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Clutch damper failure? Engine cutting out

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by totalimpact, Jul 5, 2019.

  1. totalimpact

    totalimpact Junior Member

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    My 2007 is having power delivery issues like the ICE is disconnecting from the drive train. Anyone want to confirm my suspicion, or have some better idea-

    No codes, electric side is in full health, I think the problem is this thing on the flywheel that looks like a clutch pack, a lot of people call it a "damper"-
    [​IMG]

    Here is a video of me in the car, and towards the end you can see the car starts shaking and shuttering as the motor cuts in and out: https://photos.app.goo.gl/9QrvRhwUddBMhFiW9

    And for those that dont believe its a clutch, here is more in depth video on that subject-
     
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  2. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    What does "full health" actually mean? When my pack was going bad, one symptom was very rough ICE starts; enough to rock the car while in P but they weren't sustained like that.
     
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  3. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    It is a dry clutch, it is not in the transaxle. (it has no effect of the ATF)
    It has no way to engage or disengage it, However if the engine or transaxle were to abruptly come to a stop, it would slip to protect the other one. The little springs allow for sudden changes in speed.
     
  4. totalimpact

    totalimpact Junior Member

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    Doubtful, I use the Prolong every 4 months. I bought it with 1 bad module, I replaced 2, + one next to it just to be safe. I have torque and techstream, so typically a bad cell is real obvious there, the volts dont dump under full throttle, they hold up around 16, in my experience when they are bad they are closer to 14, and when discharge conditioning, a bad cell will only get worse as it gets stressed out.

    And typically we get the lights and triangles when bat is at 14v, no codes so I lean more towards a mechanical issue than electrical.

    Jimbo- I am open to other ideas if its not the clutch pack... maybe something else inside the trans?
     
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    could it be something in the engine? there are a lot of things engine side that don't throw codes
     
  6. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    Didn't this happen to another member recently? He was getting crankshaft position sensor codes?
     
  7. totalimpact

    totalimpact Junior Member

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    i would love to see a code... but none, im sure theres a couple of things that wont code in the engine, but I from the sound of it, when it cuts out, it "sounds like" the engine is still running as it should, i "feel like" it should be something in the trans, but "feelings" dont give me much confidence. I talked to a mechanic friend and he said he has seen a couple with the "damper" coming out of balance and causing trouble, guess I will have to split it to confirm for sure, I have a spare trans, just no damper, so that is what has me hesitant to dive in.

    Also seeing this gen3 pushes me more towards the damper, especially with the comment of the guy having similar issue-
     
  8. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    If it's the damper, what got it to slip in the first place? Those things don't really fail unless they've been made to slip in the past.

    I sure wouldn't want to pull an engine and replace a damper without going after the root cause.
     
  9. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    I have a Prolong and a good balance lasts a long time much longer than 4 months. Lasts me almost a year. Why so much balancing?

    I would think if the damper was bad why would it make the engine shake? If its bad its worn out and no longer makes contact with the trans and would just slip. Slipping clutch should not make the engine shake. When a clutch in a regular car goes out it just slips the engine doesn't care.

    I seem to remember there may be an inspection plate where you can look at the condition of that damper.

    If you suspect its the trans pull the trans fluid and check it for metal wear. That's fast an easy. Put the fluid in wide mouth container and in the sun makes it easy to see non ferrous metal in it. And if there's real bad metal on the magnet too. Might even be out of fluid.

    Hard to believe the engine is shaking that bad and not throwing a code. So you have no check engine lights or red triangle whatsoever and no car icon on the mfd?

    How many miles on the car?
     
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  10. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    Total,

    After watching your video in post 1...

    If the clutch/damper has failed, how is the engine even starting?

    How far are you pressing the accelerator?

    Why do you need to force charge the battery?

    My 2007 is having power delivery issues like the ICE is disconnecting from the drive train. Anyone want to confirm my suspicion, or have some better idea-

    Why don't you start with this and provide more description for us as to your symptoms? Maybe we can provide better insight.
     
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  11. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    If there's an inspection hatch you might be able to put a witness mark across the two parts and see if it moves after one of these shaking episodes.
     
  12. totalimpact

    totalimpact Junior Member

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    40~50% pedal, no it doesnt need charging, I just dont feel safe driving it while filming, and dont even really want it on the road and have it just fully come apart. This is the only symptom, constant shuddering while driving... so I already have a spare trans, heading to the junk yard now to see what other treasures I can find, might just grab a whole motor if the price is right. I dont expect this would have anything to do with the hybrid system, inverter, etc, wouldnt those typically throw a code? ... and no - I dont want to split it and find that I need to hunt some other part, I want it in and out in a weekend if possible, I hate having cars dismantled for more than a week, I forget where all the flux capacitors go.
     
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  13. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    I seem to recall that too.

    I also seem to remember a similar issue where it was one of the MG's arching or otherwise misbehaving that required a transaxle replacement. I don't remember if that one was throwing codes. I have CRS syndrome.
     
  14. totalimpact

    totalimpact Junior Member

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    Well, just picked up a motor, now I have the whole drive train minus the inverter, the "damper" feels solid, so now at least I can drop my trans and if the damper feels sloppy I can quickly swap it...

    If that doesnt look to be the blatant issue, I will just swap the trans because I think the issue is isolated to the trans or MG, during idle warm up in park it idles clean, no skipping, so hopefully I end up with a spare motor (primarily not wanting to drop the drive train twice).

    I own 2x 2007 prius right now, the problem one is the "baby", it only has 170k, my other one has 250k beaten upon miles and it dont care, but I'm sure one day it will and I want parts on standby, the motor I grabbed was very clean, no oil leak marks, oil looked like honey not tar, it was a fleet car so I'm hoping proper "fleet maintenance" was done.
     
  15. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    When you say motor, do you mean engine? Or transaxle? (where the motors are)

    I hope you mean the transaxle, as I suspect a high voltage short, but that ought to throw codes.

     
  16. totalimpact

    totalimpact Junior Member

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    well, both, meant to say ICE, so yeah, now I have both in hand.
     
  17. Shahzad Nayyar

    Shahzad Nayyar Junior Member

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    Did u experience any performance issues? Especially while going uphill?
    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
  18. johnnychimpo

    johnnychimpo Active Member

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    What was the Outcome? Mine makes a clank but only In neutral and driving it feels like missfire but no codes
     
  19. mr_guy_mann

    mr_guy_mann Senior Member

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    Then it likely has a misfire, but sometimes the engine ecu won't set a code (for awhile). The most common fault is ignition- spark plugs and/or coils. If you replace things get genuine NGK or Denso plugs and Denso (OEM) coils.
     
  20. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    +1 there are a huge number of counterfeits on eBay and even Amazon now.
     
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