Drove a Smart ForTwo yesterday

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Jun 27 2007, 08:52 PM) [snapback]469160[/snapback]</div>

I see so it is the same pricing system as here in the US. OK, another question. Since the automakers seem to just charge Canadians more for the same car, do Canadians drive across the border to buy cars like they do to by Beer, Cigarettes, and Gasoline. The cars meet the same regulations except that Canada requires daytime running lights. It would seem like a way to save some money. I know a quite a few Americans have purchased motorcycles in Canada and brought them back because Canada gets a lot of models that the US doesn't get. Is it the same with cars?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(PriusMatt @ Jun 28 2007, 09:31 AM) [snapback]469273[/snapback]</div>

Being from the UK I'm not sure, except that "T" always means TAX!

(General Sales Tax and Provincial Sales Tax im guessing. Look out for EMST 'Even More Sales Tax' too.)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Hobbs @ Jun 28 2007, 04:29 AM) [snapback]469285[/snapback]</div>

You are correct concerning PST. GST, however, stands for Goods and Services Tax.

 

We have a lot of car assembly in Canada, but no Canadian-owned manufacturers. There have been a lot of news articles on the price difference for cars in Canada, particularly lately as the dollar improves.

Essentially what they report is that cars got higher sticker prices in Canada when our dollar was weak. As the dollar strengthened, the sticker prices stayed the same (even though that made the cars more expensive than in the US). The car makers basically sell for whatever the market will bear, and many Canadians are either just used to the high sticker prices, or not willing to go through the hassles of importing a car to save a few grand (esp. since some manufacturers make that a very difficult process, above and beyond the hassles with customs), or are simply unaware of the price differences, so the manufacturers get away with it. As far as I know, the government has very little to do with the price difference.

I don't own a Prius (yet), but when my current car finally gives up, my plan is to import one from the States


To get somewhat back on topic, London (Ontario) has a good half dozen or more smart cars crawling around the streets covered with advertising. Many local businesses seem to have noticed that they draw stares when driving by, and took advantage of that... The most noticable ones are the Red Bull one (the memory's a bit foggy, it might be a red bull mini) that has a giant red bull can on the roof nearly as big as the car itself, and the local condo conglomerate (transglobe realty?) that has the toilet on the roof of the smart with the slogan "a throne of your own".

 

Well I drove a Smart for Two on Friday and was quite impressed! I drove a Passion Coupe and a Passion Convertible. Each drive was about 2 miles and consisted of a secondary road, a bumpy side street, another secondary road, and then an on-ramp to a state highway and back to the start.

The car is quite a bit bigger than the first generation car. It still has the same proportions but is bigger in every dimension. According the the Smart representative it is 8 inches longer than the first generation car but still 4 feet shorter than a MINI.

Exterior: Good fit and finish, nice paint, small body gaps.

Interior: Your basic economy car interior. Lots of plastic. It is definitely not to the standards of a Mercedes or VW but then again it starts at $11,590. I would say the interior is on par with the Prius which is to say it is on the low side of average.

Ergonomics: It is HUGE inside. When you test drive the car they have the seat all the way back to start. I'm 5'10" and couldn't touch the pedals! The is also a lot of storage room behind the seat. (8 cubic feet to the window or 12 cubic feet if you stack to the roof. The passenger seat folds flat for longer items like golf clubs or skis. I didn't like having the tachometer in the middle of the dash but besides that the driving layout was good.

Mileage: The car has not completed EPA testing yet so no one would give me a straight answer. The best I got was, "The car is designed to achieve greater than 40 mpg combined on the 2008 EPA standard".

Performance: I was very surprised at how peppy the car is. The rep said it goes 0-60 in about 10 seconds and that feels about right. The brakes were also very responsive with good feel.

Ride / Handling: Surprisingly good. It had a crisp, firm suspension with very little body roll. I did not have a top heavy feel that I expected. The only time I noticed the short wheelbase was a spot were new pavement stopped with a sharp edge that was about 2" high. If you like your cars with a European style responsive suspension you would like the Smart. If you like the floaty, numb suspension of most American and Toyota cars you won't like the Smart. Or to put it another way, if you think the Prius handles good you probably think the Smart Car's suspension is too firm.

