Converting Prius G3 to all Electric removing ICE

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Accessories and Modifications' started by smilyme, Nov 3, 2019.

  1. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    oops
    earlier I stated MG1 to MG2 ratio was 1.14
    its 1.014 on G3 in EV Mode NOT 1.14


    My Prius Motor/Generator Specifications List
    (only electric specifications)

    Classic

    MG2 44 hp 33 KW/273ac max 5600 RPM 350 N·m (258 lbf·ft)
    MG1 20 hp 15 KW/273ac max 6500 RPM 400 N·m (295 lbf·ft)

    G2 P112

    MG2 67 hp 50 KW/500ac max 6700 RPM
    MG1 41 hp 30 KW/500ac max 10000 RPM
    -MG1 2.4 ratio to MG2 both M1/M2 Torquing
    -MG1 2.4 ratio to MG2 ICE
    -MG2 xx ratio to Drive Shaft (help)

    G3 P412

    MG2 80 hp 60 KW/650ac max 13500 RPM (403 lbf·f)
    MG1 57 hp 42 KW/650ac max 13500 RPM
    -MG1 1.014 ratio to MG2 both M1/M2 Torquing
    -MG1 3.6 ratio to MG2 ICE
    -MG2 8.6 ratio to Drive Shaft

    G4

    MG2 72 hp 53 KW/650ac max17000 RPM
    MG1 31 hp 23 KW/650ac max 17000 RPM
     
    #41 smilyme, Nov 7, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
  2. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    For the record my mod
    could reach a theoretical speed of

    103 MPH



    Theoretical Maximum
    MPH of G3 P410 all Electric Conversion is 103 MPH

    1)
    M2 to shaft ratio in G3 P410 is 8.6 to 1
    according to professor Kelly of Weber State.
    reff


    2)
    195r15 is approx 1.81 meters or so circumference


    3)
    13500 rpm / 1.014 ratio MG1 to MG2 = 13130 max rpm not to over-spin MG1
    The rpm of MG2 must be governed to max 13130 rpm
    so maxing out MG2 at 13130 revs instead of 13500
    because we cant over rev MG1 limit of 13500
    It will cost us a little HP that we cannot tap in M2
    If we use M1 as well
    13500 rpm / 1.014 ratio MG1 to MG2 = 13130 max rpm not to over-spin MG1



    therefore:

    13130 rpm / 8.6 ratio to wheel shaft = 1,527 wheel turns per minute
    1,527 wheel turns per minute * 1.81 meters approx wheel circumference = 2,763 meters / minute
    2763 meters / minute * 60 minutes = 165,780 meters / hour
    165,780 meters / hour / 1000 meters = 165.8 Kilometers / hour
    165.8 Kilometers / hour / 1.609344= 103 MPH




    accessible HP is not 80
    13500 rpm / 13313 max rpm = 97.2 Percent of Capacity
    .972 * 80hp = 77.6 hp from MG2
    After governing M2's 80 hp
    we can have available 77.6 hp from M2 AND 57 hp from M1
    for a total 129.6 HP ALL ELECTRIC
    if MG1 spinning at max 13500 and MG2 spinning at max 13130 rpm

    (Assuming my updated battery pack has the power)
    that is
    129.6 HP all electric from a G3 folks!


    Interestingly this mod if applied to G4 could
    ONLY yield 103 hp from MG1 and MG2
    (72hp mg2 and 31hp mg1)


    that's right
    you heard heard it here first
    103 MPH Possible AND 129.6 HP Electric HIDDEN in G3


    this G3 project is:

    129.6 HP all Electric in a Prius G3 Conversion
    REMOVING ICE or cutting drive to ICE
    using EXISTING electric motor(s) and EXISTING inverter(s)
    (Better) Batteries required

    Kit to come
     
    #42 smilyme, Nov 7, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
  3. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    thread summary

    I looked into this some time ago when
    G2 started showing up as scrap
    but with the G2 and the 2.4 ratio problem
    when joining M1 and M2 the opportunity was not there

    Then came the weld on G2
    but it was not practical
    for any type of kit for the masses
    and a little under powered for an EV
    I calculated approx 91 hp since
    we cant access all of M1 Hp since
    we need to sync at max 6500 RPM of M2
    so even with a weld
    the opportunity was just not there


    The G3 was available
    with an acceptable ratio to join M1 and M2
    but because we have to disconnect the ICE
    it would have been uneconomical destroying a
    otherwise fine Hybrid.No market.


