Effects of winter driving on Tesla Model S range

i believe it. i only got 12 miles tonight, at an average of 15 mph.

 

Possibly -25 f tonight where I am now. High mpg not really a liklihood. At about 34 mpg now at 150 miles.

Oh, add in winds of 30 mph and you'll need a friendly hugger.

 

Length of trips will also play a large role.
In three winters now, we have found we loose about 30% range over the a December, January, February months. This is with sporadic preheating.

Of course, if we were making road trips in the winter, where we actually needed the range, we would probably be closer to 20-15% range loss.

 

Regular ICE cars lose significant range in the winter as well by way of crappy mpg resulting in reduced range. Just saying.

But yeah interesting info on the teslas. Thanks for posting.

 

Exactly! Show me one car that doesn't suffer MPG decrease in winter.

Same goes with Top Gear's mocking Tesla Roadster not achieving the factory rated range: show me one car that has the same MPG racing on the race track vs. normal road driving.

 

[/QUOTE]Exactly! Show me one car that doesn't suffer MPG decrease in winter.[/QUOTE]

Only if you were able to be "on my dreams".......

 

Exactly! Show me one car that doesn't suffer MPG decrease in winter.[/QUOTE]

Only if you were able to be "on my dreams".......[/QUOTE]
Mirai? Lol what would happen....tailpipe freeze over ?

 

My winter mileage rarely dropped in any of my ICE vehicles unless I did extended warmups or idling. On my long trips they were essentially the same year round. You can easily lose 2-5 mpg on an ICE vehicle by warming them up in the driveway, typically what those with car starters do, never had one myself. My old 2004 Corolla had daily commutes 100 miles round trip 12 months a year. The mileage ranged from 35 to 38 all year long. For 140,000 miles it was very predictable, same with my old Avalon and the Camry.

 

That was why I was confused when we saw the reports mentioning the Mirai didn't loos range in the winter.
That and the people that don't think the winter affects their mpg (unless by winter temps they mean 50 degrees).

It is simply a matter of physics.
Air becomes more dense in the winter, leading to more drag.
Rolling resistance through snow (even just a little) also goes up.

Both of these factors lead to a loss of efficiency. In our Prii, this lead to about 20% mpg reduction (52-42).
In EVs it leads to higher Watts/Mile, which translates into less range.

Because battery management and heat are powered by the battery, in our case, this leads to an additional 10% loss.

Think of it this way.
In an ICE vehicle you are loosing 70-80% efficiency by making more heat than you would ever use, and noise, year round.
In an EV you are loosing about 10% efficiency by making heat only when you need it.

 

Rolling resistance of tires is higher just due to cold temperature alone.
It takes about 15-minutes for the rubber to warm up to steady state, if you are doing lab studies on LRR.
But LRR is just one thing that gets worse in the cold, not the whole explanation.

 

On long trips where most of the drive isn't with the ICE and transmission below operating temperature, the fuel economy shouldn't drop much from summer. Then it is just the winter blend, denser air, higher tire resistance, and likely lower tire pressure just dragging down the efficiency. It's still there, and many have shorter commutes than 50 mile one way; so they are dealing with warm up times over a larger percentage of the trip.

I'll use the remote start as I walk out the door in the morning, perhaps also in the evening on a freezing day. The extra minute of idling seems to help with warm up. Most turn on the car and wait until the cabin is comfy before getting in. That really sucks down the fuel.

EVs take another hit because they don't have excess heat for the cabin.

There was actual reports of this?
I remember reports of the FCVs still operating in the cold without ill effects beyond the expected efficiency penalty.

 

lol. In those conditions the ice turns on and heats the battery ;-) As long as you have gas you have range. Short trips in those conditions burn more gas. Pure ev range can not be determined (its like dividing by 0) but blended consumption (gasoline + electricity) should take less of a hit on long trips. If the trip is short, why worry about decreased range in the tesla. You likely will love that you can preheat the car, and get in a warm car on a cold day.

 

The operative pigeon hole here is "long trips". I don't think the ICE & complete warm ups is the thing - but rather short trips / no EBH / no grill blocking etc. There have been a couple sub zero Alaska prius drivers report sub 30mpg averages, when their trips are only 5mile-10mile averages.
.

 

Should have quoted the post that inspired my response. 50 mile one way commute is a long trip.
Did those Alaskan Prius owners do the severe winterizing to their cars; engine block and battery heaters?

 

Not surprising.
I would like to see the same study for ICE vehicles.
While they have more waste heat that anyone would use, the efficiency still drops due to other factors.