Compare Chevy Bolt to Tesla Model 3

Discussion in 'EV (Electric Vehicle) Discussion' started by ggood, Apr 3, 2016.

  1. ggood

    ggood Senior Member

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    I've been reviewing known info about the Bolt and the Model 3, and was just curious to see if anyone here could shed additional light on the subject. So far, here's what I think I know:

    Bolt is a compact car, but with a roomy, efficient interior for this segment, ala the Honda Fit. Tall squared off wagon and a large rear hatch. The rear floor is not flush with the hatch and folded rear seats, but they plan to offer an optional false floor to make it flush and give hidden storage that looks to be deep enough for a spare tire. Seats 4. Traditional dashboard and styling inside. Display in front of driver and 10.5 inch centered, horizontal display. Lots of tech either standard or available as options, including CarPlay, android, collision avoidance, etc. Ride and handling will at best be like a Honda Fit. Aspires to be practical, not luxurious. Glass roof. 0-60 in 7 seconds. Starts at $37,500, but may be better equipped than the Mod 3 for the price (depending on how much Tesla charges to turn on the various software modules). 200 to 240 mile range. Uses CSS charging which can give 80% charge in 30 minutes? Public CSS charges are clustered in cities, rather than set up along likely highway corridors. GM has no plans to build or subsidize public chargers. Exterior look is OK, but a bit snub nosed in front. Reliability is GM, so worrisome, though with an EV, that may be less of a concern. Available at the end of this year.

    Mod 3 is a smallish mid-size with decent passenger,trunk and frunk space, and an open airy feeling interior. Oddly, it has a small traditional trunk opening, instead of a hatch. From the ride along accounts, 5 people will fit, but perhaps not quite as comfortably as Elon claims. Very non-traditional interior. Floating 15 inch centered display. Otherwise very Spartan or zen like aesthetic. Lots of tech standard or available, including auto safety etc., but not CarPlay or android. Ride and handling should be great. Definitely aspires to be a luxury car. Sloping glass roof. 0-60 in 4 to 6 seconds, depending on how power you buy. Starts at $35,000, Elon expects actual average price to be $42,000. 215 to 265 mile range, depending on how much battery you buy. Uses Tesla supercharging, which can charge to 90% in 30 minutes? Tesla investing heavily to create superchargers along highway corridors. Exterior styling is great. Reliability could be a concern, given past issues, huge growth rate, and need for a very rapid ramp up in production. Availability is end of 2017 at best, will probably have delays, and even in best case is 2 years out for those of us in the middle of the reservation list.

    Comments? Corrections? Additions?
     
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  2. JimN

    JimN Let the games begin!

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    The Model 3 selling price for a stripper is $35000 + destination fee + Tesla BS fee. The Bolt may have a MSRP of $37500 but will be selling for less + dealer BS fee. I believe a lot of the Bolt's options will be standard in the stripped Model 3.

    Tesla's attitude is that you can charge anywhere there is electricity. Can the Bolt plug into 110v, J1772, & Chademo? We know it won't plug into Tesla Superchargers or destination chargers.

    I believe Tesla will support the Model 3 with software upgrades and may eventually sell a bigger battery to the owner. GM's attitude for the Bolt will be--no upgrades for you.

    I have more faith in Tesla resolving whatever issues appear than with Mr. Goodwrench's attitude of "It's supposed to do that." GM blamed owners, not their own substandard or defective ignition switches when the cars turned themselves off. Tesla retroactively improved their warranty coverage for the Model S to include (unintentionally) running over a road hazard.

    Will GM's warranty match or exceed Tesla's? I doubt it.

    I believe the Model 3 will have a full 5 star safety rating. I'll be surprised if the Bolt has a 5 star safety rating.

    As I said, "I'll eat my own vomit before I buy another GM vehicle." I placed a reservation on a Model 3 although I may not order the car.
     
  3. plug-it-in

    plug-it-in Member

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    Good points. No need to throw up!

    Now watch this:
    For the sake of simplicity I ignore dealer fees, taxes, mostly reference to rebates, etc. and the prices are not recently confirmed but in the end exact prices don't matter. I am showing a trend.
    2016-17 Volt listed at US$ 35,000 - Can$ 40,000 (50 miles EV range)
    2016 Leaf listed around US$ 35,000 - Can$ 40,000 (101 miles range)
    2017 Bolt said to be around US$ 37,000 - Can$ unknown (said to have 200 miles range)
    2018 (?) Tesla 3 - said to be US$ 35,000 - Can$ unknown (said to have 215 miles range - or more?)