    So I waited for the markets to start to
    produce G3 as scrap.


    2020 time is now up
    you need a donor G3 car,
    blown ICE engine or eg 780 km engine or just a good cheap G3
    then remove ICE or ICE shaft cut
    swap couple of Toyoda ecus with my replacements
    a couple of Toyoda computer tricks
    my battery controller
    its a fairly easy mod then for an end DIY user
    it will be basic car, many features will be lost.


    Batteries not included.
     
    #43 smilyme, Nov 7, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2019
  4. Maarten28

    Maarten28 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2014
    328
    156
    1
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Three
    MG1 to M2 is what I already mentioned 143/145, indeed 1.014. With the addition that if the ICE does not turn, MG1 turns in reverse.

    I'm curious where you find the 13500 RPM limit for MG1. In a normal prius it is limited to +10000 and -4950. As mentioned, the negative value comes into play when the ICE is not running and that is what limits the Prius to 41 mph in electric mode.
    Maybe the physical limitation of MG1 is 13500 RPM, but the Prius will not let it run that fast. The -4950 is an arbitrary limit because the PIP is limited to 62 mph in EV mode, that equals to -7400 RPM for MG1.
    But you will need to bypass that limit which is in the ECU so you will have to program your own.
     
  5. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Maarten28
    yes i am designing programing a few ecus. it will replace toyodas.

    The 13500 RPM it in the Weber Video on P410 above
    from professor Kelly
    I seen it here and there in Toyoda's literature too.
     
    #45 smilyme, Nov 8, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2019
  6. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2018
    2,504
    2,359
    1
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    2018 Prius c
    Model:
    Two
    Have you worked out what you’ll do to lock or bind this shaft?
     
  7. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller


    thanks
    I have no idea
    suggestions welcome
     
  8. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    ****************************************************************************************

    This is not for everyone I know

    If anyone/DIY wants no know my plan

    or if anyone/DIY with Prius knowledge
    who can see what I'm doing here
    sees a problem
    and is wiling to help


    I'm good on electronics
    However
    I have no Prius experience
    and no Prius mechanical experience whatsoever
    and very little mechanical experience

    1)
    a new logic board
    that controls the inverter gets replaced
    (special thanks to Damien Maguire for creating and placing in Public Domain)


    2)
    a new ecu controls the new logic board
    -inputs safety (6), gas pedal (6) , range sensor prnd (8), Data from new logic board, temp etc (10), Speed (3)

    I will not be on using any of Toyodas ecu control logic
    (well important ones anyway)


    3)
    a new ecu will also
    use intercept wires from the old
    Skid Control ECU / Actuator Assembly
    and wires from the old
    steering control ecu ()
    and restore basic steering and brakes



    Brake-Regeneration, Boost , Speed map,
    perhaps later,
    too much for that on G1
    for a proof of concept
    "simple stupid" for now


    that's the car so far:
    "go steer stop"



    4)
    The power control module ecu
    gets a hardware hack inside that
    restores a few required systems
    nothing fancy on the car will work anymore
    and no old display, no ac, no heat

    Another way is to replace the pcm ecu
    it would be 50 or
    so new splices and a new fuse panel
    and another ecu, restoring basics.

