1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Driver assist tools leading to disconnected drivers?

Discussion in 'Gen 4 Prius Main Forum' started by raspy, Oct 14, 2016.

  1. raspy

    raspy Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2016
    438
    699
    0
    Location:
    London, UK
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Interesting post from UK site, Pistonheads (that is a community of folks who enjoy driving, and talk mostly about sporty cars)

    The Gen 4 has Toyota Safety Sense. What are your thoughts?

    "Part of it is awareness. At one level we're creating a generation of drivers ready to abdicate responsibility to sensors and black boxes. Let's go back to my unfortunate colleague being rear-ended in traffic. Not so long ago that would be clear cut - if the driver behind couldn't bring their car to a safe stop they were either driving too close, too fast, not paying attention or a combination of the above. Possible reluctance to admit liability aside, everyone understood that. Now we have people who might not push the brake pedal hard enough, expecting the systems initiate assisted braking and bring the car to a halt. Or drivers on radar cruise control who read in the brochure their car could 'stop and go' of its own accord in traffic and, having paid extra for the option, entirely reasonably expected it to do just that. From 'my foot slipped...' to 'my automatic emergency braking system seems to have failed' or 'my attention assistance system forgot to remind me to stop for coffee' suddenly opens up a yawning grey area in personal responsibility, never mind legislation and insurance."

    Source: Ditch the driver assists: Tell Me I'm Wrong | PistonHeads
     
    Mendel Leisk and RCO like this.
  2. RCO

    RCO Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2016
    3,709
    5,183
    0
    Location:
    Cornwall
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    We would be wise to use them, but wiser still never to rely on them completely!
     
    pilotgrrl, krmcg, bisco and 2 others like this.
  3. GT4Prius

    GT4Prius Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2014
    530
    412
    0
    Location:
    Cumbria, UK
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Excel
    These are driver aids, not autonomous features. So the driver always has the responsibility. Whether or not drivers recognize and understand that is a live issue I agree, but apart from that I think the issue is clear cut.

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
    fuzzy1, HobbsNick and RCO like this.
  4. alanclarkeau

    alanclarkeau Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    7,041
    7,580
    0
    Location:
    near Brisbane, Australia
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    I enjoy driving - give me a mountain road, good scenic route GREAT. Give me a boring commute with only the rear end of a SUV to see - that's not enjoyable driving, and that's where I feel driving aids come into their own. Some days, the most exciting part of my commute is reversing out of my driveway.
     
    pilotgrrl, grape808, wrprice and 3 others like this.
  5. HobbsNick

    HobbsNick Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2016
    107
    156
    0
    Location:
    Newcastle, U.K.
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius
    The story feels like click bait aimed to please the mindset of the magazines current readers. These items are currently only aids to driving, aimed at making driving safer. In the case of lane assist would PistonHeads rather it not be available and then that way if someone is distracted they end up having an accident.

    At the end of the day as the person sat behind the wheel You are deemed as in control of it and you can override the assistance aids.
     
    Zythryn, alanclarkeau and RCO like this.
  6. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,751
    48,964
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    might not be any worse than phones, but definitely a problem.
     
    RCO likes this.
  7. MorganAdcock

    MorganAdcock New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2016
    15
    19
    0
    Location:
    upstate New York
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius
    Model:
    Three Touring
    I disagree. It's a false dichotomy.

    If you don't like it, turn it off. But there's nothing about it which requires that you abdicate your responsibilities as a driver. It's just an added layer of safety. Sometimes the car's sensors see things before I do, or they can respond faster than I do. I'm happy to have that extra measure of safety, and knowing that it's now available, I purposefully got a car which had it. Preventing an accident helps keep all of us safer, and my car undamaged.
     
    pilotgrrl, PeteB, Colin Jones and 3 others like this.
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,751
    48,964
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    you're advising the o/p, or others who agree. but the issue is people who allow the tech to lull them into a false sense of security. we can't shut it off for them, and they are a danger to society.
     
    Lightning Racer, grape808 and RCO like this.
  9. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2008
    6,171
    4,163
    1
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Vehicle:
    Other Electric Vehicle
    Model:
    N/A
    Looking at the overall picture, prior to safety driver assist technology I saw far too many people who would be putting on makeup, reading, digging in the glove box, talking on the phone or otherwise ignoring the road and traffic around them.
    This is nothing new.

    Now, these safety systems, if use incorrectly, could possibly lead to an accident, that is true.
    But that isn't the question, and should not be your concern.

    The concern should be, does this technology prevent more accidents than it creates?

    This is anecdotal, but I know this technology prevented me from getting in an accident, and has not caused any for me.
     
  10. raspy

    raspy Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2016
    438
    699
    0
    Location:
    London, UK
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    In Germany:

    "Tesla has reportedly been told to stop advertising an “autopilot” function on its cars after the term was deemed to be misleading."
    Source: Tesla ordered to stop advertising 'autopilot' function | The Independent

    and "The Federal Motor Authority told Tesla owners in a letter that the Autopilot function is purely a driver assistance system and not a highly-automated vehicle that can be operated without the driver's constant attention."
    Source: Germany sends Tesla drivers Autopilot warning letter| Reuters
     
    alanclarkeau, RCO and bisco like this.
  11. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,751
    48,964
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    the question is: 'are driver assist tools leading to disconnected drivers?' the answer is undeniably yes.
     
    RCO and raspy like this.
  12. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2008
    6,171
    4,163
    1
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Vehicle:
    Other Electric Vehicle
    Model:
    N/A
    No question.
    But it is misleading to leave it at that.

    Make-up, phones, newspapers, cigarettes, maps, lost items and kids are also leading to "disconnected" drivers.

    I guess my question would be, so what?
     
  13. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,751
    48,964
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    agreed, and we're never going back. it will be more and more dangerous out there until we have completely autonomous cars.
     
    RCO and goldfinger like this.
  14. goldfinger

    goldfinger Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2012
    535
    402
    0
    Location:
    Buffalo
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius
    Model:
    Three
    People do rely on semi-autonmouse features too much. It's like 4 wheel drive. The first bad driving day all I see are 4 wheel drive vehicles in the ditch. Look at me I can drive fast and I'm invincible. My car has AWD and it stops for me. Oh, wait, I've got a text.
     
    RCO, raspy and bisco like this.
  15. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,751
    48,964
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    exactly. same thing here, 4wd, awd, and for some reason, beemers, scattered all over the highway.
     
    RCO likes this.
  16. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    54,697
    38,236
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    I'm thinking the rise of semi-autonomous driving features parallels the increase in electronic controls, touch screens and similar crap. They deserve each other. :rolleyes:
     
    RCO and bisco like this.
  17. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,751
    48,964
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    young whippersnappers!:mad:
     
    RCO and Mendel Leisk like this.
  18. raspy

    raspy Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2016
    438
    699
    0
    Location:
    London, UK
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Touch screens are awful to use on the move. At least with physical buttons, you could "feel" the difference between them.

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
  19. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2009
    17,113
    10,043
    90
    Location:
    Western Washington
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    From second-half 2014 to first-half 2016, traffic fatalities in the U.S. are up 18%. This increase is far more than the increase in actual miles driven. And also faster than the growing market availability of driver assist features.

    It seems that drivers are getting increasingly disconnected from their driving responsibilities, even without driver assist tools.

    Put down that smartphone, and drive.
     
    pilotgrrl and bisco like this.
  20. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,751
    48,964
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    agreed!(y) (see post #6)
     
    RCO likes this.