    2016 Prius, depending on modes and options Can$ 26,000 to 31,000.
    The Can$ 40,000 Volt qualifies for a $11,517 Ontario Govt. Incentive. This makes the price of the base Volt about equal to the price of a 2016 Prius - broadly speaking.

    Now if you were Toyota, how would you price the 2017 Prius Prime (plug-in) with 22 miles EV range? (In either currency!)

    According the Tony Seba's "Clean Disruption of Energy and Transportation" (check on Amazon) the average price of a car/SUV in the US is around $31,000. Now if you are on the market for a car, and can get one for $35,0000 (less rebates!), which runs like a Porsche, good quality, seats 5 AND free "fill-ups" on your long trips at least, which car would you buy? On the cost of gas you save over the ownership of the car, you can probable send one kid to collage. You do the math!

    And I am convinced that an SUV version of the Model 3 is on the drawing boards at Tesla.

    I am looking for a replacement of my 2008 Prius. I looked at the new Prius. I found it too plasticky (cheap) even to my current car. I will need to test drive it. But I will definitely look at the 2017 VOLT (Yes, I never thought that I will ever step into a GM dealership either, but things change.) Maybe wait for the Prius Prime (2017?) if the price is OK.

    Remain undecided
    Laszlo
     
    #3 plug-it-in, Apr 4, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2016
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  4. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i'm sure there will be people who buy each, it's not that clear cut.

    as for prime pricing, that's going to depend on how badly toyota wants to sell the car.
     
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  5. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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  6. ggood

    ggood Senior Member

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  7. Toppcat

    Toppcat Member

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    Bolt is design like the fit lots of room & cargo space! Technology handed down from the volt yes most likely you can get one by next year charge at home or stations. Model 3 awesome looking less cargo room faster and maybe a little more claim range! put a down payment now maybe you get one if your lucky in 3-4 years baring and problems! Get ready to wait IN line to use charging stations, as I see out in silicone valley tesla are nesting at charge stations! Makes more sense to go with a prius plugin or Volt. Going out of town where there no charge station no problem! Big problem if you have a EV only!
     
  8. ggood

    ggood Senior Member

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    Even with a 200 mile range, I'm sure most people would consider an EV only as a 2nd car. I think GM has done a lot of things right with the Bolt, but not sure I want another costly "economy" class car. Been there done that with the Prius for the last 12 years. Model 3 will be a great car I'm sure but I really want more utility, and there is lots of uncertainty for delivery time, so I might have to go Bolt or wait even longer for model Y. Or do nothing. Or wait even longer for the Apple car. In any case, I've probably bought my last Prius. As for the tax credit, I think the Model 3 is arguably worth the price, with or without a tax credit.
     
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  9. plug-it-in

    plug-it-in Member

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    My point exactly. It seems the the US$35,000 price range is getting crowded with a choice of very nice list of fine plug-in cars, each can do more than 22 miles in EV mode. And more coming from Hyundai. Their "Prius killer" Hybrid is also 22 miles rated - I think, need to check. They can't possible sell in the same price range as a 200+ miles plugin. On the top of it the various rebates favor the bigger batteries, and rightly so. So after rebate (Ontario) a C$ 40,000 Volt will cost the same as a plugless Prius. The Hyundai plug-in Sonata with 9.8 KW battery qualifies for C$8,460, which is about what the Prius Prime will get.

    That said I should visit my neighborhood Hyundai dealer too.

    We live in exiting times!
    Laszlo
     
    #9 plug-it-in, Apr 5, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2016
  10. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    but they are all different vehicles for different purposes. buyers will weigh the pluses and minuses of each, price being one of them, and make their decision on the overall balance of how it fits their needs and desires.
     
  11. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    Watch the test drive videos of folks exciting the back seats; several were less than fluid shall we say. :p There is a video of one of the Bolt test mules at CES where the reviewer was about 6'2" or so who sat in the back with the driver's seat still positioned for him and he was fine.
     
