Electricity cost more than gasoline these days.

Discussion in 'Prime Main Forum (2017-Current)' started by CaliforniaPrius, Jul 19, 2016.

  1. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    easy, they raised the hatch floor 3" to get an extra gallon of gas.
     
  2. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Is that counting empty space for air channels?
     
  3. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    If not, it would be a factor of 10.
     
  4. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Are you comparing batteries with the same chemistry, life expectancy, and resistance to self combustion?

    Lithium Iron Phosphate cells have always rated poorly for volumetric energy density compared to other Li-Ion variants, but came with other benefits.
     
  5. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    These are Lithium Ion.
     
  6. Redpoint5

    Redpoint5 Senior Member

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    LiFePO4 is a type of Lithium Ion battery, just as a turbo charger is a type of super charger.
     
  7. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    emerging? The drought may very well just be getting started. Even as more & more people move here to Cali, you see more & more water users, & the big dam levels like Lake Mead continue to drop. No water can swiftly become no hydroelectric power. And guess where the electric rates head for - then ... Yes, the stratosphere.

    that's so true ... and that means the OP's heading is dishonest & 'misleading' , right?
    Cheep Gas, Less than electric Power? | PriusChat

    .
     
    #87 hill, Oct 11, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2016
  8. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    These are not. Toyota quoted 3.7V per cell, not 3.2V.
     
  9. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    That is a large family of chemistries. Iron Phosphate, Cobalt, Manganese, and some other materials can go along with the Lithium, producing different characteristics and tradeoffs.
     
  10. MikeDee

    MikeDee Senior Member

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    If you are burning gasoline in a PZEV car like the Prius, you are putting out less pollution than if that power came from a coal and maybe oil fired plant. Forget nuclear too, after Fukushima, and they still haven't figured out how to safely dispose of the waste. When Diablo Canyon closes, California will be safer.

    In my opinion, electric companies are worse than the oil companies. Electric rates seem to always go up.
     
    #90 MikeDee, Oct 12, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2016
  11. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    Electricity is far less volitle and thus far more predictable. Real gasoline prices.png Real electricity rates.png
     
  12. MikeDee

    MikeDee Senior Member

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    You're right about predictable. Where I live the electricity rates always go up. I can't remember when they ever went down.
     
  13. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    If the electric is coal heavy.
    The regions with the higher populations and purchasing the most plug ins in the US aren't coal heavy, and the plug ins likely pollute less than a Prius.
    In those coal heavy regions, a plug in pollutes less than the typical car, and plug ins seem more attractive to more people than the Prius.
     
  14. Lee Jay

    Lee Jay Senior Member

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    Look at the real prices over a similar time frame. Both of them are about stable over a long time frame, but the volatility in gasoline prices is nearly double that of electricity.

    These are inflation-adjusted (real) costs, and note that electricity is cheaper now than it was in 1960.
     
  15. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Worse than Valdez ? ... or deep water horizon -

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    For many, there are lots of different ways to define 'worse' - beyond one's monthly utility bill

    Maybe folks don't mind oily tasting shrimp, fish, waterfoul etc.

    As for coal;
    What is U.S. electricity generation by energy source? - FAQ - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)
    These ratios show how fast coal fired generators are being retired. Not too many years ago the coal generated power ratio was over ½. It's falling pretty quick. Plain & simple - cleaning up filth is more costly (in the short run) than cleaner power.
    .
     
    #95 hill, Oct 12, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2016
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  16. MikeDee

    MikeDee Senior Member

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    So you are saying that Chernobyl and Fukushima weren't worse than these oil disasters? I disagree.


    iPhone ? Pro
     
  17. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Don't let other countries' poorly designed cheapskate nuke failsafe shortcuts undermine US safety .... even 3 mile island off-gassing was injury free - & that was what .... 4 decades ago? And more & more of our reactors are coming off line. Just saying - even that's getting better.
     
    #97 hill, Oct 12, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2016
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  18. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Besides the amount fuel used by a nuclear plant, and the waste after it is used, is likely a couple of magnitudes less than the amount of petroleum we use for cars, and coal for electric. Which gives lower chances for some type of accident.
     
  19. Redpoint5

    Redpoint5 Senior Member

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    I disagree with nearly every point here.

    Perhaps there is a point about coal sourced electricity being more polluting per mile than burning the gasoline in a Prius, but at least sequestering pollutants is much easier at a single large point of production rather than millions of smaller sources.

    Nuclear is both safer and cleaner than nearly every other method of power generation. People die in the construction of hydro dams, coal mining is hazardous, and many more people die from the health effects of coal pollution than nuclear power production.

    Just because there have been a couple accidents involving nuclear power generation over decades doesn't mean it poses an unusually large risk to health and safety.

    ... and my electric rates went down and then has held steady over the past couple years. Most of my power is hydro generated.
     
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  20. MikeDee

    MikeDee Senior Member

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    Near miss at Fukushima is a warning for U.S., panel says | Science | AAAS

    At U.S. nuclear plants, spent fuel is equally vulnerable. It is for the most part densely packed in pools, heightening the fire risk if cooling systems were to fail. NRC has estimated that a major fire in a U.S. spent fuel pool would displace, on average, 3.4 million people from an area larger than New Jersey. “We’re talking about trillion-dollar consequences,” says panelist Frank von Hippel, a nuclear security expert at Princeton University.
     
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