Featured CNBC: The Rise And Fall Of The Toyota Prius

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by Tideland Prius, Aug 10, 2019.

  1. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

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    Can't say I have seen a 2019.
    But....call me suspicious, but why is the photos a side shot?
     
  2. ice9

    ice9 Member

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    Specific to the kids in the back seat, my comment that you were referring to was this:

    "But the EV will eventually face an "inconvenience" headwind once the reality of charging time sinks in. Your kids in the back seat, demanding "are we there yet?" will rule the day..."

    Earlier, I was referring to range at the beginning of my comment. However, the reference to the kids in the back seat came much later and referred specifically to the chaos that would ensue after sitting around waiting HOURS for the car to re-charge because you did not plan your trip properly, or forgot to charge your car the previous night (as explained in the comment that you quoted most recently).

    Your second para only shows that you were very much aware of the fact that I was referring to exactly that scenario, and that I was referring to charge TIME, not range, in the applicable text of my original comment.

    Pls refrain from using my comments, or excerpts thereof, out of context.
     
    #82 ice9, Aug 13, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019
  3. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    You used the presence of kids to aggravate BEV charging on the road; to highlight the potential draw backs.

    I used children to highlight how the longer tank range of a Prius isn't truly an advantage. It should have been obvious since I never mentioned EV, BEV, or plug in that paragraph. Yes, I used the kids because you did, but I wasn't quoting you, nor taking something out of context.

    Plug ins were mentioned in the video because they are taking sales from, not just the Prius, but hybrids in general. It was not presented as a Prius versus comparison, but if you wish.

    The Prius sold just under 50 thousand last year. Since its introduction, the Model 3 has sold at a rate that rivals some of the Prius's best sales years. It sold over 46 thousand in May of this year. Plug in market share is growing faster than the hybrid segment at the same point since introduction, and they are doing it under conditions that are unfavorable to hybrid sales.

    BEVs do require a change in behavior and approach from the customer, and they won't work for all. The advantage over them that you contributed to the Prius is one that all ICE vehicles have, even FSPs. But the plug in market is not just BEVs. There are PHEVs for those in which BEV won't work. Most of the lost Prius sales for recent years likely went to the Prime.
     
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  4. Mambo Dave

    Mambo Dave Junior Member

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    Because I like the 'hint of a rear spoiler' they put on it.
     
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  5. 3PriusMike

    3PriusMike Prius owner since 2000, Tesla M3 2018

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    This is a great strategy to keep from making a major mistake.
    It also insures that you'll probably never find the next big thing.

    In math, this is known as getting stuck in a local minimum.
    (An example would be how training AI models where they use gradient descent during the back propagation)

    In cars, if you are always making just minor changes to your gas engine you will never figure out that electric cars are the next big thing. To Toyota's credit they did make the big leap to FC cars. but made the mistake of getting stuck there as well.

    Mike
     
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  6. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    apparently, the notion that the size of the group consisting of, "those in which BEV won't work" are a much much smaller group than one might think. Because Prius buyers are #1 for jumping ship to tesla, rather than prime. It is still nice - wishful thinking;

    Tesla Model 3 is affecting Prius sales, admits Toyota - though still not convinced on EVs - Electrek


    Here are the top 5 cars Tesla Model 3 buyers are trading in - Electrek

    Not to suggest there aren't SOME X-Prius/prime buyers. But seems prius buyers CAN pay more, and do, in order to get what they understand will work best for them.
    .
     
    #86 hill, Aug 13, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019
  7. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Actually, that has been proven false. The act of being willing to refactor (take on all those small risks) will often lead to discovery. It's a constant state of looking for improvement opportunity. Eventually, you find one. In math, that's known as a complex equation.

    Think about what happens when you add, subtract, multiple, and divide in a variety of different ways. A small poke in the right direction can lead to enormous change. To put this in terms of the automotive market, you must recognize it is a moving target... one that doesn't follow any particular path or destination and will continue to alter as you travel.

    Knowing that, ask yourself what the "next big thing" could mean? If it is a battery technology, what penalty is there for Toyota working to establish a culture of change at their dealerships highlighting the benefits of electrification? Building momentum for moving away from traditional vehicles is perfectly fine taking small steps.

    Put another way, I'm approaching my 20th year of pursuing greener technologies. With such a strong background in that effort to engage ordinary consumers in the acceptance of true change, I see a lot of repetition... including some major mistakes. The strategy of staying true to goals is what wins every time, even if that includes very small steps along the way.


    SM-T720 ?
     
  8. ice9

    ice9 Member

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    You confuse cause and effect. I was pointing out that EV charge time will aggravated the kids of less fastidious drivers, who have a more pragmatic understanding of Murphy's Law. :rolleyes:
     
  9. drash

    drash Senior Member

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  10. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    interest, but no deposits. i wonder if they'll ever make that many
     
  11. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Maybe for Europe, where it appears this Mini will only be available.
    And you appear to have poor comprehension, or maybe poor communication skills in general. Your original posts with the kids wasn't just about EV recharge times. It included this statement about the Prius having "a range-MPG advantage over the rest of the hybrid world" in addition to a "range-infrastructure advantage over the EV." This was post #56 for those following along. Did you intend to bring up the long tank range of the Prius in that post, because that is was that statement implies.

    So I got your using the presence of kids to show how waiting for a BEV to charge could be a hassle. I was using them, and their smaller bladders, to show how a long tank range is not a real advantage after things like biobreaks are factored. It was not used as a counter to your point about charge times. They PHEVs I alluded to in the paragraph(of post #61) that mentioned children were brought up as examples of the few cars with a gas tank range of under 300 miles. Nothing about charge times was mentioned.
     
    #91 Trollbait, Aug 14, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2019
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