriction, but, and I may be wrong, I thought the actual ice-up builds just above the venturi. Meaning anything in the gasoline would have little to no effect on the icing.

    I don't know, and I am not arguing. Just trying to understand the principles and how to make them work for me. :)
    kris
     
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  5. WilDavis

    WilDavis Senior Member

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    Gas-line anti-freeze is added to the gas to prevent any moisture present in the tank from freezing, forming ice which can then cause blockages in the gas-lines and injectors (both Bad Things). Carburettor icing is different, and as you point out is caused by the venturi effect in the carburettor lowering the temperature as the pressure decreases. It is particularly dangerous in aero engines which are even more prone to carb icing (temperature goes down as altitude increases), and aero engines are often fitted with carburettor heaters to help alleviate this. I fitted a "Minnow"¹ carburettor to my Mini when I lived in the UK. The "Minnow" carb had a heating element to help deal with carb icing!

    ¹ Reece Fish Carburettor - Wikipedia
     
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  6. cyberpriusII

    cyberpriusII Prodigyplace says I'm Super Kris

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    Hmmm....seems like I am out of luck.

    Struggling to clear some snow with my leaf blower, which is working after a fashion (I have a large Stihl backpack blower), but the carb keeps icing up. Not to mention me icing up. Wish I had not drank all the Jameson Irish over the weekend as a cure for my sprained wrist, because some Irish coffee sounds good right about now.

    Ah, well, the sauna (Finnish, with rocks) beckons....

    [​IMG]
     
  7. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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  8. cyberpriusII

    cyberpriusII Prodigyplace says I'm Super Kris

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    Never heard anyone talk about volts and blowers. It has no battery. I "pulls the string" and it starts. It is a pro model, but not top of the top. Anyway, again, I think I am stuck....My internet research tells me so....:)
     
  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    the real 'snow blower'? why isn't this a problem for fake snow blowers?
     
  10. bhtooefr

    bhtooefr Senior Member

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    I think your best bet would be to suck the intake air past the exhaust manifold somehow, to preheat the air, maybe?
     
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  11. hyo silver

    hyo silver Awaaaaay

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    Do you keep the leaf blower in unheated storage? Maybe if you gave it a few minutes in the sauna, it would last longer in the cold before freezing up. A metal surround for the air intake could work, as long as part of it contacts a warmer part of the engine. Failing that, forget the snow and stay in the sauna. You've got enough injuries already. :)

    Wait, I know! Put a turbocharger on it!
     
    #11 hyo silver, Jan 12, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2017
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  12. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    What model?

    How was carb icing diagnosed?

    Premixed oil and gas?

    Bob Wilson
     
  13. hyo silver

    hyo silver Awaaaaay

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    After a bit of websearching, and seeing what these things look like...how about some duct tape over about half of the air intake slots? Not so different from blocking the airflow on a car's radiator to keep the car warmer in Winter. :)
     
  14. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Go electric for a leaf blower or snow blower. We have a 13 amp Snow Joe that is great for our use, but I have no idea how much area you are clearing out or outlet situation. If electric with cords won't work, a gas snowblower is the easiest to implement solution. Or a broom for thin coatings of dry snow.

    I don't see how you can actually solve carb icing on an air cooled power tool not designed for winter use. Shielding might work if you only need to delay the icing for you to finish the job. Heating the intake air could run into operation issues and engine knock as the temperature varies; ripping off the carb and putting in a fuel vapor system might be easier to tune, and reduce the amount of fuel used.
     
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  15. bhtooefr

    bhtooefr Senior Member

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    Covering the air intake will make it worse by increasing the vacuum in the air intake. Vacuum is a pressure drop, pressure drop causes the temperature drop, temperature drop is what causes icing.
     
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  16. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    I'm still wondering how the carb icing was diagnosed. As a general rule of thumb, temperatures just above freezing with high humidity tends to favor carb ice. Below freezing, I've never seen the problem ... not that it can't happen. Just it is hard to cool sub-freezing air and extract enough moisture ... not impossible ... just difficult.

    Bob Wilson
     
  17. cyberpriusII

    cyberpriusII Prodigyplace says I'm Super Kris

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    Appreciate the discussion....and my various injuries are better -- but I am having a bit of difficulty using left hand still, which makes tinkering with temperamental small engines frustrating.

    And, here is my long -- possibly boring -- attempt to answer your questions.
    _____________

    My issues (well not all my issues -- :oops:)

    1) My steep GRAVEL driveway jumps from just below 400-feet in elevation to just over 800-feet in about 400 yards. Heavily forested on about 1/3 of the drive.

    2) Had an ice storm with nearly 1/2-inch of accumulation -- then we had a snow storm with about 4 inches on top of the ice -- or something like that -- honestly, it has become a blur.

    3) Weather moderated on Tuesday, with temperatures hitting 34F with plain old rain. Started a melt-off. Temps stayed around 35F through the night.