Manual-matic: I didn't like the transmission when I drove the first car. It took at least a second to upshift and downshift between gears. This test drive I was driving slowly, accelerating slowly, and just getting a feel for the car. On the second test ride my Smart "Co-Driver" keep encouraging me to put the peddle down and go! Driving like this with hard acceleration the transmission shifted much quicker, maybe 1/4 second. It also downshifted quicker. When I was braking hard for the turn back off the highway it dropped 3 gears, blip, blip, blip with no problem. It may be that the transmission adjusts it's response to how you are driving.

All in all I was very impressed. Electronic Stability Program, ABS, 4 Airbags, >40 mpg for $11,600 or $12,200 if you add A/C for $600. That is a lot of mpg for the money. I may look into getting one next year depending on availability, what the actual EPA figures turn out to be, and how much my TDI is worth.

For a comparison of of other cars I may consider:

The MINI is $19,200 for an extra 12 cubic feet of cargo room (seat folded down, since no sane adult would ride in the back of a MINI) and it only gets 31 mpg combined and requires premium fuel.

The Yaris Hatch only $12,815 and has about the same cargo room as the MINI but only gets 32 mpg combined.

The Accent SE is $14,574 and has about 3 cubic feet more cargo room than the MINI but only gets 29 mpg combined.

So basically for me it would come down to a trade-off of cargo room or fuel mileage. Since I would be using this car as a single person commuter I think the Smart would be about perfect.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Sep 9 2007, 10:51 PM) [snapback]509862[/snapback]</div>

Yes it was the 1.0L gasoline engine rated at 71 HP. The Smart representative said that both the U.S. and Canada will only get 71 HP gasoline engine for the 2nd generation cars. Did you drive the 1st or 2nd generation?

From looking at the Smart UK site it looks like the following engines are available worldwide:

1.0L / 61 HP / 4.7L/100km (50.0 US mpg)
1.0L / 71 HP / 4.7L/100km (50.0 US mpg)
1.0L Turbo / 84 HP / 4.9L/100km (48.0 US mpg)
0.8L CDI / 45 HP / 3.3L/100km (71.3 US mpg)

The fuel economy numbers are for the EU combined cycle. To me that is promising that the US car will have a combined number in the mid-40's. I do find it strange that the 71HP and 61HP engines have the same fuel economy listed.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Sep 10 2007, 12:31 AM) [snapback]509896[/snapback]</div>

I got the numbers for the gasoline engine from the UK website. The numbers for the CDI came from the Swedish website. Those are the numbers for the 2nd generation CDI.

It may be a difference between Canadian and EU test procedures or the new CDI might just be that much better.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jhinton @ Jun 25 2007, 09:17 PM) [snapback]467974[/snapback]</div>

There are plenty of cars that are rear engined, most of them are simply in more expensive price classes.

Actually, rear engined cars have a propensity to be harder to control by a novice in certain emergency situations. They are "rear heavy" which makes oversteer easier to induce and its much harder for a novice, or even a seasoned but untrained driver to correct for. Stability programs will help a lot, but not completely.

As for safety, there's absolutely no data to support the idea that a rear engined car is safer than a front engined car in a collision. The crash dynamics of the car are designed around the engine, and its just not really a factor in crush engineering.

But this is only employed to correct for safety issues that are caused by the Smart's size. In a normal sized car this is not neccisary.

Thats how almost all modern seatbelt systems work, nothing special there.

Might have been pioneered by Mercedes (most safety devices are), but all modern cars have engine mounts that are designed to let the engine drop and slide under the car when neccisary in an accident.

We'll see. Not my kids.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jhinton @ Jun 25 2007, 09:17 PM) [snapback]467974[/snapback]</div>

There are plenty of cars that are rear engined, most of them are simply in more expensive price classes.

Actually, rear engined cars have a propensity to be harder to control by a novice in certain emergency situations. They are "rear heavy" which makes oversteer easier to induce and its much harder for a novice, or even a seasoned but untrained driver to correct for. Stability programs will help a lot, but not completely.

As for safety, there's absolutely no data to support the idea that a rear engined car is safer than a front engined car in a collision. The crash dynamics of the car are designed around the engine, and its just not really a factor in crush engineering.

But this is only employed to correct for safety issues that are caused by the Smart's size. In a normal sized car this is not neccisary.

Thats how almost all modern seatbelt systems work, nothing special there.

Might have been pioneered by Mercedes (most safety devices are), but all modern cars have engine mounts that are designed to let the engine drop and slide under the car when neccisary in an accident.

We'll see. Not my kids.

 

I've seen the fifth gear crash video, doesn't mean anything. They also ceded at the end that the passengers in the Smart would surely have been dead.