    Yet another way
    is to trick the
    left over toyoda systems
    that
    everything is OK

    we will see


    There is no ICE to deal with
    so that's a relief
    those of us who have played
    with Speeduino or Megasquirt
    would know enough said on that
    the inverter logic board has been reverse engineered
    and boards are available from Damien Maguire as of dec 2019
    i will be using his
    the new Inverter controller will be mine
    and replacing 2 additional toyoda ecus will be mine

    It will be a basic car
    brakes, steering, shift , lights, signals, speed, a new display panel, doors, windows, wipers, defog
    (no heat, no air, no alarm, no keyfob, no fancy features)
    (no brake ecu regeneration)
    and not much anything else, for now anyway,

    I hope other engineers and dyi
    will get in on it and spoil my fun
    bringing systems back up
    and improving the mod

    3 toyoda ecus
    will be smashed
    in a celebration
    sorry Toyoda
    and bye techstream


    I may sell a kit
    with the few ecu's to swap out
    or post it in public domain
    or not
    only god knows
    we will see


    "poor little G3 prius is pushed back to an old pre obd camry :)"


    I think you will see these mods all over shortly
    its like dandelions showing up at once
    it has to do with conditions being right
    its cheap, available (G3 scrap),
    and reverse engineered (Damien)
    enabling control of MG1 and 2
    for enough power 130 HP (125 probably)
    the MG1 and 2 trick no ICE is in pubic domain now
    for a viable low cost DIY EV
    and (kinda) easy


    Dec 2019
    I cant start this for months,
    possibly,
    if I've inspired anyone that's great
    beat me to it

    btw I myself will be charging with solar
    min 8 >300 watt panels
    Total Panel Cost is $2-3 K

    Controller is easy we can almost go straight into the Inverter
    (it has great DC-DC regulation)
    and Charge away
    Cost is only a few hundred dollars
    for wires and for safety and controls and first responded disconnects

    Car and mod $2-3 K

    Batteries are not included


    any angels who want to ship me inverters
    "Inverter donations wanted G2, G3, G4 or any
    would be very appreciated, broken up or not"
    message me
    and g3 pcm also wanted working or not

    ******************************************************************************
     
    #48 smilyme, Nov 9, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2019
  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    83,244
    36,315
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    i think you're in unchartered waters, except for one fellow here from long ago, who moved on to leaf forum.

    but he kept it close to the vest, and started his own business with his knowledge and ability
     
  10. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Thanks
    That's encouraging
    I like uncharted waters and breaking ground

    I see this opportunity a Little earlier then most
    it will uncloak this year to the masses, I'm sure of it.
     
    bisco likes this.
  11. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
  12. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    my understanding of gear difference is wrong above
    we can tap the full driving 130 HP rating
    at much lower rpm from both electric motors
    so any gear difference doesn't matter
    this problem does not apply to G3
    as it did with G2

    as G3 with the new gearing 1.014
    and raised rpm
    neither motors will ever approach
    anywhere near maximum RPM
     
  13. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    83,244
    36,315
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    Nice!
    You can see how popular this will be by the many responses(y)
     
    #53 bisco, Nov 11, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019
  14. Grit

    Grit Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    2,566
    2,229
    1
    Location:
    BOY
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius
    Model:
    Four
    Haven't seen a post / reply about how many miles can one can drive on a single charge when converted to all electric.
     
  15. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2018
    2,504
    2,359
    1
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    2018 Prius c
    Model:
    Two
    I think it’s BYO Battery, so bring as much range as you want.
     
  16. Mithrandrost

    Mithrandrost Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2018
    29
    37
    0
    Location:
    Canada
    Vehicle:
    2018 Prius
    Model:
    Base
  17. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Regarding Batteries correct BYO and your Control

    This tread will focus on exploiting the existing G2 inverter
    with recent information that is the public domain
    for a cheap EV conversion by removing ICE

    and How to trick and bypass Toyoda so its feasible


    "Batteries not included"



    thanks Mithrandrost i love vintage conversions
     
    #57 smilyme, Nov 11, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019
  18. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A

    imwoody36 your the coolest
    2008 All Electric Prius without a gas engine



    this is driven by M2 only
    not with M1
    of course it would be slow
    so limited speed
    and with original toyoda ecus
    he had his 3 battery of his packs in parallel
     
    #58 smilyme, Nov 11, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019
  19. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Wait for it




    This guy/guys are awsome
    heres his youtube channel
    imwoody36 you are very cool
    imwoody36 - YouTube
     
  20. smilyme

    smilyme Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2019
    75
    20
    0
    Location:
    Toronto
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    proof of concept from 2009
    Prius 70 MPH Electric Mode (Second Demo): Ewert Energy Systems
     
Loading...