  12. plug-it-in

    plug-it-in Member

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    I tried a Tesla S - their Toronto showroom. I banged my head when trying to get out. Others also complained. As you mature (age - lol) you loose some of your flexibility. I can get into a Ferrari Dino, but I can't get out!

    But, it seems that by 2018 there will be a lot of US$35,000 environmentally friendly cars to pick from, depending what you like/need. And that is good.

    Laszlo
     
  13. dbcassidy

    dbcassidy Toyota Hybrid Nation, 8 Million Strong

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    The product comparison is interesting, however, to me, the companies standing behind their product is very important. What has happened in the last couple of days with the advance sales of Model 3 proves what Tesla can do, that GM could NEVER do!.

    Musk, is a visionary, engineer, has a very, very strong, loyal following - GM, well, wishful thinking.

    I'd go with the Model 3.

    DBCassidy
     
  14. plug-it-in

    plug-it-in Member

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    Thanks for your thoughts.

    I will test drive a Hyundai Hybrid next week. It is impossible to get into a Volt to test. The 2017s are not here yet. A local dealer wanted me to order one - hahh. I am not that adventurous.

    As for the new Prius. Inside it is too "plasticky" to me. It looks outright cheap. (At the level or one notch above the interior of our iMiEV, but that we bought as a runabout.) My 2008 Prius is much nicer appointed inside, even after 8 years of use. I have all kind of goodies, like auto-dim rear view mirror with garage door opener, auto-dimming/courtesy lights etc. OK these features are not must haves but we got used to them. The garage door opener comes with the 'super option' package of the top model of the 2016 Prius. There is all kinds of tech stuff (options) in the base or technology versions but these were put in at the expense of the nicer interior. Will drive one next week.

    Maybe I will wait till the Prius Prime - next year. But if it is priced comparably to the Hyundai plug-in and assuming the same Ont. Govt. 'incentive' - same drive battery size, the Volt beats both of those on price. Yes, I know GM is not Toyota but one must leave dangerously - eh?

    Cheers
    Laszlo
     
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  15. stephane

    stephane Prius v owner

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    I try the volt gen2 before to buy my v and honestly the volt is top noth notting bad to say me and my wife were both sold on it but in the end there was not enough cargo space for us so we take the v after six month I love my v but dream on the volt..... for reliability i did a lot of research on Volt gen1 I invite you to do the same as it get better customer satisfaction than Prius
     
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  16. Jeff N

    Jeff N The answer is 0042

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    Lots of stuff here. I will try to hit all the items I noticed above:

    The Bolt EV price is "not more than" $37,500 US and includes the $~900 destination fee. GM has hinted that the final price may be slightly less.

    The Tesla Model 3 price of $35,000 may not include the destination fee so the actual Bolt vs Model 3 base price differential may be closer to $1,500 rather than $2,500. Of course, we don't know what the standard equipment is between the cars so that might account for some of the remaining difference.

    The Bolt EV seats 5, not 4. It will support up to 32A (around 7,200 kW) AC charging. It will
    Also support DC charging using CCS at a rate of at least 50 kW and perhaps somewhat more. It will be capable of adding 90 miles of range in 30 minutes and charging 0-80% in 60 minutes.

    The 2016-2017 Volt has an MSRP of about $33,200, not $35,000.

    The Hyundai Ioniq PHEV is supposed to get around 27 miles of EV range.

    We don't know the Tesla Model 3 charging specs although the battery is rumored to be between 55 and less than 60 kWh. The Model S with a 60 kWh pack charges 0 to 80% in about 45-55 minutes, not 0-90% in 30 minutes. Tesla's with larger battery packs charge faster.
     
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  17. dbcassidy

    dbcassidy Toyota Hybrid Nation, 8 Million Strong

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    Model S, why?, when I see a company aiming for the heavens (Space X), I see vision, the ability to push the envelope, and drive to get there. It is perhaps these reasons and others, I haven't mentioned that puts Tesla at the leader of the pack.

    I honestly can not sat the same for GM.

    DBCassidy
     
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  18. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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  19. JimN

    JimN Let the games begin!

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    That was 47 years ago. What have you done for me lately? Pushing the envelope for concealing defective and substandard ignition switches?
     
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  20. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    I'm not a GM fanboy, just pointing out the facts. As to lately, how about the subject of this thread?
     
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