    4) Wednesday, fairly dense fog, driveway still covered, but very, very slippery. I could drive up and down on Tuesday, but on Wednesday, I had to put on tire chains, it was so dicey. Walking was difficult, and I don't need any more falls. Thought about putting on my caulked boots, but the rock on the road can make them dangerous, also. Temperature still at 34-ish F. While it was slippery, in some areas it was easily blown off with my leaf blower. So, it was fine for awhile, then started losing power. It would idle, but no power.

    Brought it up to house and let it sit for 30 minutes, in the meantime, went to clear roadside ditches which were running full with snowmelt, but were clogged in many areas by fir needles/sticks/etc. Clogged ditches mean washed out driveways.

    Hands were frozen (some of the unclogging is easier by hand), but went back to get blower and "lather, rinse, repeat" -- in other words, same problems repeated several times. Late in the afternoon, the fog disappeared and the sun was out. I should have tried then, but I was done for the day. .

    So, Ice-up is just my uneducated guess, but it seems to fit. Temp just over freezing, pretty humid (it was foggy), etc.

    Well, time to limp back outside (10 a.m. PST) and try again -- a bit misty, but nothing like yesterday -- and the temp is a balmy 29F.

    Of course with the refreeze Have a suspicion the blower won't be effective, if it runs.

    Thanks again, all of you.

    kris
     
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  18. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    I live in a part of the country where ice is not something that is commonly found outside of a beer cooler, but since I grew up in the Hoosier state, I'm not a newb where cold, 2-cycle engines are concerned.

    You may want to read up a little on Yamaha's fuel additive.
    They call it Yamalube, which sounds like something that one would normally use for something entirely different than lawn implements....but it's an alcohol free additive that the marine community uses.
    It's sometimes cold on the water, and it's ALWAYS humid.

    The problem with Seafoam is that it is alcohol based, and your fuel is probably ethaonlated enough already, being in OR.
    Many people use Sta-Bil (which isn't) which can cause jelling at lower temps.


    I'm with Bob.
    I'd want to confirm the ice diagnosis.
    Stihl makes mostly 2-strokers, so I'd also be interested in what you use and how often make a new batch of 2 cycle fuel.
    I HATE 2 cycle motors passionately.

    You may also want to try something that I derided my son-in-law for using which is a can of the premixed 40/50:1 small engine fuel that they sell everywhere now.
    My then 5-year-old Echo line trimmer, which I swore a blood oath would be my last ever 2-stroke product started getting finicky at feeding time.
    I tried a can, and haven't gone back to pump gas for that product since.

    It's hideously expensive, but so are chiropractor visits after swinging a 4-stroke line trimmer around for a few hours.

    Your call.

    Good Luck!!
     
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  19. cyberpriusII

    cyberpriusII Prodigyplace says I'm Super Kris

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    As I thought, the overnight refreeze has made my blower project pointless today. I tried for a few minutes (blower ran fine), but too icy this morning.

    Learned several years ago to only use non-ethanol premium in all the small engines. Carburetors and fuel lines actually have a lifespan with the non-ethanol. And, I actually prefer it in the car, I swear it has more power when I do.

    The non-ethanol is about a $1 more per gallon, but worth it in reliability of equipment. Use about three gallons of a 50-1 mix a month -- give or take -- more in the fall and spring (wood cutting and brushcutting) and not all that much in the summer (fire danger restricts small engine operations). Mix with the Stihl non-synthetic oil, which includes stabilizers. I usually do the mix, although sometimes my husband does. Problem is that he gets nervous and tends to spill while measuring. I am glad he is not a surgeon.

    Well, I am starting to sound like an Oregon logger, which, I am not, although my grandfather was back in the 1920s.

    So, two choices for today. Head down the driveway to the county road -- about 3/4 miles away, take off tire chains and go to work for the afternoon. Get back about 6 p.m., put chains on when the pavement ends....

    Or, defrost the freezer....I think going to work wins -- I would rather be using the blower :rolleyes:

    I could bore you all to tears, and if anyone really cares, let me know, and I will answer, but rather than list each piece of equipment with model numbers and all that we have

    Two brushcutters -- one Husquvarna, one Stihl (think super-duty weedwhackers, which will handle steel blades like you use on a circular saw).

    Three string trimmers -- two Stihl and one Ryobi (found it alongside the road).

    Two blowers -- backpack Stihl, handheld Husquvarna

    Three saws -- one Homelite Electric, one Remington Electric and one Stihl 29.

    Honda inverter 1000 watts.

    Oh, forgot my pride and joy -- a Stihl pole saw == if you don't know what that is, google it.

    Anyway, it is tough to type with only one hand (left is still sprained from ice fall), so off to work I go.
    Kris
     
    #19 cyberpriusII, Jan 12, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2017
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  20. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Might be time to add a self propelled snow blower with adjustable height to the stable, or a propane blower.
    Propane-Powered Lawn and Garden Products &#8211; LEHR

    For ice storms, applying a salt or CaCl solution through a yard sprayer before the storm might be a better approach.
     
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