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Emissions and Fuel-Cost Savings of Electric Cars

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by samlal, Apr 16, 2012.

  1. ProximalSuns

    ProximalSuns Senior Member

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    Facetious comments don't travel well via online text messaging and using that abomination of the internet, the smiley face, is against the laws of god and man.

    2010 Prius Hybrid 50 mpg to 2012 Volvo Hybrid 124 mpg seems to compete with Moore's law formulation.

    Combining all electric with Diesel with hybrid with AWD with performance has several interesting features to some people. Peak sales of AWD hybrids show a market of about 60,000 vehicles a year.
     
  2. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    Right, and they do not include power plant emissions in EV driving.
     
  3. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    It does not, you are comparing apples and oranges.

    Trend an EV from Circa 1910 running Pb batteries, to the Volvo for something more realistic.
     
  4. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    ProxSuns,

    How much of the $75k price tag do you have saved up already ?
    Or are you planning to walk into the dealership in 2015 with your $2k of piggy bank money from gas savings with expectations that Volvo will finance the rest ?
     
  5. ProximalSuns

    ProximalSuns Senior Member

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    I read it as the 124 mpg was operating in full hybrid mode, not depleting the battery and then running on Diesel.

    Charging the battery in the garage and then sallying forth. The 40 mpg(?) Diesel combined with a large battery pack capable of substantial full EV operation is likely how they come up with the calculation.

    What's the mileage of the Prius if the battery is fully depleted?

    My 2015 car will likely be Lexus 450H/Highlander AWD with 50 mile EV range and 40 mpg in full hybrid mode. Out of the garage and off to the ski slopes. Of course if the 2012 Prius/NokianWG takes on all snow challenges, I might stay with FWD.

    The interesting calc will be do I get higher overall mileage doing the first 50 in all EV and depleting the batter or if I do the entire trip (120 miles) in hybrid mode. And will my ski resort offer plug in parking? I'd pay an extra $1K plus cost of electricity to reserve one of the plug-in spots.
     
  6. ProximalSuns

    ProximalSuns Senior Member

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    Versus the $60K Lexus AWD Hybrid with no EV and lower MPG? I'm ready to go since price/performance is equal.

    As with all Prius drivers, it's not about the money it's about not using oil, not generating green house gases.

    My first trip back from Saudi Arabia in late 70's. First thing I did was buy a Rabbit Diesel 40 mpg...the patriotic thing to do. We could see the oil wars were coming.

    I like Diesels so the Volvo V60 is the perfect car for me. Of course, I try to Buy American when I can so Tesla's in the running.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    No, the 124 MPG(e) is a blended result of battery depletion and diesel use for a limited range.

    A 40 (US) MPG diesel emits about (23,000/2.2) / (40*1.6) = 163 grams/km CO2
    So the blend is about 10:3 EV to Diesel
     
  8. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    No, not vs anything. How much of the $75k this Volvo costs do you have saved already ?
     
  9. ProximalSuns

    ProximalSuns Senior Member

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    Volvo says differently and considering you claimed the V60 wouldn't exist for years as Volvo ships them out the door this year, I'm inclined to go with Volvo.

    HYBRID Mode: This is the car's default mode upon start-up in which both the rear-wheel drive electric motor and the front-wheel drive 215 horsepower turbodiesel engine work together. In this mode Volvo claims the car can return 124 miles per gallon and emit less than 49 grams of CO2 per kilometer.
     
  10. ProximalSuns

    ProximalSuns Senior Member

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    In that case, same as my Escape Hybrid and my Prius 3/4, 100% saved already. Fired up, ready to go.
     
  11. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    Volvo says what I say. You have reading comprehension problems.

    I said the Volvo plug-in is vaporware. How many are on the roads, TODAY?
     
  12. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    Then put in your order for European delivery of the first car out of the factory.

    What are you waiting for ?
     
  13. massparanoia

    massparanoia Active Member

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    Which diesel are you quoting here?
     
  14. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    If the questions from many well long standing members are being ignored and twisted, does that mean we have a troll on board?

    Well, release is late 2012 in Europe actually, though I do remain cynical until I see one on the road. Unlikely to make it to the USA though, being a diesel.

    A similar non plug in diesel hybrid has already been released in the UK in RHD form - the Peugeot 3008 hybrid priced at £26,000 (inc 20% sales tax). That makes the plug in side of the Volvo V60 very expensive at £47,000. That's an extra £21,000 for the plug in battey and bits n bobs! That's the price of a UK Prius.
     
  15. massparanoia

    massparanoia Active Member

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    Oh I'm sorry, Lord Cabbie much apologies.

    Mr. SageBrush sir, how many Volvo V60 hybrids are on the road?

    A jaded member of the forum, is calling a new member a troll when he asks a legitimate question. Get off it dude.
     
  16. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Reading through the links, I believe Grumpy is about right.

    Volvo is claiming a 1200 km (746 mile) range for EV and diesel combined. With a 30 mile EV range, that must mean about 716 miles on diesel.

    From the Volvo site (thanks you ProximalSuns for the starting internet links), this car as a 67.5 liter (17.8 gallon) fuel tank. A slight bit of arithmetic produces 40.1 mpg in diesel mode. Euro scale, of course, not EPA.

    BTW, Prox's Volvo press release is 14 months old. Is anything newer available?
     
  17. massparanoia

    massparanoia Active Member

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    40 mpg for a 215hp all wheel drive car is still pretty good. That beats the volt and karma when they have their ice running.
     
  18. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    A new member? Indeed - possibly.

    I have looked through all your posts since March this year when you joined and most are confrontational against existing members.

    Jaded? Me? probably.

    But I know a troll when I see one. ;)
     
  19. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    The topic was plug-ins
     
  20. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    The thought occurred to me too, but I think he and proxSuns are just distasteful mixtures of arrogance, ignorance, and stupidity.

    Troll cousins, if you please.